What do we do to make sure that doesn't happen again?

[NowherePoke]

My whole intent in bringing up the comparison to the 02 team is to highlight where we are talent-wise compared to the heights that have been achieved in the past. That team was loaded...McClain deserves a lot of credit for the guys he got in there and the ego's he had to mesh but you did not need to be a master tactition to roll the ball out and beat people when you have a better man for man team than the opponent on a nightly basis. That has always been the exception, not the rule, at WYO. Judged on a sum-of-it's parts basis Shyatt's teams have had, in my opinion, less than stellar personell....what Shyatt brings is the ability to take hard working, good attitude guys and create something that is greater than the sum of it's parts. In this aspect he feels like a great coach...sprinkle in a little talent and .. voila .. you get runs like last year's team was on pre and post mono episode. However...however....he may not be getting it done recruiting-wise. Ask yourself "what if Coach K was coaching this team?..Would we be leading the conference?" My answer is not a chance. The guy's on last years team bought in to Larry's system and, anchored by two very good collegiate big men, made some noise. I want to see Larry coach these guys up...the losses right now are frustrating but to people who know what to watch for it's obvious they get it...they know what to do but can't quite execute consistently. I'll take this years poor results with less than great talent over some of the more talented squads of the past that had no cohesion and little discipline.

I want to ensure I'm following you.... You would rather have this team, a work in progress with a lot of growing and learning to do, over past teams, say the 01-02 team who was loaded and maybe the best top to bottom team we've had in the last three decades.... Did I read that right?

Heh...not quite...results like that 01-02 team had are obviously my preference...what i'm saying is that I can watch this team struggle to find itself and enjoy it more than teams past that had more talent but were not led (coached) appropriately. If my choice is between this team or the 01-02 team than its a no brainer...the better question is Shyatt's tenure or McClain's tenure?

McClain tenure wasnt awful here. I don't get the hate for him.
- He he finished 1st in the conference regular season twice.
- He finished 4th or better 4 times.
- He took us to 1 NCAA appearance with a record of 1-1
- He took us to 3 NIT appearances with a record of 2-3
- He never appeared in any other post season tourney such as CBI
- He had a .557 overall winning percentage at UW and .507 in conference.

Shyatts line in comparison:
- Has never finished higher than 4th in the regular season
- Has taken us to 1 NCAA appearance with a record of 0-1
- Took us to 1 NIT appearance with a record of 0-1
- He has taken us to 3 CBI tournaments with a record of 4-3
- He has a .608 overall winning percentage at UW and .473 in conference

McClain got ran out of town like he was a murderer but his overall performance here wasn't any worse than Shyatts. Shyatt slunk out of town the first time (after using us as a yearly stepping stone), sued the university, and is welcomed back and heralded like he's the second coming of Coach K while doing nothing more spectacular than McClain in his time here. Sometimes I don't understand Wyoming fans

I am hardly a Shyatt cheerleader, but this is very misleading. All of the accolades accomplished by McClain occurred in his first 5 seasons, his last 4 seasons we was 23-37 in MWC play. The hate towards McClain is because he squandered a golden opportunity. The Pokes were MWC champions, winners of a NCAA tourney game, and playing in front of average crowds of 10k and all the momentum was squandered away. While the exact reasons can be debated, you take that decline in results along with the following:

1. Recruiting - McClain inherited McMillan, McFall, Blakes, Jones, Ugo, and Davis. Those were the core of his first few teams including the 00-01 MWC co-championship team. The only other notable pieces were Bailey who fell into his lap (read Bailey's own comments regarding his recruitment, he was not a priority for McClain) and Uche who was, correctly or not, viewed as someone we landed because we already had Ugo. Once those players departed, McClain was unable to build a consistently successful roster with his own recruits. I do give McClain more credit than some as the 01-02 team was really his. He recruited most of the players, even if he got lucky with Bailey/Uche, and more importantly he coached them through their entire careers. Bailey, Davis, Uche, etc. developed as players under McClain and he deserves credit for that.

2. Program Perception - Due to a number of factors including low APR, off the court problems, and the fight at New Mexico, the program was viewed as being filled with troublemakers and poor students. It wasn't necessarily a fair characterization, but it wasn't without merit either. This didn't help McClain when things went south.



Personally, McClain was a better coach than I gave him credit for at the time and I do respect Steve.

Having said that, when evaluating Shyatt you have to look at the other factors. In both cases, he took over the UW program when it was in bad shape. First after Joby Wrong and then after Schroyer. He set the table for McClain, while never having had the luxury of seeing the favor returned.

 

[ItSucksToBeACSURam]

Always fun to discuss past great WYO teams and compare. As noted by most, there is really no contest overall in comparing the 01-02 team (I have seen some mention 00-01, but 01-02 was the better team) to the 14-15 team. Anything could happen in one game, but the 01-02 team would win a 7 game series in 5, if not a clean sweep.

The depth of the 01-02 team would be overwhelming. While I might take Larry Nance, Jr. as my top pick out of both rosters, 7 of my next 8 are coming off that 01-02 team. Ronell Mingo and Paris Corner off the bench? Ridiculous. With all due respect to Herndon and JMac, those two would start and be the 2nd and 3rd best players on this year's squad. Corner might be one of the more underrated players in recent UW history. An impact scorer off the bench (42% 3PT, 82% FT, 7.9 ppg) that could handle tough defensive assignments as well. Mingo was a very adept post scorer and shot blocker, although he might have had trouble getting minutes on a Shyatt coached team as he was not particular familiar with the concept of "passing" as a I recall.

Just for fun, here is my All Current Century UW team (99-00 season until now):

First Team:

G - Brandon Ewing - Probably the toughest choice on this list choosing between Ewing and Straight, but I am going with Brandon. The most dangerous player off the dribble to play for the Pokes in a long time. Not much bigger physically than Jeremy Lieberman, yet fearless going to the hole with an ability to get to the FT line at will.

G - Josh Adams - A year ago he wouldn't be in this spot, but the fact that he turned himself into an impact high volume 3-point shooter to go with the rest of his game vaults him into the starting lineup. He can do it all on the basketball court.

G/F - Marcus Bailey - The easiest choice on this list. I just looked up "Clutch" in the dictionary and there was Bailey. Best wing to play at UW since Dembo.

F - Josh Davis - Sure, he was MIA for long stretches of his senior season, but when the bright lights were on in March Madness against Gonzaga and Arizona, it wasn't Marcus Bailey or Dan Dickau (on a Top 10 team) that were the best players on the court..it was Josh Davis.

F - Larry Nance, Jr. - The knee injury and mono robbed us of seeing Nance quite reach his full potential at UW, which makes the fact that he is on this list even more impressive. A great rebounder (don't be misled by the total rebounds which are impacted by Shyatt's non offensive rebounding and slow tempo philosophies) and defender to go with a varied offensive threat and great FT shooting. Not to mention probably the best ambassador the program has ever had.

Second Team:

G - Jay Straight - Deciding between Ewing and Straight was very difficult. I give Straight a ton of credit for carrying a bad of misfits to a .500 MWC season his senior year in a much tougher MWC than what we have today. That team was better than 4 of 5 Shyatt seasons since his return (14-15 being the exception obviously), but the roster was very limited and the coaching was average at best.

G - Brad Jones - Another tough decision as there are a number of players, notably Richardson, that could be considered here, but I will always have a soft spot for Brad Jones. An absolute bulldog, who was probably about 5'10" 170. A tough on the ball defender who could get into the paint at will. What I really appreciated about Brad is that he turned himself from essentially a non-shooter into a decent perimeter shooter. His progression was what I hoped Adams would follow. Adams actually took it up a notch from there, but Jones development was impressive as well. Also, a fond memory of when it didn't seem insane for us to beat Creighton in a recruiting battle.

G/F - Afam Muojeke - Obviously a career that was cut short by injury. There are probably deserving guards and big men left off this list, but if I am trying to stick with some sort of lineups, I can't think of a better wing when healthy other than Bailey.

F - Justin Williams - Incredible shot blocker and ridiculous athlete.

C - Uche - Dominant physical presence in the paint.

Love this!

My First String

G - Jay Straight - Agree wholeheartedly with your rationale, just think he did more.

G - Josh Adams. Nuff said

G/F - Marcus Bailey - Local boy. The easiest choice on this list. Will go down as an all-time hero and fan favorite

F - Josh Davis - Have never seen a better "force" player in my life. He had a killer instinct on a level I have never seen rivaled. Josh Adams is close, but something about Davis will always stick with me.

F/C - Larry Nance - While I don't think he was the best at his position, I love LN and will never forget the magic he orchestrated last March.

2nd String

G - Ewing. Dude was a blast to watch and had skills for days

G - Brett McFall - Most def not the most skilled guard to ever come through the program, has there been a bigger personality to ever wear the Brown and Gold? My favorite sports moment was his half court alley oop to Davis. I was certain the AA's roof was going to cave in. I will go to my grave never forgetting that moment.

G/F - Greg Sawyer. He was an athlete first and a basketball player second. Wyoming player who stayed in state. Smarter than he got credit for. Bounce an inbounds off a defender anyone?

F - Justin French - It wasnt always pretty but he busted his ass and would do anything asked of him. Mac started out as a player who really reminded me of JFrench. JMac has become a better scorer but I still see a lot of similarities on D

C - Theo Ratliff. Has there been a player who affected opponents defensively more than Theo?

 

[ItSucksToBeACSURam]

My whole intent in bringing up the comparison to the 02 team is to highlight where we are talent-wise compared to the heights that have been achieved in the past. That team was loaded...McClain deserves a lot of credit for the guys he got in there and the ego's he had to mesh but you did not need to be a master tactition to roll the ball out and beat people when you have a better man for man team than the opponent on a nightly basis. That has always been the exception, not the rule, at WYO. Judged on a sum-of-it's parts basis Shyatt's teams have had, in my opinion, less than stellar personell....what Shyatt brings is the ability to take hard working, good attitude guys and create something that is greater than the sum of it's parts. In this aspect he feels like a great coach...sprinkle in a little talent and .. voila .. you get runs like last year's team was on pre and post mono episode. However...however....he may not be getting it done recruiting-wise. Ask yourself "what if Coach K was coaching this team?..Would we be leading the conference?" My answer is not a chance. The guy's on last years team bought in to Larry's system and, anchored by two very good collegiate big men, made some noise. I want to see Larry coach these guys up...the losses right now are frustrating but to people who know what to watch for it's obvious they get it...they know what to do but can't quite execute consistently. I'll take this years poor results with less than great talent over some of the more talented squads of the past that had no cohesion and little discipline.

I want to ensure I'm following you.... You would rather have this team, a work in progress with a lot of growing and learning to do, over past teams, say the 01-02 team who was loaded and maybe the best top to bottom team we've had in the last three decades.... Did I read that right?

Heh...not quite...results like that 01-02 team had are obviously my preference...what i'm saying is that I can watch this team struggle to find itself and enjoy it more than teams past that had more talent but were not led (coached) appropriately. If my choice is between this team or the 01-02 team than its a no brainer...the better question is Shyatt's tenure or McClain's tenure?

McClain tenure wasnt awful here. I don't get the hate for him.
- He he finished 1st in the conference regular season twice.
- He finished 4th or better 4 times.
- He took us to 1 NCAA appearance with a record of 1-1
- He took us to 3 NIT appearances with a record of 2-3
- He never appeared in any other post season tourney such as CBI
- He had a .557 overall winning percentage at UW and .507 in conference.

Shyatts line in comparison:
- Has never finished higher than 4th in the regular season
- Has taken us to 1 NCAA appearance with a record of 0-1
- Took us to 1 NIT appearance with a record of 0-1
- He has taken us to 3 CBI tournaments with a record of 4-3
- He has a .608 overall winning percentage at UW and .473 in conference

McClain got ran out of town like he was a murderer but his overall performance here wasn't any worse than Shyatts. Shyatt slunk out of town the first time (after using us as a yearly stepping stone), sued the university, and is welcomed back and heralded like he's the second coming of Coach K while doing nothing more spectacular than McClain in his time here. Sometimes I don't understand Wyoming fans

Personally, McClain was a better coach than I gave him credit for at the time and I do respect Steve.

Having said that, when evaluating Shyatt you have to look at the other factors. In both cases, he took over the UW program when it was in bad shape. First after Joby Wrong and then after Schroyer. He set the table for McClain, while never having had the luxury of seeing the favor returned.

I would absolutely agree with your analysis but would caveat this. Shyatt chose to leave. McClain fell into a good thing that absolutely could have been Shyatts. Imagine our program today had he chosen to stay this whole time. It's Shyatt who squandered a golden opportunity. He left a dynasty for a kick in the nads at Clemson.

EDIT: I understand hindsight is 20/20 but we see what COULD HAVE been

 

[bladerunnr]

Interesting thread. My 2 cents: There was probably never a more talented athlete at UW than Justin Williams. He was a defensive force, a rebounding machine, and a must double team in the low post. I still can't believe we lost that title game in Denver to SDS when we had a 4 point lead with about 1 minute to go in OT. A win in that game might have given a new contract to McClain. Instead, he just got a 1 year reprieve.

Just remember, Shyatt took over a disaster. We were in the conference tournament play in game in almost every year Schroyer was coach. I'm a little disappointed that guys like Barnes haven't developed. That goes to show the hit and miss in recruiting. Even James development hasn't progressed like I thought it would. We are a respectable team in the conference now. No one takes us for granted. We are a big man away from being in the top tier.

Those unhappy with Shyatt, who would we get? Also, he has beat csewe 4 straight times. Try to remember the last time that happened.

 

[seattlecowboy]

Larry Nance was the best player on either team. If Uche, Josh and Marcus were that good they would have had long careers in the NBA like Larry will. I do agree that the '01 team would probably win, though.

I have to respectfully disagree. The environment then versus today could not be more difficult. Nance in 02 would not have been drafted and based on physique alone, Uche and Davis would have a great chance to be drafted today. Nance didn't have significantly better numbers than either and wasn't more physically gifted than either. Davis, IMO was the best of the three. He could bump out and hit threes, he could defend with anyone, and he had the one thing that I have never seen from anyone other than him and Josh Adams, KILLER INSTINCT. He would attack any and everyone if it meant he could get two points. Nance was definitely more of a finesse big than a power big

Hell, in todays landscape I think Bailey would have had a hell of an opportunity to get drafted

I will have to strongly disagree with you about this. The fact you are trying to compare Uche to Nance is comical. Yeah they don't play the same exact position but you are telling me you would rather start a team with Uche over Nance? The only argument you are basically using is that Uche's Wyoming teams played a tougher schedule so Uche is a better all around player than Nance. :lol: Uche had more rebounds one because he was allowed to go to the offensive glass while Shyatt had Nance getting back on defense. I don't remember Uche ever being up for conference defensive player of the year either.

News flash but Nance was a first round NBA draft pick and is playing against the best players in the world and was starting his rookie season until he had to sit out because his knee is sore. Uche in today's game still wouldn't sniff the NBA just like he didn't back then. Nance would jump over Uche's head. Nance is far more athletic than Uche ever dreamed of being.

Nance would have been drafted in 02 and Nance is far better all around than anyone on the 02 team. Nance affected a game more not only with the main stats but stats that go unnoticed more than just about anyone I have seen at Wyoming in a long time.

I might have agreed with you at some point last year that maybe Bailey or Davis could compare to him in some ways but never in my wildest dreams would I have tried to compare Uche to Nance. What I have seen from Nance his first year in the NBA showed me that he was even far better than I was giving him credit for and there was a reason that Wyoming would get destroyed when he wasn't playing and then be in every game when he was. The dude could impact a game in numerous ways that no one since those 80's teams did in my opinion.

So I honestly don't even know how the heck we are debating who is better between Uche and Nance. If that is what you want to believe though then fair enough.

As far the 02 team goes , yeah I agree they might beat last years team but it would be because they had a lot deeper bench. I would also say Shyatt is 10 times the coach McClain is so who knows what would happen for sure.

If you'd actually read, my comments were based off the fact that i was making the point Nance would NOT start over Uche because they are not the same position of player and NANCE did not have better number than Uche to justify it as others have stated. Good try though

You're out of your mind if you think Nance would have been drafted in 02. There isn't a snowball chance in hell he would have been drafted.

What numbers their senior years did Uche have better than Nance? The only number Uche had better than Nance was rebounding numbers. Nance had more points, more assists, more steals , better free throw percentage, better 2 point percentage, more blocks per game, he could also shoot the 3. Far more athletic.

Nance would have started over Davis and if just for the hypothetical fun of it you wanted to say it was between Nance and Uche for a starting position Nance would start in my opinion and I don't even think there should be a debate over it.

The fact you actually believe Davis or Uche could get drafted today is far more ridiculous than Nance being drafted in 02. So I will respectfully disagree with you.

Uche had a better FG% which I thought was a big deal.

As for who would get drafted, its as crazy to say Davis/Uche couldn't get drafted today is it is to say Nance would in 02.

The great thing about this board is we can all have our own opinions. I don't think Nance would start on that team you do. You think Nance is a shoe in to get drafted in 02 I do not. Maybe he would have pushed Yao Ming off the #1 spot. Maybe he would have bumped Drew Gooden from the 4 spot or Amari Stoudemire from 9. Hell if a slouch like Carlos Boozer can get drafted at 35, Nance would have been a shoe in.

I agree with you that it is great everyone can have their own opinion and I mean no disrespect.

I just think if we are going to use stats it would be more fair to use Nances last 3 years and compare them to the 3 years Uche was here. Uche never played as a freshman at Wyoming while Nance did and Nances freshman numbers weren't bad for a freshman but they do bring his overall numbers down for his last 3 years. If you use just those 3 Nance's numbers jump considerably.

Also as far as their fg percentages the only reason Nance had a lower field goal percentage was because he shot the 3 ball which Uche never shot. If you look at just their 2 point field goal percentages as a Junior and Senior Nance had a better percentage. Nance also had more rebounds as a Junior than Uche did.

Uche was no slouch by any means and I loved the way he played just for me if it came down to it I would pick Nance. As far as the draft goes it is easier to say you don't think Nance would be drafted now that we already know what all of the guys from 02 did but at that time no one would know that. Nance had the 2nd best shuttle time for anyone at his position in the last 5 years at the combine and his vertical jump for the Lakers he was able to jump higher than the thing measured and they had to add to it and he still hit the top. So that is fine if you don't think he would get drafted back then but I think someone would have taken a chance on him myself. I never said he was going to be the top draft pick or be top 25 even but I think he would have been drafted.

Anyways thanks for the debate It is always fun.

I also agree with NowherePokes post on his all decade teams. :thumb:

 

[ItSucksToBeACSURam]

Interesting thread. My 2 cents: There was probably never a more talented athlete at UW than Justin Williams. He was a defensive force, a rebounding machine, and a must double team in the low post. I still can't believe we lost that title game in Denver to SDS when we had a 4 point lead with about 1 minute to go in OT. A win in that game might have given a new contract to McClain. Instead, he just got a 1 year reprieve.

Just remember, Shyatt took over a disaster. We were in the conference tournament play in game in almost every year Schroyer was coach. I'm a little disappointed that guys like Barnes haven't developed. That goes to show the hit and miss in recruiting. Even James development hasn't progressed like I thought it would. We are a respectable team in the conference now. No one takes us for granted. We are a big man away from being in the top tier.

Those unhappy with Shyatt, who would we get? Also, he has beat csewe 4 straight times. Try to remember the last time that happened.

I don't think anyone is saying we need to can Shyatt, my point was that others have been canned with similar careers. Who would we get? Who knows. Shaka Smart started somewhere. Were never going to attract Coach K but there are great coaches out there. Hopefully Shyatt gets these youngsters playing at a high, sustained level next season and we don't have to worry about any of this until he retires

 

[ItSucksToBeACSURam]

Larry Nance was the best player on either team. If Uche, Josh and Marcus were that good they would have had long careers in the NBA like Larry will. I do agree that the '01 team would probably win, though.

I have to respectfully disagree. The environment then versus today could not be more difficult. Nance in 02 would not have been drafted and based on physique alone, Uche and Davis would have a great chance to be drafted today. Nance didn't have significantly better numbers than either and wasn't more physically gifted than either. Davis, IMO was the best of the three. He could bump out and hit threes, he could defend with anyone, and he had the one thing that I have never seen from anyone other than him and Josh Adams, KILLER INSTINCT. He would attack any and everyone if it meant he could get two points. Nance was definitely more of a finesse big than a power big

Hell, in todays landscape I think Bailey would have had a hell of an opportunity to get drafted

I will have to strongly disagree with you about this. The fact you are trying to compare Uche to Nance is comical. Yeah they don't play the same exact position but you are telling me you would rather start a team with Uche over Nance? The only argument you are basically using is that Uche's Wyoming teams played a tougher schedule so Uche is a better all around player than Nance. :lol: Uche had more rebounds one because he was allowed to go to the offensive glass while Shyatt had Nance getting back on defense. I don't remember Uche ever being up for conference defensive player of the year either.

News flash but Nance was a first round NBA draft pick and is playing against the best players in the world and was starting his rookie season until he had to sit out because his knee is sore. Uche in today's game still wouldn't sniff the NBA just like he didn't back then. Nance would jump over Uche's head. Nance is far more athletic than Uche ever dreamed of being.

Nance would have been drafted in 02 and Nance is far better all around than anyone on the 02 team. Nance affected a game more not only with the main stats but stats that go unnoticed more than just about anyone I have seen at Wyoming in a long time.

I might have agreed with you at some point last year that maybe Bailey or Davis could compare to him in some ways but never in my wildest dreams would I have tried to compare Uche to Nance. What I have seen from Nance his first year in the NBA showed me that he was even far better than I was giving him credit for and there was a reason that Wyoming would get destroyed when he wasn't playing and then be in every game when he was. The dude could impact a game in numerous ways that no one since those 80's teams did in my opinion.

So I honestly don't even know how the heck we are debating who is better between Uche and Nance. If that is what you want to believe though then fair enough.

As far the 02 team goes , yeah I agree they might beat last years team but it would be because they had a lot deeper bench. I would also say Shyatt is 10 times the coach McClain is so who knows what would happen for sure.

If you'd actually read, my comments were based off the fact that i was making the point Nance would NOT start over Uche because they are not the same position of player and NANCE did not have better number than Uche to justify it as others have stated. Good try though

You're out of your mind if you think Nance would have been drafted in 02. There isn't a snowball chance in hell he would have been drafted.

What numbers their senior years did Uche have better than Nance? The only number Uche had better than Nance was rebounding numbers. Nance had more points, more assists, more steals , better free throw percentage, better 2 point percentage, more blocks per game, he could also shoot the 3. Far more athletic.

Nance would have started over Davis and if just for the hypothetical fun of it you wanted to say it was between Nance and Uche for a starting position Nance would start in my opinion and I don't even think there should be a debate over it.

The fact you actually believe Davis or Uche could get drafted today is far more ridiculous than Nance being drafted in 02. So I will respectfully disagree with you.

Uche had a better FG% which I thought was a big deal.

As for who would get drafted, its as crazy to say Davis/Uche couldn't get drafted today is it is to say Nance would in 02.

The great thing about this board is we can all have our own opinions. I don't think Nance would start on that team you do. You think Nance is a shoe in to get drafted in 02 I do not. Maybe he would have pushed Yao Ming off the #1 spot. Maybe he would have bumped Drew Gooden from the 4 spot or Amari Stoudemire from 9. Hell if a slouch like Carlos Boozer can get drafted at 35, Nance would have been a shoe in.

I agree with you that it is great everyone can have their own opinion and I mean no disrespect.

I just think if we are going to use stats it would be more fair to use Nances last 3 years and compare them to the 3 years Uche was here. Uche never played as a freshman at Wyoming while Nance did and Nances freshman numbers weren't bad for a freshman but they do bring his overall numbers down for his last 3 years. If you use just those 3 Nance's numbers jump considerably.

Also as far as their fg percentages the only reason Nance had a lower field goal percentage was because he shot the 3 ball which Uche never shot. If you look at just their 2 point field goal percentages as a Junior and Senior Nance had a better percentage. Nance also had more rebounds as a Junior than Uche did.

Uche was no slouch by any means and I loved the way he played just for me if it came down to it I would pick Nance. As far as the draft goes it is easier to say you don't think Nance would be drafted now that we already know what all of the guys from 02 did but at that time no one would know that. Nance had the 2nd best shuttle time for anyone at his position in the last 5 years at the combine and his vertical jump for the Lakers he was able to jump higher than the thing measured and they had to add to it and he still hit the top. So that is fine if you don't think he would get drafted back then but I think someone would have taken a chance on him myself. I never said he was going to be the top draft pick or be top 25 even but I think he would have been drafted.

Anyways thanks for the debate It is always fun.

I also agree with NowherePokes post on his all decade teams. :thumb:

Fair enough.

A note on Nance, he really never showed up on draft boards until after the season. His intangibles that he displayed in those workouts, for whatever reason, didnt show up to scouts on tape. Whose to say that couldn't be the case foe guys like Josh Davis?

A lot of those guys had decent pro careers. Davis played a while in the NBA D League, Uche had a fantastic career overseas and just retired this past year if memory serves me correctly. I think given some of the modern draft procedures the results may have been different.

Either way, I love talking Pokes current and past!

 

[Cosmic Cowboy]

Always fun to discuss past great WYO teams and compare. As noted by most, there is really no contest overall in comparing the 01-02 team (I have seen some mention 00-01, but 01-02 was the better team) to the 14-15 team. Anything could happen in one game, but the 01-02 team would win a 7 game series in 5, if not a clean sweep.

The depth of the 01-02 team would be overwhelming. While I might take Larry Nance, Jr. as my top pick out of both rosters, 7 of my next 8 are coming off that 01-02 team. Ronell Mingo and Paris Corner off the bench? Ridiculous. With all due respect to Herndon and JMac, those two would start and be the 2nd and 3rd best players on this year's squad. Corner might be one of the more underrated players in recent UW history. An impact scorer off the bench (42% 3PT, 82% FT, 7.9 ppg) that could handle tough defensive assignments as well. Mingo was a very adept post scorer and shot blocker, although he might have had trouble getting minutes on a Shyatt coached team as he was not particular familiar with the concept of "passing" as a I recall.

Just for fun, here is my All Current Century UW team (99-00 season until now):

First Team:

G - Brandon Ewing - Probably the toughest choice on this list choosing between Ewing and Straight, but I am going with Brandon. The most dangerous player off the dribble to play for the Pokes in a long time. Not much bigger physically than Jeremy Lieberman, yet fearless going to the hole with an ability to get to the FT line at will.

G - Josh Adams - A year ago he wouldn't be in this spot, but the fact that he turned himself into an impact high volume 3-point shooter to go with the rest of his game vaults him into the starting lineup. He can do it all on the basketball court.

G/F - Marcus Bailey - The easiest choice on this list. I just looked up "Clutch" in the dictionary and there was Bailey. Best wing to play at UW since Dembo.

F - Josh Davis - Sure, he was MIA for long stretches of his senior season, but when the bright lights were on in March Madness against Gonzaga and Arizona, it wasn't Marcus Bailey or Dan Dickau (on a Top 10 team) that were the best players on the court..it was Josh Davis.

F - Larry Nance, Jr. - The knee injury and mono robbed us of seeing Nance quite reach his full potential at UW, which makes the fact that he is on this list even more impressive. A great rebounder (don't be misled by the total rebounds which are impacted by Shyatt's non offensive rebounding and slow tempo philosophies) and defender to go with a varied offensive threat and great FT shooting. Not to mention probably the best ambassador the program has ever had.

Second Team:

G - Jay Straight - Deciding between Ewing and Straight was very difficult. I give Straight a ton of credit for carrying a bad of misfits to a .500 MWC season his senior year in a much tougher MWC than what we have today. That team was better than 4 of 5 Shyatt seasons since his return (14-15 being the exception obviously), but the roster was very limited and the coaching was average at best.

G - Brad Jones - Another tough decision as there are a number of players, notably Richardson, that could be considered here, but I will always have a soft spot for Brad Jones. An absolute bulldog, who was probably about 5'10" 170. A tough on the ball defender who could get into the paint at will. What I really appreciated about Brad is that he turned himself from essentially a non-shooter into a decent perimeter shooter. His progression was what I hoped Adams would follow. Adams actually took it up a notch from there, but Jones development was impressive as well. Also, a fond memory of when it didn't seem insane for us to beat Creighton in a recruiting battle.

G/F - Afam Muojeke - Obviously a career that was cut short by injury. There are probably deserving guards and big men left off this list, but if I am trying to stick with some sort of lineups, I can't think of a better wing when healthy other than Bailey.

F - Justin Williams - Incredible shot blocker and ridiculous athlete.

C - Uche - Dominant physical presence in the paint.

Damn Nowhere this post is just spot on and really represents our fans well. Really appreciate the thought and knowledgeable breakdown. You just earned all my respect as a bball poster. Great great post :thumb: :thumb: :thumb:

Does anybody think Bailey could've gone pro without the knee injury? I kinda do. That guy was the MAN! This thread has gone so many places. It's been a meandering journey, but I like it! Almost like getting lost in Wyoming with nothing but time.

 

[Coeur d' Alene]

Just those 2 teams put together

Adams/straight/Riley
Donta
Bailey
Nance
Davis/cook/uche


Last 20 years


Adams/whitehead/Ewing
Bailey/Jeron Roberts
Davis
Nance/ugo
Theo/hl/DC/Justin Williams


Rest of my camp roster.

desmar Jackson, Anthony blakes
Greg sawyer/Afam/AJ Davis
Tham/Washington/uche/mingo
Straight/donta/mcmillan/brad jones
Mcman/Waddell/sly Johnson

 

[FarmerPoke]

Turned into a pretty fun thread!
My starting 5
Ewing
Adams
Bailey
Davis
Nance

2nd unit
Straight
Richardson
Muojeke
LWashington
Uche

Honorable mention: Justin Williams. I won't soon forget his triple double against Utah in the conference semifinal game in Denver in 2006. That was one of the most impressive individual performances in Wyo history and wouldn't have went to the championship game without him.

Also was torn whether or not to include Leonard Washington on this list, but did just because he was simply an animal to handle down low despite being a little undersized, I think he was the best undersized rebounder I've ever seen along with Tyson Johnson. Also I have a soft spot for ol Leonard simply because he owns my favorite dunk of all time, no disrespect to Adams and his nightly highlight reels! Against Illinois St on the road, enroute to that huge comeback where we were down 19 with like 11 minutes left and came back to win. Believe Martinez set the Wyo single game steals record that game. Washington jumped completely over a guy with a ferocious hammer and 1 dunk that kinda set the tone for the later comeback.

 

[LanderPoke]

Leonard Washington steal-breakaway dunks were the best! No one dunked more ferociously. DC was the second most ferocious dunker.

 

[Cosmic Cowboy]

Turned into a pretty fun thread!
My starting 5
Ewing
Adams
Bailey
Davis
Nance

2nd unit
Straight
Richardson
Muojeke
LWashington
Uche

Honorable mention: Justin Williams. I won't soon forget his triple double against Utah in the conference semifinal game in Denver in 2006. That was one of the most impressive individual performances in Wyo history and wouldn't have went to the championship game without him.

That's probably about right I'd say. A healthy Muojeke def in the there, he was sorta of our Penny Hardaway just in quick UW history. He was no doubter legend under our worst coach. I feel bad for him still. Hard to leave Williams off, I might switch him with Washington. Williams was a wrecking crew by himself in the paint, he almost counted as 2 bigs defensively. Blocks n Boards by that guy!! LOVED his game.

 

[WestWYOPoke]

Just those 2 teams put together

Last 20 years

Adams/whitehead/Ewing
Bailey/Jeron Roberts
Davis
Nance/ugo
Theo/hl/DC/Justin Williams

Theo got drafted in 1995, he's been gone for UW for over 20 years. We're all getting old.

 

[bladerunnr]

Interesting thread. My 2 cents: There was probably never a more talented athlete at UW than Justin Williams. He was a defensive force, a rebounding machine, and a must double team in the low post. I still can't believe we lost that title game in Denver to SDS when we had a 4 point lead with about 1 minute to go in OT. A win in that game might have given a new contract to McClain. Instead, he just got a 1 year reprieve.

Just remember, Shyatt took over a disaster. We were in the conference tournament play in game in almost every year Schroyer was coach. I'm a little disappointed that guys like Barnes haven't developed. That goes to show the hit and miss in recruiting. Even James development hasn't progressed like I thought it would. We are a respectable team in the conference now. No one takes us for granted. We are a big man away from being in the top tier.

Those unhappy with Shyatt, who would we get? Also, he has beat csewe 4 straight times. Try to remember the last time that happened.

I don't think anyone is saying we need to can Shyatt, my point was that others have been canned with similar careers. Who would we get? Who knows. Shaka Smart started somewhere. Were never going to attract Coach K but there are great coaches out there. Hopefully Shyatt gets these youngsters playing at a high, sustained level next season and we don't have to worry about any of this until he retires

I agree with you to a point. But no other Wyo. coach won a conference tournament. That gives Shyatt a leg up on all those coaches who came before him. But, yeah, I share your frustration. I think these losses to Nevada and Air force are pretty lame. The talent level on this current Wyoming team is pretty limited. Yeah, were young, but I don't see much star power on this team. Maybe Naughton or James but I see a lot of role players getting significant minutes. I think another under 500 conference record next year will start some grumbling. This conference is just not that good.

 

[Coeur d' Alene]

Just those 2 teams put together

Last 20 years

Adams/whitehead/Ewing
Bailey/Jeron Roberts
Davis
Nance/ugo
Theo/hl/DC/Justin Williams

Theo got drafted in 1995, he's been gone for UW for over 20 years. We're all getting old.

theo was good enough to use him as his own time period. It's Theo on then.

I think one of the things you can see when you look at the last 20 or so rosters are patterns. One pattern is (esp among the decent or better teams) seems to alway be small at the 2-3 and usually (until recently at the 4)

Depth has almost always been an issue.


That's what intrigues me so much about this years team. "Could be" big on the wings and at the 4. And could use depth better than they do. Adams had to get back to the point. McM, James, gorski need to be a 3 man rotation. And if they're going to play all 4 bigs then they better play harder and more physical. I still think there's a chance for this team to be a memorable one. Adams is that good when you look at what Wyoming has had over the last 20 years you realize he is way up there on the special list

 

[Coeur d' Alene]

The last 25 year team bring in Reginald Slater. I always thought Tim Breaux was awesome. Maybe it was just from being a kid but I alway thought Breaux was awesome?