NIL at P4 per KW

[ragtimejoe1]

https://brobible.com/sports/article/utah-football-nil-money-cost-roster-kyle-whittingham/

I wish we'd see something like this for g5 level. Pretty good read regardless.

 

[LanderPoke]

If Utah takes 7 million, then it seems like we need to be at like 1 million to just keep the status quo of .500 conference records.

 

[307bball]

Some confirming tidbits from that article:

"Although Whittingham is a great coach with an ability to develop unpolished, not-as-highly ranked athletes into stars, he can only go as far as his roster lets him."

"A college football program cannot succeed in the modern era without a successful NIL collective. There is a direct correlation between finances and talent acquisition. Schools with a greater monetary backing are able to offer more money to top talent. Top talent is more likely to commit if it is being well compensated."

Much like the great and powerful Oz... or the myth of Santa Claus....once the curtain is pulled back, there is no return. College football fans have been able to deceive themselves forever that the "amateur" label and the NCAA rules would keep the playing field level. Well...we see now what it's going to take. Even while the curtain was in place, broadcast companies bestowed immense wealth and exposure on their chosen conferences and teams giving them a "reputational" and visibility advantage with recruiting that the non-chosen programs increasingly could not compete with. In the pre-90's world, playing at Wyoming or any other "lessor" school wasn't a lot different from a player experience standpoint than playing for a big time program. Beginning in the '90s and catching fire after 2000, that could no longer be said. To play for a school like Wyoming is to ply your trade in relative obscurity compared to the big guys. The Ubiquity of social media made things even worse...want followers? don't go to a place with no fans! All this to say.....NIL has laid this advantage bare in economic terms but it was already happening.

What about the MWC (or whatever conference Wyoming ends up in)? When it comes to these factors ..... the majority of Wyoming's conference mates are in the same boat. Interestingly, Wyoming is actually a well run program with greater or comparable success within that majority....but that isn't what we want....we want to dominate. I can't remember who it was that said the bar should be a conference championship every 5 years or so. That would give us more conference championships than anybody except for Boise St if that had been the case since the year 2000. I would definitely call that dominant. But how do you compete with them now? See the above quote about modern programs not succeeding without successful NIL collectives....Boise St will always have that over us. SDSU, UNLV, and Fresno will as well. It's great that we are the cream of the "non-NIL" MWC teams, but if you want to win titles....I don't know how it's going to happen.

 

[MrTitleist]

Speaking of NIL... I don't know if anyone of you know anything about 1WYO, or who's running it, but I would be very curious to know how they're doing. Their social media is a virtual ghost town.. I never really see anything from them. I don't know if they don't know how to navigate social media, or if that's on purpose, or how they're getting word out there.

As an example.. during Montana's run through the FCS playoffs and lead-up to the national championship game the Montana NIL collective, Good Ol Grizzlies, was on a social media blitz, getting some more "prominent" members out there rallying the troops so to speak to get money coming in during a prime fundraising opportunity. Excitement around the team was high, good time to capitalize. I think they put together a substantial amount of money.. I heard in the six figure neighborhood. During the same time Wyoming was coming off of a late season blow-out of two team, invited to another bowl game, three'ish weeks between end of season and bowl game, new coach announced and coming in.. prime fundraising opportunity right? The 1WYO social media was dead silent through the vast majority of it. Why no run at getting money coming in during a time of year when there's excitement around the program? It was perplexing to say the least.

 

[OrediggerPoke]

https://brobible.com/sports/article/utah-football-nil-money-cost-roster-kyle-whittingham/

I wish we'd see something like this for g5 level. Pretty good read regardless.

Good read thanks for sharing. The big point for Wyoming is that once we develop the player (which we have to because of our disadvantage), we now are disadvantaged because we have to come up with money to realistically keep the player.

I personally believe (as I’ve stated over and over) $7 million per year to 18-22 year olds to maintain a college football team is nuts and a terrible use of money. There is basically zero tie to actual marketing value.

 

[OrediggerPoke]

If Utah takes 7 million, then it seems like we need to be at like 1 million to just keep the status quo of .500 conference records.

My guess is quite a bit more. $1 million would appear to be bottom of the barrel from the information that has been complied by various persons.

 

[OrediggerPoke]

Speaking of NIL... I don't know if anyone of you know anything about 1WYO, or who's running it, but I would be very curious to know how they're doing. Their social media is a virtual ghost town.. I never really see anything from them. I don't know if they don't know how to navigate social media, or if that's on purpose, or how they're getting word out there.

As an example.. during Montana's run through the FCS playoffs and lead-up to the national championship game the Montana NIL collective, Good Ol Grizzlies, was on a social media blitz, getting some more "prominent" members out there rallying the troops so to speak to get money coming in during a prime fundraising opportunity. Excitement around the team was high, good time to capitalize. I think they put together a substantial amount of money.. I heard in the six figure neighborhood. During the same time Wyoming was coming off of a late season blow-out of two team, invited to another bowl game, three'ish weeks between end of season and bowl game, new coach announced and coming in.. prime fundraising opportunity right? The 1WYO social media was dead silent through the vast majority of it. Why no run at getting money coming in during a time of year when there's excitement around the program? It was perplexing to say the least.

It’s several lawyers. I don’t agree with any of this. The theory is to ‘partner’ with non-profits and potentially claim a charitable tax deduction for the NIL donation.

https://www.on3.com/nil/collectives/1wyo-269/

 

[307bball]

https://brobible.com/sports/article/utah-football-nil-money-cost-roster-kyle-whittingham/

I wish we'd see something like this for g5 level. Pretty good read regardless.

Good read thanks for sharing. The big point for Wyoming is that once we develop the player (which we have to because of our disadvantage), we now are disadvantaged because we have to come up with money to realistically keep the player.

I personally believe (as I’ve stated over and over) $7 million per year to 18-22 year olds to maintain a college football team is nuts and a terrible use of money. There is basically zero tie to actual marketing value.

I personally agree with this. But I'm not sure I would if I was very wealthy. As a person who is not very wealthy...the donations I make need to feel at least somewhat like an investment. I want the university and the State to have top notch facilities and programs so I'll contribute to some of that since I'm connected to it. As you have said...a dollar into the pocket of an athlete that will be on campus for less than half a decade (and maybe just one season) is a "waste". But what If I'm very wealthy? In that case.....maybe I just want to see my university win. In that scenario, it's almost like gambling or some other recreational use of the money. NIL dollars do not help the Schools themselves. They enrich athletes and the people shelling out for them are mostly interested in buying wins...

People who support Wyoming tend to be pretty high on the pragmatic scale (pardon the broad generalization). The very few, very rich Wyoming boosters are probably some of the least likely NIL contributors. I want to be careful not to call those who do contribute to NIL as "dumb"...people can do what they want with their money. I just don't think very many people are writing checks to NIL collectives with any goal other than to get the best athletes on the team they support.

 

[LanderPoke]

If Utah takes 7 million, then it seems like we need to be at like 1 million to just keep the status quo of .500 conference records.

My guess is quite a bit more. $1 million would appear to be bottom of the barrel from the information that has been complied by various persons.

Utah is a top tier team nationally, like top 15. I stand by my numbers. MWC is now a huge step down from Utah anymore

 

[307bball]

My guess is quite a bit more. $1 million would appear to be bottom of the barrel from the information that has been complied by various persons.

Utah is a top tier team nationally, like top 15. I stand by my numbers. MWC is now a huge step down from Utah anymore

With one million...you could probably do everything but a QB. That is pretty much a separate category. If NIL valuations are to be believed, Malachi Nelson (USC to BSU QB transfer) is at just over 800K. I think BSU has two other players Just north of 500K in valuation. If they get just over half of that donated to them...that is pretty much 1 million between just three players.

The MW (outside of BSU) is way behind on this stuff....Fresno, SDSU, and UNLV are trying to keep up with BSU. But Wyoming is behind those who are behind. Fortunately, I think that the effect of coaching, culture, and development will overcome that within the non-BSU group. But it won't overcome the gap the Boise State is creating...

 

[ragtimejoe1]

It's 1982-1983 again with a new variable.

It'll be interesting but the writing is on the wall. The question is: will there be enough money and exposure at our level to continue to drive the NIL egos enough to cause competitive differentiation based on NIL collectives?

I honestly don't know how much it impacts fcs currently, but I'd guess that level of impact is what we'll see long-term.

 

[307bball]

It's 1982-1983 again with a new variable.

What do you mean by that Ragtime?....that era is just outside of my personal recollection.

 

[doreno5]

I still wonder if college football will eventually have to be directly funded by the NFL as a farm system. Right now the NFL is essentially getting its new players trained at the college level without having to pay.

 

[ragtimejoe1]

It's 1982-1983 again with a new variable.

What do you mean by that Ragtime?....that era is just outside of my personal recollection.

The Ivy League schools' success had started to wane in the previous 15-20 years. They were having issues with scholarships for athletes because they only scholarship based on need. Then TV became a bigger deal and I don't recall the exact details but I think Ivy League schools wanted to sign their own deal or something?? Anyway, it all came to a head in 82 or 83. The college football association (or whatever they were called) put in a 17k attendance restriction based on previous 5 years attendance and/or 30k stadium capacity to remain at the top level. DIV 1A was formed and only included 60 (or maybe it was 100--I don't remember) schools. Ivy League schools and several others were forced down to DIV 1AA.

If you look at the p5/g5 designation now almost 30 years ago to now and compare to the 60s-80s and there are some similarities. Schools with big resources are wanting to shed some weigh and capitalize on tv money.

 

[307bball]

What do you mean by that Ragtime?....that era is just outside of my personal recollection.

The Ivy League schools' success had started to wane in the previous 15-20 years. They were having issues with scholarships for athletes because they only scholarship based on need. Then TV became a bigger deal and I don't recall the exact details but I think Ivy League schools wanted to sign their own deal or something?? Anyway, it all came to a head in 82 or 83. The college football association (or whatever they were called) put in a 17k attendance restriction based on previous 5 years attendance and/or 30k stadium capacity to remain at the top level. DIV 1A was formed and only included 60 (or maybe it was 100--I don't remember) schools. Ivy League schools and several others were forced down to DIV 1AA.

If you look at the p5/g5 designation now almost 30 years ago to now and compare to the 60s-80s and there are some similarities. Schools with big resources are wanting to shed some weigh and capitalize on tv money.

Ah ..yes. I don't have personal memory of that but I am aware of that history. It is very similar. I though you were referring to some UW history from those years.

 

[Wyokie]

O.K. Ivy League went down a level in 1982.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/1982_NCAA_Division_I-A_football_season#Conference_changes_and_new_programs

Division I-AA aka FCS got started in 1978.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/1978_NCAA_Division_I-AA_football_season

 

[ragtimejoe1]

O.K. Ivy League went down a level in 1982.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/1982_NCAA_Division_I-A_football_season#Conference_changes_and_new_programs

Division I-AA aka FCS got started in 1978.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/1978_NCAA_Division_I-AA_football_season

True. It was the same pressures causing the div split and ultimately the Ivy League a few years later.

Read this. Eery
https://vault.si.com/vault/1978/01/23/the-ncaa-splits-its-decision

 

[Wyokie]

Read this. Eery
https://vault.si.com/vault/1978/01/23/the-ncaa-splits-its-decision

History just loves to repeat itself. :roll:

 

[TheRealUW]

I still wonder if college football will eventually have to be directly funded by the NFL as a farm system. Right now the NFL is essentially getting its new players trained at the college level without having to pay.

This is interesting to think about.

The current system doesn't make one iota of sense, but it will be very difficult to ever change it because of inertia. In other words, it's just been this way for too long to justify dismantling the current college sports system and rebuilding it into a more traditional privately managed minor league system. The NFL and NBA are very fortunate in this regard.

If we ever did remove minor league football/basketball from our universities, I do wonder if Wyoming would be left in the dark when the minor league system that takes it's place were developed. If the MLB minor league system is any indication, the major league teams tend to put their minor league teams in locations close by. Maybe Wyoming could convince the Broncos or the Nuggets to put a minor league team in Cheyenne? Laramie surely would not be in the running.

 

[Wyokie]

I still wonder if college football will eventually have to be directly funded by the NFL as a farm system. Right now the NFL is essentially getting its new players trained at the college level without having to pay.

This is interesting to think about.

The current system doesn't make one iota of sense, but it will be very difficult to ever change it because of inertia. In other words, it's just been this way for too long to justify dismantling the current college sports system and rebuilding it into a more traditional privately managed minor league system. The NFL and NBA are very fortunate in this regard.

If we ever did remove minor league football/basketball from our universities, I do wonder if Wyoming would be left in the dark when the minor league system that takes it's place were developed. If the MLB minor league system is any indication, the major league teams tend to put their minor league teams in locations close by. Maybe Wyoming could convince the Broncos or the Nuggets to put a minor league team in Cheyenne? Laramie surely would not be in the running.

What about Casper?