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CSU and Wyoming in Separate Conferences

I’m not following. Every FCS school has sports that are already competing in Division 1. FCS is Division 1!! It’s only in football where Division 1 is further subdivided.

The MWC will have to add at least 4 schools when all is said and done. There are only a few current FBS schools that would even come to this conference given its future makeup. Bringing up FCS teams is going to become a necessity of survival.

We are entering a future where the MWC is now the lowest rung of FBS football. Less media value than the MAC. Beggars can’t be choosers. This is the new reality. And it happened on Burman’s watch with what does not appear to be a plan in place at all.
Does Burman bear more responsibility than the AD's from UNM, USU, UNLV, SJSU, HAW, NEV, or AFA?

What are any of those AD's supposed to be doing that they are not? Is there a phone number at the Pac12 that they just didn't call? I guess you can say that we just sucked competitively so nobody wanted us....that didn't seem to carry much weight when it came to CSU.
 
Does Burman bear more responsibility than the AD's from UNM, USU, UNLV, SJSU, HAW, NEV, or AFA?

What are any of those AD's supposed to be doing that they are not? Is there a phone number at the Pac12 that they just didn't call? I guess you can say that we just sucked competitively so nobody wanted us....that didn't seem to carry much weight when it came to CSU.
Remove AF and UNM. AF is different. UNM is in 7 years on their current. Also different than wyo.

The rest of the schools came out of fcs to fbs. An advancement. Burman oversaw a great regression. Quit giving him a pass because "it's a tough job".
 
No pass given... I'm on record with advocating hiring these guys and firing them. Fire Burman... Give the next AD two or three years to get us into an AQ conference wash rinse repeat. It would satisfy the fans bloodlust and probably cost less to hire up and comers

Same with coaches... No chip by year 3? Gone!
 
No pass given... I'm on record with advocating hiring these guys and firing them. Fire Burman... Give the next AD two or three years to get us into an AQ conference wash rinse repeat. It would satisfy the fans bloodlust and probably cost less to hire up and comers

Same with coaches... No chip by year 3? Gone!
Quit being a drama queen. This horrendous hiring but is 1 example of Burman's shortcomings. 1 simple change. Use a hiring committee. His decisions fail more often than not.

Bronco, love him or hate him, would have this team firing.
 
Quit being a drama queen. This horrendous hiring but is 1 example of Burman's shortcomings. 1 simple change. Use a hiring committee. His decisions fail more often than not.

Bronco, love him or hate him, would have this team firing.
I'm exaggerating here but not by a lot. The way I see it... Changing personnel at the top is the only lever that Wyoming is in control of. No population center or big airport or attractive media market or whatever else the powers that be and recruits care about. Spend as much time and resources that you can manage on finding the next guy.... But when it too does not work out .. Move on quick.
 
I'm exaggerating here but not by a lot. The way I see it... Changing personnel at the top is the only lever that Wyoming is in control of. No population center or big airport or attractive media market or whatever else the powers that be and recruits care about. Spend as much time and resources that you can manage on finding the next guy.... But when it too does not work out .. Move on quick.
We're known to move on quick? News to me.

This football season. Is self inflicted due to nepotism. My opinion on the latter. Nonetheless, without a search, it was clearly self inflicted.

Media market and all the rest of the excuse machine doesn't give reason to a very obvious mistake.
 
We're known to move on quick? News to me.

This football season. Is self inflicted due to nepotism. My opinion on the latter. Nonetheless, without a search, it was clearly self inflicted.

Media market and all the rest of the excuse machine doesn't give reason to a very obvious mistake.
I'm advocating to move on quick... Did you not understand that?

The other things are simply observations of things outside of the university's control.... Not worth worrying about since they aren't changing anytime soon if ever.
 
I'm advocating to move on quick... Did you not understand that?

The other things are simply observations of things outside of the university's control.... Not worth worrying about since they aren't changing anytime soon if ever.
Or don't let nepotism drive hires. Either that or the ad is just bad at making coaching decisions. Either way tells you how the ad at lowly wyo can be a big part of the problem regardless of all the external excuses.
 
I'm exaggerating here but not by a lot. The way I see it... Changing personnel at the top is the only lever that Wyoming is in control of. No population center or big airport or attractive media market or whatever else the powers that be and recruits care about. Spend as much time and resources that you can manage on finding the next guy.... But when it too does not work out .. Move on quick.
You take the CU CSU game out of the equation, CSU has less TV eyes last year than Wyo did. Most were watching the CU game to see CU.
 
You take the CU CSU game out of the equation, CSU has less TV eyes last year than Wyo did. Most were watching the CU game to see CU.
We can point that out all we want to... They are still the ones leaving us behind and will have a structural advantage of a better media deal soon. People with money on the line are not lining up to bet on Wyoming... Quite the opposite in fact.
 
We can point that out all we want to... They are still the ones leaving us behind and will have a structural advantage of a better media deal soon. People with money on the line are not lining up to bet on Wyoming... Quite the opposite in fact.
So you are saying it isn’t the # of viewers. Corruption then………
 
So you are saying it isn’t the # of viewers. Corruption then………
Every list out there that talks about possible expansion targets has had CSU floating around in them.... Wyoming is never ever mentioned. I had always assumed it was because Wyoming is stuck economically in the past and has not grown like everywhere else has since the 80s but maybe there is corruption as well.
 
Oredigger and I argued about state restrictions on dei. I argued it wouldn't matter much in the long run. I'm not at all saying it's the case but I could see that as 1 (among others) of the reasons schools like wsu and osu don't want WYO. Both of those 2 emphasize dei quite a bit. Let's not devolve the thread into merits (or lack thereof) of dei but more that in today's hyperpolarized environment, our positions might be viewed negatively. Oredigger, I was wrong on that. It might be a bigger problem than I thought in this realignment mess.
 
Up until CSU got included in with BSU, SDSU, and Fresno in the latest conference re-shuffling, Wyoming fans could plausibly believe that performance on the gridiron could be our saving grace. We comforted ourselves by pointing out that UW has a much larger endowment than CSU, that nobody in Denver actually cares about them, and other less salient reasons. The sentiment seemed to be that as long as we dominated the lambs on the gridiron, Wyoming would be just fine...after all, all of the programs that jump to more competitive conferences are more competitive on the field right? As lists were endlessly generated that had no mention of Wyoming and mentioned (however tangentially) CSU as a possible candidate for "fill-in-the-blank" conference, Wyoming fans mocked the deluded ewe fans who thought they "deserved" to be in any conference that was better than whatever conference Wyoming is in.

The news that CSU was leaving Wyoming behind has laid bare the fallacy of all of that discussion. Was it about airport size? Media perception? Football success? DEI? It was all of it and none of it...It's like the stock market....perception matters. The fact that Wyoming's name was never ever mentioned (if it was, I missed it) in conference expansion candidate discussion was very telling. The roots of this situation are deep and layered....whatever has gone on in the last 10-15 or so years in Laramie has not helped us, but the fact is the foundations of this disaster for Wyoming collegiate athletics stretches back to Lee Moon's tenure. I don't know all of the causes...but a 10-2 top 25 Wyoming team got left out of bowl consideration in 1996...many, even many in national media, criticized that. They pointed out that if it were about excellence and rewarding excellence, Wyoming should have been bowl-bound. They were right...it's not about excellence. That was the evidence that the shift had already happened and we Wyomingites didn't notice it. Being good is good...but if you just have an audience, or, in the case of CSU, the possibility of an audience...people will write checks and invite you to the club. College football is a private club....It is a media driven phenomenon. Wyoming will always settle near the bottom of that game. When it comes to football...southern smaller schools now pretty much would dominate Wyoming in terms of eyeballs and in ability to win games. Who's fault is all of this? It's not an individual. Our state, that many of us were raised in and are all fiercely loyal to is collectively to blame. If we want Wyoming to look like it did when we were little tykes and we also want UW athletics to be above the likes of NDAK, Mont, Mont St...we are desiring incompatible things. This is deeper than athletics...athletics is just a canary in the modern socio-economic coal mine.
 
Up until CSU got included in with BSU, SDSU, and Fresno in the latest conference re-shuffling, Wyoming fans could plausibly believe that performance on the gridiron could be our saving grace. We comforted ourselves by pointing out that UW has a much larger endowment than CSU, that nobody in Denver actually cares about them, and other less salient reasons. The sentiment seemed to be that as long as we dominated the lambs on the gridiron, Wyoming would be just fine...after all, all of the programs that jump to more competitive conferences are more competitive on the field right? As lists were endlessly generated that had no mention of Wyoming and mentioned (however tangentially) CSU as a possible candidate for "fill-in-the-blank" conference, Wyoming fans mocked the deluded ewe fans who thought they "deserved" to be in any conference that was better than whatever conference Wyoming is in.

The news that CSU was leaving Wyoming behind has laid bare the fallacy of all of that discussion. Was it about airport size? Media perception? Football success? DEI? It was all of it and none of it...It's like the stock market....perception matters. The fact that Wyoming's name was never ever mentioned (if it was, I missed it) in conference expansion candidate discussion was very telling. The roots of this situation are deep and layered....whatever has gone on in the last 10-15 or so years in Laramie has not helped us, but the fact is the foundations of this disaster for Wyoming collegiate athletics stretches back to Lee Moon's tenure. I don't know all of the causes...but a 10-2 top 25 Wyoming team got left out of bowl consideration in 1996...many, even many in national media, criticized that. They pointed out that if it were about excellence and rewarding excellence, Wyoming should have been bowl-bound. They were right...it's not about excellence. That was the evidence that the shift had already happened and we Wyomingites didn't notice it. Being good is good...but if you just have an audience, or, in the case of CSU, the possibility of an audience...people will write checks and invite you to the club. College football is a private club....It is a media driven phenomenon. Wyoming will always settle near the bottom of that game. When it comes to football...southern smaller schools now pretty much would dominate Wyoming in terms of eyeballs and in ability to win games. Who's fault is all of this? It's not an individual. Our state, that many of us were raised in and are all fiercely loyal to is collectively to blame. If we want Wyoming to look like it did when we were little tykes and we also want UW athletics to be above the likes of NDAK, Mont, Mont St...we are desiring incompatible things. This is deeper than athletics...athletics is just a canary in the modern socio-economic coal mine.
Holy hell, 307. This is a brilliant post!!! Tough medicine - but truth. WY football is a microcosm of the plight of the state - we hate change, we hate big thinking, we only want enough jobs and opportunities for our kids to stay and everyone else can piss up a rope and stay out. They are. Our growth is anemic compared to every other state in the region. Our industrial base is in decline. And what do we do? We double down on mediocrity and bassackwards thinking. And we pout, glower and flounder when someone picks the ugly girl caked with makeup (CSU) for the dance and leaves our ugly, ignorant carcass at home knitting in the attic. The first step in recovery is admitting when you have a problem. Will we? Or will we just blame everyone else?
 
Wyoming definitely had a chance to be considered for other conferences despite lower viewership/smaller potential market, but it would've required a LOT more than a few middling years of football. CSU can get away with being crappy football-wise because they have a potential market, and they have a school willing to spend money.

Bohl was essentially .500 during his tenure in Laramie. Respectable considering what he was working with, but not enough to truly open eyes. None of his teams more than briefly touched the top 25 rankings, nor did the team consistently fight for the conference championship.

Had Wyoming reached Boise levels performance-wise for a half dozen straight years, we'd be having a very different conversation now.
 
If we had Boise like success for a dozen years we would have picked up many casual observers and our media viewership would have been viewed much differently. Boise absolutely gets many casual observers because of their past success and because they are always competitive against the p4 teams even when they lose making it an interesting game.
 
If we had Boise like success for a dozen years we would have picked up many casual observers and our media viewership would have been viewed much differently. Boise absolutely gets many casual observers because of their past success and because they are always competitive against the p4 teams even when they lose making it an interesting game.
It can’t be viewership. Wyomings viewership was higher than goat Us and other MW schools. Maybe it’s because Laramie doesn’t have a Costco.
 

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