What do we do to make sure that doesn't happen again?

[ItSucksToBeACSURam]

Last years team faced had a SOS of -0.04!! They had a negative SOS. Holy shizz. That 00-01 team would have DECIMATED last years team

 

[WestWYOPoke]

Last years team faced had a SOS of -0.04!! They had a negative SOS. Holy shizz. That 00-01 team would have DECIMATED last years team

This. I agree 100%. Double digit win for the 00-01 team.

I've been saying that since last year, last year was a good team, but 00-01 was a great team, IMO a Top 15 team in the country that year.

 

[JimmyDimes]

Hey guys are you ready for this??? I just looked up the stats http://www.sports-reference.com/cbb/schools/wyoming/2002.html" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
That horrible FT shooting Uche actually had a better FT percentage then gulp......Josh Davis!!! Yep Nance over Davis for sure!!! Josh Adams for SURE better then Donta and Jay...FO SHO! :thumb: :thumb: :thumb:

Uche has better stats at some places than Nance.

Through 3 Season Uche averaged:
.554 field goal average
.627 free throw average
763 Total Rebounds (254 per season)
12.0 Points Per Game
8.7 Rebounds Per Game

Final 4 Season Nance Averaged:
.521 field goal average
.771 free throw average (thats a huge difference)
808 total rebounds (202 per season)
11.3 Points Per Game
6.6 Rebounds per game.

I think the stats bear out that Nance was NOT the far superior player. Yes I know, stats don't always tell the whole story and I am not saying Nance wasnt a complete stud because he was, without question. But he would not have started at the 5, over Uche. Uche was much better than given credit for.

Plus, the strength of schedule of Uche's career was a 3.36, Nance's was 2.06. Uche and his teams played significantly harder teams than Nance and his teams.

I love these kind of talks!

Not trying to be a dick...but the only year that matters are their senior years. Nance was a skinny boy when recruited by Shyatt. Uche came in as a highly recruited JC guy.

Here are the senior stats for each:

Nance
http://grfx.cstv.com/photos/schools/wyo/sports/m-baskbl/auto_pdf/2014-15/stats/season_stats_final.pdf" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Uche
http://grfx.cstv.com/photos/schools/wyo/sports/m-baskbl/auto_pdf/2001-2/stats/season_stats_final.pdf" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

You are correct, the 2001-02 team was much better than last years team.

 

[ItSucksToBeACSURam]

Hey guys are you ready for this??? I just looked up the stats http://www.sports-reference.com/cbb/schools/wyoming/2002.html" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
That horrible FT shooting Uche actually had a better FT percentage then gulp......Josh Davis!!! Yep Nance over Davis for sure!!! Josh Adams for SURE better then Donta and Jay...FO SHO! :thumb: :thumb: :thumb:

Uche has better stats at some places than Nance.

Through 3 Season Uche averaged:
.554 field goal average
.627 free throw average
763 Total Rebounds (254 per season)
12.0 Points Per Game
8.7 Rebounds Per Game

Final 4 Season Nance Averaged:
.521 field goal average
.771 free throw average (thats a huge difference)
808 total rebounds (202 per season)
11.3 Points Per Game
6.6 Rebounds per game.

I think the stats bear out that Nance was NOT the far superior player. Yes I know, stats don't always tell the whole story and I am not saying Nance wasnt a complete stud because he was, without question. But he would not have started at the 5, over Uche. Uche was much better than given credit for.

Plus, the strength of schedule of Uche's career was a 3.36, Nance's was 2.06. Uche and his teams played significantly harder teams than Nance and his teams.

I love these kind of talks!

Not trying to be a dick...but the only year that matters are their senior years. Nance was a skinny boy when recruited by Shyatt. Uche came in as a highly recruited JC guy.

Here are the senior stats for each:

Nance
http://grfx.cstv.com/photos/schools/wyo/sports/m-baskbl/auto_pdf/2014-15/stats/season_stats_final.pdf" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Uche
http://grfx.cstv.com/photos/schools/wyo/sports/m-baskbl/auto_pdf/2001-2/stats/season_stats_final.pdf" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

You are correct, the 2001-02 team was much better than last years team.

Not completely true. In their senior seasons, Uche had a better fg% than Nance and played a 3.50 SOS. Nance played a -0.04. That is ridiculous. Uche would have had at least 498 points his senior season too if he played garbage like that. Nance played a fluff senior season, comparatively, and still got whooped in the Total Rebounds category. Playing FAR superior competition Uche averaged 9.6 rebounds a game while Nance was at 7.2. Uche damn near averaged a Double Double his senior season. Nance did not.

 

[CowboyNV]

I was never sold on Shyatt as a "great" head coach. When one looks closely at his record, he has done OK OOC, but poorly in conference. The next few years will be critical.....if we don't have better conference results, I fear his time in Laramie could draw to a close sooner, than later.

You could have stopped at "never sold on Shyatt" and we could have interpreted the rest. It is fine to not like the coach. But you say when one looks closely, his conference record is poor. How close did you look? Win and losses I assume. If you were to look close, you would understand that we have lost key players each of the past 3 years. We lost Luke Martinez for the season after starting 15-0. He was our best player that year and the Pokes were ranked #25 when he kicked a kid in the head. We lost Larry Nance, while in 3rd place and working toward the top of the ranking, two years ago. Last year, prior to winning the MWC tournament (but you want better conference results, not titles if I read correctly) we lost both Nance and Herndon to mono. We didn't lose them for the entire season, but long enough to lose conference games and slip in the standing.

Shyatt isn't going anywhere. His job is secure, so no need to worry about losing him. Next year he returns all but one player from the 4th youngest team in the US. I would expect better results.....as one normally would when all but two players are underclassmen.

We are the reigning MWC champs you freaking whiners!!!!!!

First, I never said I disliked Shyatt. I do remember his first stint here and the way he left the program and thought it was bush league bull shit on his part (you are probably too young to remember or were too young at the time to care). In case you want to review what happened, here are two articles that tell the tale:

http://trib.com/sports/college/wyoming/may-shyatt-sues-uw-to-avoid-buyout/article_84359784-5b06-11e0-b9ce-001cc4c03286.html" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

http://trib.com/sports/college/wyoming/aug-shyatt-uw-settle-suit-for-k/article_3eb1670e-5b03-11e0-a8b1-001cc4c03286.html" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

He's had a good career as an assistant coach, but his numbers as a head coach are less than sterling. As far as wins and losses go, that is exactly how head coaches are viewed. If not, then Joe would still be coaching football, and Benny would be coaching basketball, because those guys were a hell of a lot of fun to be around....not the best coaches by far, but great guys.

I've also heard all of the "well, one of our players was locked up for a bar fight," and "we lost this guy to injury," and all of the other excuses people come up with to defend what has happened. ALL teams have injuries and issues with players, it is part of the landscape. Boise lost two key players and still had a great run last year. SDSU lost key players and still ended up at the top of the heap. Wyoming won the conference tourney with a magical run that I will never forget. That run will probably buy Shyatt another 4-5 years if he wants to stay.

You have your opinion and I have mine. In the final analysis, it doesn't mean either one of us is right or wrong. It doesn't make you a better fan than I am. It just simply means you look at things differently than I do. That is what these forums are for - a place for people to voice their differing or similar opinions. :twocents:

 

[LanderPoke]

Larry Nance was the best player on either team. If Uche, Josh and Marcus were that good they would have had long careers in the NBA like Larry will. I do agree that the '01 team would probably win, though.

 

[ItSucksToBeACSURam]

Larry Nance was the best player on either team. If Uche, Josh and Marcus were that good they would have had long careers in the NBA like Larry will. I do agree that the '01 team would probably win, though.

I have to respectfully disagree. The environment then versus today could not be more difficult. Nance in 02 would not have been drafted and based on physique alone, Uche and Davis would have a great chance to be drafted today. Nance didn't have significantly better numbers than either and wasn't more physically gifted than either. Davis, IMO was the best of the three. He could bump out and hit threes, he could defend with anyone, and he had the one thing that I have never seen from anyone other than him and Josh Adams, KILLER INSTINCT. He would attack any and everyone if it meant he could get two points. Nance was definitely more of a finesse big than a power big

Hell, in todays landscape I think Bailey would have had a hell of an opportunity to get drafted

 

[calpoke25]

Second, we are not running out of gas. This is a whole new team that had to learn how to play together, just like the Lakers are doing this year and now nobody is blowing the Lakers out. We are going to peak at just the right time. We have an experienced coaching staff and the confidence from last years tourney to do it again. Play D and hit our f n shots and we will win.

I'm sorry. Being compared in any way to the 2015-16 LA Lakers is not where you want to be as a basketball team. They have lost their last 10 games by 9, 2, 4, 19, 12, 23, 2, 18, 13, 19.

 

[calpoke25]

In terms of the 02 vs 15 team debate, it is enjoyable. I think Larry Nance has an edge over Josh Davis, Larry is much longer than Josh. I think Josh Adams would be difficult to contain (as he is for anyone) and would have an edge in his matchup offensively. As mentioned though, the 02 team was a very deep team, and if it was a 7 game series, I like the 02 team to win in 6, wearing them down with their depth. Chris McMillan, arguably a top 15 point guard in Wyoming history, came off the bench for the 02 team. Ugo, although decimated from injuries, was still on the roster. Uche was an all-conference player in tougher league, he would get the edge over DC I think. Ronnell Mingo was a quality JC big off the bench, as was Paris Corner on the wing. Jay Straight was an all-conference level PG as well. The 15 team would probably put Adams on Bailey and I think Adams would do a great job slowing him down, but the 02 team could get points from a lot of different places.

 

[seattlecowboy]

Larry Nance was the best player on either team. If Uche, Josh and Marcus were that good they would have had long careers in the NBA like Larry will. I do agree that the '01 team would probably win, though.

I have to respectfully disagree. The environment then versus today could not be more difficult. Nance in 02 would not have been drafted and based on physique alone, Uche and Davis would have a great chance to be drafted today. Nance didn't have significantly better numbers than either and wasn't more physically gifted than either. Davis, IMO was the best of the three. He could bump out and hit threes, he could defend with anyone, and he had the one thing that I have never seen from anyone other than him and Josh Adams, KILLER INSTINCT. He would attack any and everyone if it meant he could get two points. Nance was definitely more of a finesse big than a power big

Hell, in todays landscape I think Bailey would have had a hell of an opportunity to get drafted

I will have to strongly disagree with you about this. The fact you are trying to compare Uche to Nance is comical. Yeah they don't play the same exact position but you are telling me you would rather start a team with Uche over Nance? The only argument you are basically using is that Uche's Wyoming teams played a tougher schedule so Uche is a better all around player than Nance. :lol: Uche had more rebounds one because he was allowed to go to the offensive glass while Shyatt had Nance getting back on defense. I don't remember Uche ever being up for conference defensive player of the year either.

News flash but Nance was a first round NBA draft pick and is playing against the best players in the world and was starting his rookie season until he had to sit out because his knee is sore. Uche in today's game still wouldn't sniff the NBA just like he didn't back then. Nance would jump over Uche's head. Nance is far more athletic than Uche ever dreamed of being.

Nance would have been drafted in 02 and Nance is far better all around than anyone on the 02 team. Nance affected a game more not only with the main stats but stats that go unnoticed more than just about anyone I have seen at Wyoming in a long time.

I might have agreed with you at some point last year that maybe Bailey or Davis could compare to him in some ways but never in my wildest dreams would I have tried to compare Uche to Nance. What I have seen from Nance his first year in the NBA showed me that he was even far better than I was giving him credit for and there was a reason that Wyoming would get destroyed when he wasn't playing and then be in every game when he was. The dude could impact a game in numerous ways that no one since those 80's teams did in my opinion.

So I honestly don't even know how the heck we are debating who is better between Uche and Nance. If that is what you want to believe though then fair enough.

As far the 02 team goes , yeah I agree they might beat last years team but it would be because they had a lot deeper bench. I would also say Shyatt is 10 times the coach McClain is so who knows what would happen for sure.

 

[ItSucksToBeACSURam]

Larry Nance was the best player on either team. If Uche, Josh and Marcus were that good they would have had long careers in the NBA like Larry will. I do agree that the '01 team would probably win, though.

I have to respectfully disagree. The environment then versus today could not be more difficult. Nance in 02 would not have been drafted and based on physique alone, Uche and Davis would have a great chance to be drafted today. Nance didn't have significantly better numbers than either and wasn't more physically gifted than either. Davis, IMO was the best of the three. He could bump out and hit threes, he could defend with anyone, and he had the one thing that I have never seen from anyone other than him and Josh Adams, KILLER INSTINCT. He would attack any and everyone if it meant he could get two points. Nance was definitely more of a finesse big than a power big

Hell, in todays landscape I think Bailey would have had a hell of an opportunity to get drafted

I will have to strongly disagree with you about this. The fact you are trying to compare Uche to Nance is comical. Yeah they don't play the same exact position but you are telling me you would rather start a team with Uche over Nance? The only argument you are basically using is that Uche's Wyoming teams played a tougher schedule so Uche is a better all around player than Nance. :lol: Uche had more rebounds one because he was allowed to go to the offensive glass while Shyatt had Nance getting back on defense. I don't remember Uche ever being up for conference defensive player of the year either.

News flash but Nance was a first round NBA draft pick and is playing against the best players in the world and was starting his rookie season until he had to sit out because his knee is sore. Uche in today's game still wouldn't sniff the NBA just like he didn't back then. Nance would jump over Uche's head. Nance is far more athletic than Uche ever dreamed of being.

Nance would have been drafted in 02 and Nance is far better all around than anyone on the 02 team. Nance affected a game more not only with the main stats but stats that go unnoticed more than just about anyone I have seen at Wyoming in a long time.

I might have agreed with you at some point last year that maybe Bailey or Davis could compare to him in some ways but never in my wildest dreams would I have tried to compare Uche to Nance. What I have seen from Nance his first year in the NBA showed me that he was even far better than I was giving him credit for and there was a reason that Wyoming would get destroyed when he wasn't playing and then be in every game when he was. The dude could impact a game in numerous ways that no one since those 80's teams did in my opinion.

So I honestly don't even know how the heck we are debating who is better between Uche and Nance. If that is what you want to believe though then fair enough.

As far the 02 team goes , yeah I agree they might beat last years team but it would be because they had a lot deeper bench. I would also say Shyatt is 10 times the coach McClain is so who knows what would happen for sure.

If you'd actually read, my comments were based off the fact that i was making the point Nance would NOT start over Uche because they are not the same position of player and NANCE did not have better number than Uche to justify it as others have stated. Good try though

You're out of your mind if you think Nance would have been drafted in 02. There isn't a snowball chance in hell he would have been drafted.

 

[307bball]

My whole intent in bringing up the comparison to the 02 team is to highlight where we are talent-wise compared to the heights that have been achieved in the past. That team was loaded...McClain deserves a lot of credit for the guys he got in there and the ego's he had to mesh but you did not need to be a master tactition to roll the ball out and beat people when you have a better man for man team than the opponent on a nightly basis. That has always been the exception, not the rule, at WYO. Judged on a sum-of-it's parts basis Shyatt's teams have had, in my opinion, less than stellar personell....what Shyatt brings is the ability to take hard working, good attitude guys and create something that is greater than the sum of it's parts. In this aspect he feels like a great coach...sprinkle in a little talent and .. voila .. you get runs like last year's team was on pre and post mono episode. However...however....he may not be getting it done recruiting-wise. Ask yourself "what if Coach K was coaching this team?..Would we be leading the conference?" My answer is not a chance. The guy's on last years team bought in to Larry's system and, anchored by two very good collegiate big men, made some noise. I want to see Larry coach these guys up...the losses right now are frustrating but to people who know what to watch for it's obvious they get it...they know what to do but can't quite execute consistently. I'll take this years poor results with less than great talent over some of the more talented squads of the past that had no cohesion and little discipline.

 

[ItSucksToBeACSURam]

My whole intent in bringing up the comparison to the 02 team is to highlight where we are talent-wise compared to the heights that have been achieved in the past. That team was loaded...McClain deserves a lot of credit for the guys he got in there and the ego's he had to mesh but you did not need to be a master tactition to roll the ball out and beat people when you have a better man for man team than the opponent on a nightly basis. That has always been the exception, not the rule, at WYO. Judged on a sum-of-it's parts basis Shyatt's teams have had, in my opinion, less than stellar personell....what Shyatt brings is the ability to take hard working, good attitude guys and create something that is greater than the sum of it's parts. In this aspect he feels like a great coach...sprinkle in a little talent and .. voila .. you get runs like last year's team was on pre and post mono episode. However...however....he may not be getting it done recruiting-wise. Ask yourself "what if Coach K was coaching this team?..Would we be leading the conference?" My answer is not a chance. The guy's on last years team bought in to Larry's system and, anchored by two very good collegiate big men, made some noise. I want to see Larry coach these guys up...the losses right now are frustrating but to people who know what to watch for it's obvious they get it...they know what to do but can't quite execute consistently. I'll take this years poor results with less than great talent over some of the more talented squads of the past that had no cohesion and little discipline.

I want to ensure I'm following you.... You would rather have this team, a work in progress with a lot of growing and learning to do, over past teams, say the 01-02 team who was loaded and maybe the best top to bottom team we've had in the last three decades.... Did I read that right?

 

[seattlecowboy]

Larry Nance was the best player on either team. If Uche, Josh and Marcus were that good they would have had long careers in the NBA like Larry will. I do agree that the '01 team would probably win, though.

I have to respectfully disagree. The environment then versus today could not be more difficult. Nance in 02 would not have been drafted and based on physique alone, Uche and Davis would have a great chance to be drafted today. Nance didn't have significantly better numbers than either and wasn't more physically gifted than either. Davis, IMO was the best of the three. He could bump out and hit threes, he could defend with anyone, and he had the one thing that I have never seen from anyone other than him and Josh Adams, KILLER INSTINCT. He would attack any and everyone if it meant he could get two points. Nance was definitely more of a finesse big than a power big

Hell, in todays landscape I think Bailey would have had a hell of an opportunity to get drafted

I will have to strongly disagree with you about this. The fact you are trying to compare Uche to Nance is comical. Yeah they don't play the same exact position but you are telling me you would rather start a team with Uche over Nance? The only argument you are basically using is that Uche's Wyoming teams played a tougher schedule so Uche is a better all around player than Nance. :lol: Uche had more rebounds one because he was allowed to go to the offensive glass while Shyatt had Nance getting back on defense. I don't remember Uche ever being up for conference defensive player of the year either.

News flash but Nance was a first round NBA draft pick and is playing against the best players in the world and was starting his rookie season until he had to sit out because his knee is sore. Uche in today's game still wouldn't sniff the NBA just like he didn't back then. Nance would jump over Uche's head. Nance is far more athletic than Uche ever dreamed of being.

Nance would have been drafted in 02 and Nance is far better all around than anyone on the 02 team. Nance affected a game more not only with the main stats but stats that go unnoticed more than just about anyone I have seen at Wyoming in a long time.

I might have agreed with you at some point last year that maybe Bailey or Davis could compare to him in some ways but never in my wildest dreams would I have tried to compare Uche to Nance. What I have seen from Nance his first year in the NBA showed me that he was even far better than I was giving him credit for and there was a reason that Wyoming would get destroyed when he wasn't playing and then be in every game when he was. The dude could impact a game in numerous ways that no one since those 80's teams did in my opinion.

So I honestly don't even know how the heck we are debating who is better between Uche and Nance. If that is what you want to believe though then fair enough.

As far the 02 team goes , yeah I agree they might beat last years team but it would be because they had a lot deeper bench. I would also say Shyatt is 10 times the coach McClain is so who knows what would happen for sure.

If you'd actually read, my comments were based off the fact that i was making the point Nance would NOT start over Uche because they are not the same position of player and NANCE did not have better number than Uche to justify it as others have stated. Good try though

You're out of your mind if you think Nance would have been drafted in 02. There isn't a snowball chance in hell he would have been drafted.

What numbers their senior years did Uche have better than Nance? The only number Uche had better than Nance was rebounding numbers. Nance had more points, more assists, more steals , better free throw percentage, better 2 point percentage, more blocks per game, he could also shoot the 3. Far more athletic.

Nance would have started over Davis and if just for the hypothetical fun of it you wanted to say it was between Nance and Uche for a starting position Nance would start in my opinion and I don't even think there should be a debate over it.

The fact you actually believe Davis or Uche could get drafted today is far more ridiculous than Nance being drafted in 02. So I will respectfully disagree with you.

 

[ItSucksToBeACSURam]

Larry Nance was the best player on either team. If Uche, Josh and Marcus were that good they would have had long careers in the NBA like Larry will. I do agree that the '01 team would probably win, though.

I have to respectfully disagree. The environment then versus today could not be more difficult. Nance in 02 would not have been drafted and based on physique alone, Uche and Davis would have a great chance to be drafted today. Nance didn't have significantly better numbers than either and wasn't more physically gifted than either. Davis, IMO was the best of the three. He could bump out and hit threes, he could defend with anyone, and he had the one thing that I have never seen from anyone other than him and Josh Adams, KILLER INSTINCT. He would attack any and everyone if it meant he could get two points. Nance was definitely more of a finesse big than a power big

Hell, in todays landscape I think Bailey would have had a hell of an opportunity to get drafted

I will have to strongly disagree with you about this. The fact you are trying to compare Uche to Nance is comical. Yeah they don't play the same exact position but you are telling me you would rather start a team with Uche over Nance? The only argument you are basically using is that Uche's Wyoming teams played a tougher schedule so Uche is a better all around player than Nance. :lol: Uche had more rebounds one because he was allowed to go to the offensive glass while Shyatt had Nance getting back on defense. I don't remember Uche ever being up for conference defensive player of the year either.

News flash but Nance was a first round NBA draft pick and is playing against the best players in the world and was starting his rookie season until he had to sit out because his knee is sore. Uche in today's game still wouldn't sniff the NBA just like he didn't back then. Nance would jump over Uche's head. Nance is far more athletic than Uche ever dreamed of being.

Nance would have been drafted in 02 and Nance is far better all around than anyone on the 02 team. Nance affected a game more not only with the main stats but stats that go unnoticed more than just about anyone I have seen at Wyoming in a long time.

I might have agreed with you at some point last year that maybe Bailey or Davis could compare to him in some ways but never in my wildest dreams would I have tried to compare Uche to Nance. What I have seen from Nance his first year in the NBA showed me that he was even far better than I was giving him credit for and there was a reason that Wyoming would get destroyed when he wasn't playing and then be in every game when he was. The dude could impact a game in numerous ways that no one since those 80's teams did in my opinion.

So I honestly don't even know how the heck we are debating who is better between Uche and Nance. If that is what you want to believe though then fair enough.

As far the 02 team goes , yeah I agree they might beat last years team but it would be because they had a lot deeper bench. I would also say Shyatt is 10 times the coach McClain is so who knows what would happen for sure.

If you'd actually read, my comments were based off the fact that i was making the point Nance would NOT start over Uche because they are not the same position of player and NANCE did not have better number than Uche to justify it as others have stated. Good try though

You're out of your mind if you think Nance would have been drafted in 02. There isn't a snowball chance in hell he would have been drafted.

What numbers their senior years did Uche have better than Nance? The only number Uche had better than Nance was rebounding numbers. Nance had more points, more assists, more steals , better free throw percentage, better 2 point percentage, more blocks per game, he could also shoot the 3. Far more athletic.

Nance would have started over Davis and if just for the hypothetical fun of it you wanted to say it was between Nance and Uche for a starting position Nance would start in my opinion and I don't even think there should be a debate over it.

The fact you actually believe Davis or Uche could get drafted today is far more ridiculous than Nance being drafted in 02. So I will respectfully disagree with you.

Uche had a better FG% which I thought was a big deal.

As for who would get drafted, its as crazy to say Davis/Uche couldn't get drafted today is it is to say Nance would in 02.

The great thing about this board is we can all have our own opinions. I don't think Nance would start on that team you do. You think Nance is a shoe in to get drafted in 02 I do not. Maybe he would have pushed Yao Ming off the #1 spot. Maybe he would have bumped Drew Gooden from the 4 spot or Amari Stoudemire from 9. Hell if a slouch like Carlos Boozer can get drafted at 35, Nance would have been a shoe in.

 

[307bball]

My whole intent in bringing up the comparison to the 02 team is to highlight where we are talent-wise compared to the heights that have been achieved in the past. That team was loaded...McClain deserves a lot of credit for the guys he got in there and the ego's he had to mesh but you did not need to be a master tactition to roll the ball out and beat people when you have a better man for man team than the opponent on a nightly basis. That has always been the exception, not the rule, at WYO. Judged on a sum-of-it's parts basis Shyatt's teams have had, in my opinion, less than stellar personell....what Shyatt brings is the ability to take hard working, good attitude guys and create something that is greater than the sum of it's parts. In this aspect he feels like a great coach...sprinkle in a little talent and .. voila .. you get runs like last year's team was on pre and post mono episode. However...however....he may not be getting it done recruiting-wise. Ask yourself "what if Coach K was coaching this team?..Would we be leading the conference?" My answer is not a chance. The guy's on last years team bought in to Larry's system and, anchored by two very good collegiate big men, made some noise. I want to see Larry coach these guys up...the losses right now are frustrating but to people who know what to watch for it's obvious they get it...they know what to do but can't quite execute consistently. I'll take this years poor results with less than great talent over some of the more talented squads of the past that had no cohesion and little discipline.

I want to ensure I'm following you.... You would rather have this team, a work in progress with a lot of growing and learning to do, over past teams, say the 01-02 team who was loaded and maybe the best top to bottom team we've had in the last three decades.... Did I read that right?

Heh...not quite...results like that 01-02 team had are obviously my preference...what i'm saying is that I can watch this team struggle to find itself and enjoy it more than teams past that had more talent but were not led (coached) appropriately. If my choice is between this team or the 01-02 team than its a no brainer...the better question is Shyatt's tenure or McClain's tenure?

 

[ItSucksToBeACSURam]

My whole intent in bringing up the comparison to the 02 team is to highlight where we are talent-wise compared to the heights that have been achieved in the past. That team was loaded...McClain deserves a lot of credit for the guys he got in there and the ego's he had to mesh but you did not need to be a master tactition to roll the ball out and beat people when you have a better man for man team than the opponent on a nightly basis. That has always been the exception, not the rule, at WYO. Judged on a sum-of-it's parts basis Shyatt's teams have had, in my opinion, less than stellar personell....what Shyatt brings is the ability to take hard working, good attitude guys and create something that is greater than the sum of it's parts. In this aspect he feels like a great coach...sprinkle in a little talent and .. voila .. you get runs like last year's team was on pre and post mono episode. However...however....he may not be getting it done recruiting-wise. Ask yourself "what if Coach K was coaching this team?..Would we be leading the conference?" My answer is not a chance. The guy's on last years team bought in to Larry's system and, anchored by two very good collegiate big men, made some noise. I want to see Larry coach these guys up...the losses right now are frustrating but to people who know what to watch for it's obvious they get it...they know what to do but can't quite execute consistently. I'll take this years poor results with less than great talent over some of the more talented squads of the past that had no cohesion and little discipline.

I want to ensure I'm following you.... You would rather have this team, a work in progress with a lot of growing and learning to do, over past teams, say the 01-02 team who was loaded and maybe the best top to bottom team we've had in the last three decades.... Did I read that right?

Heh...not quite...results like that 01-02 team had are obviously my preference...what i'm saying is that I can watch this team struggle to find itself and enjoy it more than teams past that had more talent but were not led (coached) appropriately. If my choice is between this team or the 01-02 team than its a no brainer...the better question is Shyatt's tenure or McClain's tenure?

McClain tenure wasnt awful here. I don't get the hate for him.
- He he finished 1st in the conference regular season twice.
- He finished 4th or better 4 times.
- He took us to 1 NCAA appearance with a record of 1-1
- He took us to 3 NIT appearances with a record of 2-3
- He never appeared in any other post season tourney such as CBI
- He had a .557 overall winning percentage at UW and .507 in conference.

Shyatts line in comparison:
- Has never finished higher than 4th in the regular season
- Has taken us to 1 NCAA appearance with a record of 0-1
- Took us to 1 NIT appearance with a record of 0-1
- He has taken us to 3 CBI tournaments with a record of 4-3
- He has a .608 overall winning percentage at UW and .473 in conference

McClain got ran out of town like he was a murderer but his overall performance here wasn't any worse than Shyatts. Shyatt slunk out of town the first time (after using us as a yearly stepping stone), sued the university, and is welcomed back and heralded like he's the second coming of Coach K while doing nothing more spectacular than McClain in his time here. Sometimes I don't understand Wyoming fans

 

[NowherePoke]

Always fun to discuss past great WYO teams and compare. As noted by most, there is really no contest overall in comparing the 01-02 team (I have seen some mention 00-01, but 01-02 was the better team) to the 14-15 team. Anything could happen in one game, but the 01-02 team would win a 7 game series in 5, if not a clean sweep.

The depth of the 01-02 team would be overwhelming. While I might take Larry Nance, Jr. as my top pick out of both rosters, 7 of my next 8 are coming off that 01-02 team. Ronell Mingo and Paris Corner off the bench? Ridiculous. With all due respect to Herndon and JMac, those two would start and be the 2nd and 3rd best players on this year's squad. Corner might be one of the more underrated players in recent UW history. An impact scorer off the bench (42% 3PT, 82% FT, 7.9 ppg) that could handle tough defensive assignments as well. Mingo was a very adept post scorer and shot blocker, although he might have had trouble getting minutes on a Shyatt coached team as he was not particular familiar with the concept of "passing" as a I recall.

Just for fun, here is my All Current Century UW team (99-00 season until now):

First Team:

G - Brandon Ewing - Probably the toughest choice on this list choosing between Ewing and Straight, but I am going with Brandon. The most dangerous player off the dribble to play for the Pokes in a long time. Not much bigger physically than Jeremy Lieberman, yet fearless going to the hole with an ability to get to the FT line at will.

G - Josh Adams - A year ago he wouldn't be in this spot, but the fact that he turned himself into an impact high volume 3-point shooter to go with the rest of his game vaults him into the starting lineup. He can do it all on the basketball court.

G/F - Marcus Bailey - The easiest choice on this list. I just looked up "Clutch" in the dictionary and there was Bailey. Best wing to play at UW since Dembo.

F - Josh Davis - Sure, he was MIA for long stretches of his senior season, but when the bright lights were on in March Madness against Gonzaga and Arizona, it wasn't Marcus Bailey or Dan Dickau (on a Top 10 team) that were the best players on the court..it was Josh Davis.

F - Larry Nance, Jr. - The knee injury and mono robbed us of seeing Nance quite reach his full potential at UW, which makes the fact that he is on this list even more impressive. A great rebounder (don't be misled by the total rebounds which are impacted by Shyatt's non offensive rebounding and slow tempo philosophies) and defender to go with a varied offensive threat and great FT shooting. Not to mention probably the best ambassador the program has ever had.

Second Team:

G - Jay Straight - Deciding between Ewing and Straight was very difficult. I give Straight a ton of credit for carrying a bad of misfits to a .500 MWC season his senior year in a much tougher MWC than what we have today. That team was better than 4 of 5 Shyatt seasons since his return (14-15 being the exception obviously), but the roster was very limited and the coaching was average at best.

G - Brad Jones - Another tough decision as there are a number of players, notably Richardson, that could be considered here, but I will always have a soft spot for Brad Jones. An absolute bulldog, who was probably about 5'10" 170. A tough on the ball defender who could get into the paint at will. What I really appreciated about Brad is that he turned himself from essentially a non-shooter into a decent perimeter shooter. His progression was what I hoped Adams would follow. Adams actually took it up a notch from there, but Jones development was impressive as well. Also, a fond memory of when it didn't seem insane for us to beat Creighton in a recruiting battle.

G/F - Afam Muojeke - Obviously a career that was cut short by injury. There are probably deserving guards and big men left off this list, but if I am trying to stick with some sort of lineups, I can't think of a better wing when healthy other than Bailey.

F - Justin Williams - Incredible shot blocker and ridiculous athlete.

C - Uche - Dominant physical presence in the paint.

 

[307bball]

My whole intent in bringing up the comparison to the 02 team is to highlight where we are talent-wise compared to the heights that have been achieved in the past. That team was loaded...McClain deserves a lot of credit for the guys he got in there and the ego's he had to mesh but you did not need to be a master tactition to roll the ball out and beat people when you have a better man for man team than the opponent on a nightly basis. That has always been the exception, not the rule, at WYO. Judged on a sum-of-it's parts basis Shyatt's teams have had, in my opinion, less than stellar personell....what Shyatt brings is the ability to take hard working, good attitude guys and create something that is greater than the sum of it's parts. In this aspect he feels like a great coach...sprinkle in a little talent and .. voila .. you get runs like last year's team was on pre and post mono episode. However...however....he may not be getting it done recruiting-wise. Ask yourself "what if Coach K was coaching this team?..Would we be leading the conference?" My answer is not a chance. The guy's on last years team bought in to Larry's system and, anchored by two very good collegiate big men, made some noise. I want to see Larry coach these guys up...the losses right now are frustrating but to people who know what to watch for it's obvious they get it...they know what to do but can't quite execute consistently. I'll take this years poor results with less than great talent over some of the more talented squads of the past that had no cohesion and little discipline.

I want to ensure I'm following you.... You would rather have this team, a work in progress with a lot of growing and learning to do, over past teams, say the 01-02 team who was loaded and maybe the best top to bottom team we've had in the last three decades.... Did I read that right?

Heh...not quite...results like that 01-02 team had are obviously my preference...what i'm saying is that I can watch this team struggle to find itself and enjoy it more than teams past that had more talent but were not led (coached) appropriately. If my choice is between this team or the 01-02 team than its a no brainer...the better question is Shyatt's tenure or McClain's tenure?

McClain tenure wasnt awful here. I don't get the hate for him.
- He he finished 1st in the conference regular season twice.
- He finished 4th or better 4 times.
- He took us to 1 NCAA appearance with a record of 1-1
- He took us to 3 NIT appearances with a record of 2-3
- He never appeared in any other post season tourney such as CBI
- He had a .557 overall winning percentage at UW and .507 in conference.

Shyatts line in comparison:
- Has never finished higher than 4th in the regular season
- Has taken us to 1 NCAA appearance with a record of 0-1
- Took us to 1 NIT appearance with a record of 0-1
- He has taken us to 3 CBI tournaments with a record of 4-3
- He has a .608 overall winning percentage at UW and .473 in conference

McClain got ran out of town like he was a murderer but his overall performance here wasn't any worse than Shyatts. Shyatt slunk out of town the first time (after using us as a yearly stepping stone), sued the university, and is welcomed back and heralded like he's the second coming of Coach K while doing nothing more spectacular than McClain in his time here. Sometimes I don't understand Wyoming fans

I'm attempting to compare apples and apples here ... it's obvious, or should be, that McClain had more talent on the teams he coached. If your trying to get me to say that i think McClain is a bum I can't do it...The fine point is that I believe that as it pertains to teaching the game of basketball and in-game coaching acumen Larry Shyatt is one of the better guys to have at the helm. Is that the only things that determine success in the modern game?...no....Like I addressed in my earlier post...Phil Jackson could not step in to this personnel group and create something out of nothing. It's no coincidence that the best coaches have the best players. McClain, IMO, is a better recruiter but ultimately was unable to maintain the level of talent that his style of coaching needed to be successful. Shyatt can achieve more with less...I hope we are seeing the bottom of the barrel when it comes to talent level right now but we'll see...I don't think fans will tolerate one more season like this much less two. I just can't comprehend questioning his in game decisions when the glaring weakness of being unable to secure and maintain talent is left un-addressed.

 

[307bball]

Always fun to discuss past great WYO teams and compare. As noted by most, there is really no contest overall in comparing the 01-02 team (I have seen some mention 00-01, but 01-02 was the better team) to the 14-15 team. Anything could happen in one game, but the 01-02 team would win a 7 game series in 5, if not a clean sweep.

The depth of the 01-02 team would be overwhelming. While I might take Larry Nance, Jr. as my top pick out of both rosters, 7 of my next 8 are coming off that 01-02 team. Ronell Mingo and Paris Corner off the bench? Ridiculous. With all due respect to Herndon and JMac, those two would start and be the 2nd and 3rd best players on this year's squad. Corner might be one of the more underrated players in recent UW history. An impact scorer off the bench (42% 3PT, 82% FT, 7.9 ppg) that could handle tough defensive assignments as well. Mingo was a very adept post scorer and shot blocker, although he might have had trouble getting minutes on a Shyatt coached team as he was not particular familiar with the concept of "passing" as a I recall.

Just for fun, here is my All Current Century UW team (99-00 season until now):

First Team:

G - Brandon Ewing - Probably the toughest choice on this list choosing between Ewing and Straight, but I am going with Brandon. The most dangerous player off the dribble to play for the Pokes in a long time. Not much bigger physically than Jeremy Lieberman, yet fearless going to the hole with an ability to get to the FT line at will.

G - Josh Adams - A year ago he wouldn't be in this spot, but the fact that he turned himself into an impact high volume 3-point shooter to go with the rest of his game vaults him into the starting lineup. He can do it all on the basketball court.

G/F - Marcus Bailey - The easiest choice on this list. I just looked up "Clutch" in the dictionary and there was Bailey. Best wing to play at UW since Dembo.

F - Josh Davis - Sure, he was MIA for long stretches of his senior season, but when the bright lights were on in March Madness against Gonzaga and Arizona, it wasn't Marcus Bailey or Dan Dickau (on a Top 10 team) that were the best players on the court..it was Josh Davis.

F - Larry Nance, Jr. - The knee injury and mono robbed us of seeing Nance quite reach his full potential at UW, which makes the fact that he is on this list even more impressive. A great rebounder (don't be misled by the total rebounds which are impacted by Shyatt's non offensive rebounding and slow tempo philosophies) and defender to go with a varied offensive threat and great FT shooting. Not to mention probably the best ambassador the program has ever had.

Second Team:

G - Jay Straight - Deciding between Ewing and Straight was very difficult. I give Straight a ton of credit for carrying a bad of misfits to a .500 MWC season his senior year in a much tougher MWC than what we have today. That team was better than 4 of 5 Shyatt seasons since his return (14-15 being the exception obviously), but the roster was very limited and the coaching was average at best.

G - Brad Jones - Another tough decision as there are a number of players, notably Richardson, that could be considered here, but I will always have a soft spot for Brad Jones. An absolute bulldog, who was probably about 5'10" 170. A tough on the ball defender who could get into the paint at will. What I really appreciated about Brad is that he turned himself from essentially a non-shooter into a decent perimeter shooter. His progression was what I hoped Adams would follow. Adams actually took it up a notch from there, but Jones development was impressive as well. Also, a fond memory of when it didn't seem insane for us to beat Creighton in a recruiting battle.

G/F - Afam Muojeke - Obviously a career that was cut short by injury. There are probably deserving guards and big men left off this list, but if I am trying to stick with some sort of lineups, I can't think of a better wing when healthy other than Bailey.

F - Justin Williams - Incredible shot blocker and ridiculous athlete.

C - Uche - Dominant physical presence in the paint.

I like this ... love reminiscing about past wyo greats