Truly Pathetic

[Kwyo]

It was so pathetic.

Why can't none of our players stop Colton Iverson?

 

[Kwyo]

josh adams should be benched next year if he can't make jumpper.

 

[NowherePoke]

josh adams should be benched next year if he can't make jumpper.

Give him some time. True freshman and I thought he really brought some nice effort defensively. Obviously needs to work on the perimeter shot, but I feel like Adams can be a key part of this program over the next 4 years.

 

[UfuknDub]

Wyoming Cowboys suck and will suck for a long time.

 

[BackHarlowRoad]

the 50s/60s were a completely different time. Not to mention a different kind of athlete. Teenagers back then cared about more things than money, bitches, and fame (none of which Wyoming can offer). The success we saw at any time after that was not consistent. It was a run of a couple good seasons and then back to mediocrity.

 

[Wyokie]

the 50s/60s were a completely different time. Not to mention a different kind of athlete. Teenagers back then cared about more things than money, bitches, and fame. The success we saw at any time after that was not consistent. It was a run of a couple good seasons and then back to mediocrity.

Plus, being on T.V. wasn't a big deal back then as well. Wyoming just aint sexy enough for national T.V.

 

[calpoke25]

Here's what I think we should do. This goes for both basketball and football. Hire and fire coaches over and over and over and never find any results but continue to blame coaching for our mediocrity. We should never come to terms with the fact that good quality athletes for these sports simply don't want to live in Wyoming. That way we can always have unrealistic expectations and then at the end of the season we all turn on each other and bicker and hate life.

Sound about right? Let's get real here, folks. Wrestling is about the only sport we offer where country boys can be NCAA material and be perfectly content living in Laramie. Every other sport requires city guys for decent talent, and Laramie is unappealing for them. No coach can change that.

While I agree simply hiring and firing coaches by the dozens at the drop of a hat is a bad idea, there are plenty of programs in locations such as Manhattan KS, Stillwater OK, Ames IA, Boise ID, that really aren't that different than Laramie. It's very common for major state universities in the west/midwest to not be in the largest metropolitan areas. Laramie isn't for everyone, but neither are those places mentioned above. If a kid from LA can't handle Laramie, he likely isn't going to handle any of those places either and will end up playing at a school like SDSU, UNLV, etc. We aren't going to win that battle, but that's not a battle we are fighting anyway.

If you want to talk about the elephant in the room that really holds our programs back (besides awful coaching hires like Shryoer/Koenning) IMO it is our relatively abysmal fan support. Now I am sure people will say, "well I have better things to do than go spend my money watching a losing team in cold weather..." but the difference between a November home game in Laramie and a November home game in Lawrence, Kansas has nothing to do with Lawrence, Kansas being such a more appealing place to live than Laramie, or the weather in Lawrence, Kansas being so much better than Laramie, the real difference has to do with the fact that they still draw over 40K to watch their 1-11 Kansas Jayhawks lose 23-51 to 6-7 Iowa St., whereas in Laramie we draw 20K to watch our team play and beat their archrival CSU and 13K, yes only 13K to watch our team have a chance to spoil eventual league co-champ SDSU's season.

 

[J-Rod]

Manhattan KS, Stillwater OK, Ames IA, Boise ID,

I'm a nit-picking asshole...... Your examples are correct, except for one.....

Manhatten - 53K population
Stillwater - 46K population
Ames - 59K population
Boise - 210K population (and that is not including the greater area of Boise, that's just the city. Metropolitan population is 616K. Boise is no small town.)

 

[NowherePoke]

the 50s/60s were a completely different time. Not to mention a different kind of athlete. Teenagers back then cared about more things than money, bitches, and fame (none of which Wyoming can offer). The success we saw at any time after that was not consistent. It was a run of a couple good seasons and then back to mediocrity.

Teenage boys have never cared about anything other than women, notoriety, and money and the last two are only relevant in terms of their ability to help with the first.

50/60's are largely irrelevant though, I will grant you that much, but in terms of basketball, we have never been this bad in the modern era (our 3 worst conference years in the last 35 have occurred in the last 4 years). We were very good in the 80's, competitive in the 90's, and started off the 00's with a couple of conference titles. That isn't that long ago.

 

[NowherePoke]

Here's what I think we should do. This goes for both basketball and football. Hire and fire coaches over and over and over and never find any results but continue to blame coaching for our mediocrity. We should never come to terms with the fact that good quality athletes for these sports simply don't want to live in Wyoming. That way we can always have unrealistic expectations and then at the end of the season we all turn on each other and bicker and hate life.

Sound about right? Let's get real here, folks. Wrestling is about the only sport we offer where country boys can be NCAA material and be perfectly content living in Laramie. Every other sport requires city guys for decent talent, and Laramie is unappealing for them. No coach can change that.

While I agree simply hiring and firing coaches by the dozens at the drop of a hat is a bad idea, there are plenty of programs in locations such as Manhattan KS, Stillwater OK, Ames IA, Boise ID, that really aren't that different than Laramie. It's very common for major state universities in the west/midwest to not be in the largest metropolitan areas. Laramie isn't for everyone, but neither are those places mentioned above. If a kid from LA can't handle Laramie, he likely isn't going to handle any of those places either and will end up playing at a school like SDSU, UNLV, etc. We aren't going to win that battle, but that's not a battle we are fighting anyway.

If you want to talk about the elephant in the room that really holds our programs back (besides awful coaching hires like Shryoer/Koenning) IMO it is our relatively abysmal fan support. Now I am sure people will say, "well I have better things to do than go spend my money watching a losing team in cold weather..." but the difference between a November home game in Laramie and a November home game in Lawrence, Kansas has nothing to do with Lawrence, Kansas being such a more appealing place to live than Laramie, or the weather in Lawrence, Kansas being so much better than Laramie, the real difference has to do with the fact that they still draw over 40K to watch their 1-11 Kansas Jayhawks lose 23-51 to 6-7 Iowa St., whereas in Laramie we draw 20K to watch our team play and beat their archrival CSU and 13K, yes only 13K to watch our team have a chance to spoil eventual league co-champ SDSU's season.

I don't disagree in regards to football, but I don't think the same holds true for hoops. When we were having even modest success we could draw 8-10k (actually averaged 13k one year at the very peak) which is very competitive nationally even with programs in the PAC, etc. Even this year, coming off a 8 year run of futility, the crowds were getting up to 9k before it fell apart and we sold out our MWC tourney allotment in January or something (we are also nationally competitive in Women's basketball support, although I realize that isn't going to drive anything).

Even as we languish at the bottom of the league, we have outdrawn CSU this year and are comparable to BSU. Looking at the PAC12 we outdraw 4 PAC12 schools and are comparable to Arizona State. If Wyoming could win at a NIT level, we could easily match Oregon, Washington, and CAL (7500-8000 type range) in attendance.

 

[SDPokeFan]

Here's what I think we should do. This goes for both basketball and football. Hire and fire coaches over and over and over and never find any results but continue to blame coaching for our mediocrity. We should never come to terms with the fact that good quality athletes for these sports simply don't want to live in Wyoming. That way we can always have unrealistic expectations and then at the end of the season we all turn on each other and bicker and hate life.

Sound about right? Let's get real here, folks. Wrestling is about the only sport we offer where country boys can be NCAA material and be perfectly content living in Laramie. Every other sport requires city guys for decent talent, and Laramie is unappealing for them. No coach can change that.

While I agree simply hiring and firing coaches by the dozens at the drop of a hat is a bad idea, there are plenty of programs in locations such as Manhattan KS, Stillwater OK, Ames IA, Boise ID, that really aren't that different than Laramie. It's very common for major state universities in the west/midwest to not be in the largest metropolitan areas. Laramie isn't for everyone, but neither are those places mentioned above. If a kid from LA can't handle Laramie, he likely isn't going to handle any of those places either and will end up playing at a school like SDSU, UNLV, etc. We aren't going to win that battle, but that's not a battle we are fighting anyway.

If you want to talk about the elephant in the room that really holds our programs back (besides awful coaching hires like Shryoer/Koenning) IMO it is our relatively abysmal fan support. Now I am sure people will say, "well I have better things to do than go spend my money watching a losing team in cold weather..." but the difference between a November home game in Laramie and a November home game in Lawrence, Kansas has nothing to do with Lawrence, Kansas being such a more appealing place to live than Laramie, or the weather in Lawrence, Kansas being so much better than Laramie, the real difference has to do with the fact that they still draw over 40K to watch their 1-11 Kansas Jayhawks lose 23-51 to 6-7 Iowa St., whereas in Laramie we draw 20K to watch our team play and beat their archrival CSU and 13K, yes only 13K to watch our team have a chance to spoil eventual league co-champ SDSU's season.

Put a product on the court/field that is worth watching, and the crowds will come. When Josh Davis and the boys were winning the conference, crowds routinely were over 10k.

And Kansas Cowboy, as long as you continue to say "close losses are a success," I will continue to shake my head at you. It's that attitude that holds programs back.

 

[kansasCowboy]

Here's what I think we should do. This goes for both basketball and football. Hire and fire coaches over and over and over and never find any results but continue to blame coaching for our mediocrity. We should never come to terms with the fact that good quality athletes for these sports simply don't want to live in Wyoming. That way we can always have unrealistic expectations and then at the end of the season we all turn on each other and bicker and hate life.

Sound about right? Let's get real here, folks. Wrestling is about the only sport we offer where country boys can be NCAA material and be perfectly content living in Laramie. Every other sport requires city guys for decent talent, and Laramie is unappealing for them. No coach can change that.

While I agree simply hiring and firing coaches by the dozens at the drop of a hat is a bad idea, there are plenty of programs in locations such as Manhattan KS, Stillwater OK, Ames IA, Boise ID, that really aren't that different than Laramie. It's very common for major state universities in the west/midwest to not be in the largest metropolitan areas. Laramie isn't for everyone, but neither are those places mentioned above. If a kid from LA can't handle Laramie, he likely isn't going to handle any of those places either and will end up playing at a school like SDSU, UNLV, etc. We aren't going to win that battle, but that's not a battle we are fighting anyway.

If you want to talk about the elephant in the room that really holds our programs back (besides awful coaching hires like Shryoer/Koenning) IMO it is our relatively abysmal fan support. Now I am sure people will say, "well I have better things to do than go spend my money watching a losing team in cold weather..." but the difference between a November home game in Laramie and a November home game in Lawrence, Kansas has nothing to do with Lawrence, Kansas being such a more appealing place to live than Laramie, or the weather in Lawrence, Kansas being so much better than Laramie, the real difference has to do with the fact that they still draw over 40K to watch their 1-11 Kansas Jayhawks lose 23-51 to 6-7 Iowa St., whereas in Laramie we draw 20K to watch our team play and beat their archrival CSU and 13K, yes only 13K to watch our team have a chance to spoil eventual league co-champ SDSU's season.

Put a product on the court/field that is worth watching, and the crowds will come. When Josh Davis and the boys were winning the conference, crowds routinely were over 10k.

And Kansas Cowboy, as long as you continue to say "close losses are a success," I will continue to shake my head at you. It's that attitude that holds programs back.

Shake your head all you want, but losing by a close margin to an opp with a stronger talent level than our own is far better than losing to that same opp with the same stronger talent level than our own. That would mean? Our talent level is getting back on track to where we were with Davis and company. But seriously, do you really expect us to gain that talent in one year?
I will continue to shake my head at you for being completely irrational and apparently wanting to live in a fairy tale than real life. We can go back and forth at this over and over again, so have your thoughts, I'll have my own.

 

[Wyokie]

So, Kansas, you like moral victories? BULLSHIT! Moral victories are for little kids learning the game in 5th or 6th grade. Actual victories are far more important.

A loss is a loss is a loss....whether it's by 1 pt. or by 50!!!!

 

[kansasCowboy]

So, Kansas, you like moral victories? BULLSHIT! Moral victories are for little kids learning the game in 5th or 6th grade. Actual victories are far more important.

A loss is a loss is a loss....whether it's by 1 pt. or by 50!!!!

No, that is not what I'm saying. I like the fact that we are winning (18-12, far better than 10-21). Would I prefer to be 24-6? No doubt.
I like the fact that our coach is actually coaching and we are having better results (hence closer losses and some good wins.) But in reality with what this program had to endure for 8 years (4 years of mediocrity under McClain and 4 years of pure crap from Schroyer) I think "WE ARE ON OUR WAY". But by all means "NOT THERE YET"
So, why do I need to constantly complain, when we all know that we aren't at that level of competitiveness?

Seriously, When we were losing to SDSU by 30 plus and UNLV and UNM by 25 to 30 plus a night under Schroyer with more talent than we have now. And now we are playing these teams with lack of depth and less talent (less talent, meaning Very young, and the majority of the talent we did have, left for supposed "greener pastures") close and even pulling our W's.
So, now from any coaches perspective (you know, the people who actually see reality) When you have taken a program who lost its top talent to transfer, you gain "no viable recruits for two years, and the two years prior this program has gone 10-21 and you still go 21-12, you then get your recruits some valuable playing time and have a star player lost, and then have injuries and illness to the rest of your reliable players and still manage 18-12? I will call that success. Yes we had a drop off which was hard to swallow this year, but the overall picture shows we are gaining ground. That's why I won't complain.

 

[Wyokie]

So, Kansas, you like moral victories? BULLSHIT! Moral victories are for little kids learning the game in 5th or 6th grade. Actual victories are far more important.

A loss is a loss is a loss....whether it's by 1 pt. or by 50!!!!

No, that is not what I'm saying. I like the fact that we are winning (18-12, far better than 10-21). Would I prefer to be 24-6? No doubt.

Oh, crap....I feel a bit stupid. Accidently thought you were talking about the football program. Don't mind me. I've had a rough day. Don't ask.

 

[kansasCowboy]

So, Kansas, you like moral victories? BULLSHIT! Moral victories are for little kids learning the game in 5th or 6th grade. Actual victories are far more important.

A loss is a loss is a loss....whether it's by 1 pt. or by 50!!!!

No, that is not what I'm saying. I like the fact that we are winning (18-12, far better than 10-21). Would I prefer to be 24-6? No doubt.

Oh, crap....I feel a bit stupid. Accidently thought you were talking about the football program. Don't mind me. I've had a rough day. Don't ask.

Hey, I'll take it. No problem. I know those rough days...

 

[Wyokie]

So, Kansas, you like moral victories? BULLSHIT! Moral victories are for little kids learning the game in 5th or 6th grade. Actual victories are far more important.

A loss is a loss is a loss....whether it's by 1 pt. or by 50!!!!

No, that is not what I'm saying. I like the fact that we are winning (18-12, far better than 10-21). Would I prefer to be 24-6? No doubt.

Oh, crap....I feel a bit stupid. Accidently thought you were talking about the football program. Don't mind me. I've had a rough day. Don't ask.

Hey, I'll take it. No problem. I know those rough days...

Getting old is a pain in the ass. For those in their 20s and early 30s, enjoy them. Once you get old, :roll:

 

[J-Rod]

No, that is not what I'm saying. I like the fact that we are winning (18-12, far better than 10-21). Would I prefer to be 24-6? No doubt.
I like the fact that our coach is actually coaching and we are having better results (hence closer losses and some good wins.) But in reality with what this program had to endure for 8 years (4 years of mediocrity under McClain and 4 years of pure crap from Schroyer) I think "WE ARE ON OUR WAY". But by all means "NOT THERE YET"
So, why do I need to constantly complain, when we all know that we aren't at that level of competitiveness?

Seriously, When we were losing to SDSU by 30 plus and UNLV and UNM by 25 to 30 plus a night under Schroyer with more talent than we have now. And now we are playing these teams with lack of depth and less talent (less talent, meaning Very young, and the majority of the talent we did have, left for supposed "greener pastures") close and even pulling our W's.
So, now from any coaches perspective (you know, the people who actually see reality) When you have taken a program who lost its top talent to transfer, you gain "no viable recruits for two years, and the two years prior this program has gone 10-21 and you still go 21-12, you then get your recruits some valuable playing time and have a star player lost, and then have injuries and illness to the rest of your reliable players and still manage 18-12? I will call that success. Yes we had a drop off which was hard to swallow this year, but the overall picture shows we are gaining ground. That's why I won't complain.

I honestly can't say I've read all the posts in this forum, but is anyone really calling out Shyatt? From Martinez's arrest to the many close results, UW was just plain unlucky at times. CDC deserves his criticisms, he went 4-8 in a pathetic football conference. The MWC is a Top 3 basketball conference whether the east coast writers like it or not....this is a damn tough conference. Look at BSU getting all this recognition now for basketball, and they're finished freaking 5th......that is rarely anything to write home about.....unless you play in a really tough conference. Shyatt deserves time.....in the MWC, nobody can afford the setbacks this team had....its a death sentence.

 

[bladerunnr]

I honestly can't say I've read all the posts in this forum, but is anyone really calling out Shyatt? From Martinez's arrest to the many close results, UW was just plain unlucky at times. CDC deserves his criticisms, he went 4-8 in a pathetic football conference. The MWC is a Top 3 basketball conference whether the east coast writers like it or not....this is a damn tough conference. Look at BSU getting all this recognition now for basketball, and they're finished freaking 5th......that is rarely anything to write home about.....unless you play in a really tough conference. Shyatt deserves time.....in the MWC, nobody can afford the setbacks this team had....its a death sentence.

I don't think anyone is calling for Shyatt's head. The question is: have we progressed all that much? Some, like myself, are skeptical. Obviously, we are in much better hands now than with Schroyer. However, let's consider the 13-0 start. Only 2 of those wins (DU and CU at home) were against teams that had an rpi higher than 100. Many of those wins were against teams with an rpi of lower than 200.

Contrary to many posts on this board, I didn't feel we were particularly competitive in conference, especially on the road.

Having said all that, I think Shyatt deserves a few more years. At that point, progress would be a 6th place or higher finish in the conference. I understand a coach needs time. But I don't want another Vic or Joby Wright. I realize the challenges that go with coaching in Laramie. Not being in a major market and the lack of tv coverage on a major network has not helped matters. I vow to be patient and keep the negative posts to a minimum. Hopefully, we can get a win today. I don't believe Schroyer ever won a play in game. It would be nice to get to the main draw.

 

[calpoke25]

Actually Shroyer did win a 1st round game over New Mexico in the 3-6 game I believe.