THIS SUCKS!

[DocHolliday]

For whatever it's worth - I have never understood the vitriolic rantings of some against Burman.

I give him major kudos for snagging Bohl, and for those here who love to defend Shyatt as though he walks on water, do you not have to point in the direction of Burman for hiring him?

Correct me if I am wrong but was it not Burman who helped to spearhead the Wildcatter Club at The War?

Was it not Burman who will direct the continuing upgrades to The War?

Sure CSU is getting a new stadium - but they need one - while our stadium is more than fine.

Was it not Burman who was in charge when the renovations of the AA began - and continue to this day?

Rebranding? Like how? Please explain this to me.

Christensen looked the part and turned out to be the wrong fit - okay, so what? He rebounded very well with Bohl.

So far as the non-revenue sports I'm not overly concerned with them in all candor. My points of emphasis have to do with the football and basketball programs pretty exclusively.

I'm not a wrestling fan, I don't follow or really care about college golf or swimming, and so far as women's sports are concerned they practically don't even exist in my mind.

If one were to be objective you would need to acknowledge that Burman has done as good a job as can be expected within the parameters of the budget - no?

His personality is not even close to that of a Jack Graham, so the comparison is not really relevant.

Would I like to see a more robust and a more demanding Tom Burman? Yes, and who knows, maybe behind closed doors he is more forceful than what he appears in an external environment.

If he can please replace the awful sound system at The War where we can actually clearly hear the P.A. announcer (who is awful by the way & I understand a CSU alum?) he'll get better marks in my book.

Overall I believe Burman has done a solid job to this point pending further results.

 

[fromolwyoming]

Not going to pile on the "Burman sucks!" Bandwagon either. He did royally fuck up with the whole Schroyer thing several years ago, but has brought in Shyatt who is rebuilding the program.

He hired DC several years ago, and at the time it looked like a great hire by a lot of people. And then we learned the hard way what kind of a coach he really was. His issues have been rehashed so often, no point in re-posting them again.

Then after getting rid of DC, he brings in Bohl who turned NDSU into a juggernaut at the FCS level and won 3 straight titles before coming here. Yeah, the first year was painful, especially with the freak amount of injuries we had. But there was marked improvement in nearly every facet of the game. The o-line actually began gelling and looking like an o-line when they finally stopped having injuries. Our 3rd string QB who in previous years, had struggled in just throwing the ball, turned into a serviceable game manager at QB. Defense actually hung in there for the most part (until the injuries proved too much), whereas in previous years they would basically lay down on the ground and let the offense do what they wanted. We may still have another year or two of "ouch" before we really see a good bump in the W/L column.

Wrestling, slam dunk hire with Branch. Our most successful and consistent program over the last 5-6 years. Conference titles, All-Americans, Top 25 rankings consistently, knocking off big time programs, and competing well at the NCAA tourney.

The rest of the sports I'm impartial too. If they do well, great, but they're not high on my list. And if we never have baseball again, I'm fine with that. I do not like baseball. Playing it is alright, but outside of that (and 2-3 movies), I do not like it.

 

[BeaverPoke]

Lol we did not improve last season in football. In any way.

 

[J-Rod]

Lol we did not improve last season in football. In any way.

It was a mixed bag. One step forward, one step back. The offense should be better in 2015, but the defense is a good bet to be one of the MW's worst too.

I get what you're saying though. Outside if the Fresno game, the other wins weren't impressive performances. Spent a season's worth of luck on that FAU game. Losses to Hawaii (Chow has 8 wins in 3 years), San Jose in Laramie, and the horror loss on senior night are hard to swallow.

Briefly showed signs of promise? One could argue yes. Improvement overall? Eh...2013 wasn't THAT bad.

 

[wellpoke]

For whatever it's worth - I have never understood the vitriolic rantings of some against Burman.

He brought in Shroyer, amid what looked like major shenanigans to some. And Shroyer effectively killed Wyoming basketball. This to many - especially many on these message boards - is unforgivable. Burman will forever be affected and held responsible for that.

IMO, he's also being held responsible for a lack of vision and commitment from his predecessors, clear back to Lee Moon.

For the most part, I agree with you about Burman. I think it took him about five years to convince the dept, university leadership, and the legislature that he was here to stay, and did have a vision for Wyoming athletics. We're only just now seeing that come to fruition through the renovated AA, upgrades at the War, and increases in coaches salaries.

Now that's all got to translate to wins on the field/court, or the heat on Burman will get worse.

GO POKES!

 

[SnowyRange]

Lol we did not improve last season in football. In any way.

Oh, yes we did.

 

[BeaverPoke]

Lol we did not improve last season in football. In any way.

Oh, yes we did.

At the end of the day, we still got destroyed by bigger and better teams than us. Couldn't close out close games after the first third of the season like the San Jose State game, and went from 5-7 to 4-8. Really improved huh?

Oh but wait. "Bohl brought an attitude and is bringing back Cowboy Tough". Got it.

 

[SnowyRange]

At the end of the day, we still got destroyed by bigger and better teams than us. Couldn't close out close games after the first third of the season like the San Jose State game, and went from 5-7 to 4-8. Really improved huh?

Oh but wait. "Bohl brought an attitude and is bringing back Cowboy Tough". Got it.

Oh, it's a whole different program than it was 16 months ago, from top to bottom.

But, if you were expecting that with "vision" -- a favorite phrase on these boards -- someone could come in and sprinkle pixie dust on everybody and go 10 and 2, well....yes, I can see why you're sour.

 

[ragtimejoe1]

lol. Burman is a genius for hiring Bohl and Shyatt but it is forgivable for hiring Schroyer and DC? You can't have it both ways, and hell, he EXTENDED both DC and Schroyer.

Look, we are DECLINING in our competitive and financial positions within the MWC. When Burman started, our budget was more than CSU's. Now? They've surpassed us. Three of the biggest budget and most successful programs leave; we invite a bunch of WAC teams; and we regress in the reformed MWC.

Burman has no vision. His plan is ask the State for money to keep WYO competitive. Hell, we have to be competitive first. How about a plan to make us champions. Our Burman ceiling is not WYO's ceiling.

Rebranding you ask? Good point; maybe just some branding. Alumni engagement would be a good start. State engagement. Game day atmosphere. Something. Anything other than poor us. We are so isolated and our job is so hard.

You want evidence of lack of vision? Burman when DC was hired he spoke about difficulties of recruiting to Wyoming and how the spread was the only way to go in order to overcome talent deficiencies. Then he does a 180 with Bohl and talks about the importance of smash mouth football. That is a clear symptom of a man without vision for the program.

Riddle me this? How much worse could it possibly have been the past 8 years if we had any primate in Burman's job as opposed to Burman himself? I'll give you a hint; not much.

 

[HiCountryCowboy]

Show me a trophy! All this other shit is supposed to lead to banners and we are not getting it done anywhere. As has been said ad nauseum, it starts with poor ol' Tom.

I sometimes find myself discounting other programs like like those in the MAC, Sunbelt, and C-USA and have recently come to realize that, right now and with our only non-MWC sanctioned sport being the exception, Wyoming teams strike no fear in anyone within the MWC or any other conferences (including our 1-AA football foes). Don't want to admit it but we are an ALSO RAN! Records don't lie - especially for this length of time. THAT rests squarely on Tom's shoulders.

 

[DocHolliday]

lol. Burman is a genius for hiring Bohl and Shyatt but it is forgivable for hiring Schroyer and DC? You can't have it both ways, and hell, he EXTENDED both DC and Schroyer.

Look, we are DECLINING in our competitive and financial positions within the MWC. When Burman started, our budget was more than CSU's. Now? They've surpassed us. Three of the biggest budget and most successful programs leave; we invite a bunch of WAC teams; and we regress in the reformed MWC.

Burman has no vision. His plan is ask the State for money to keep WYO competitive. Hell, we have to be competitive first. How about a plan to make us champions. Our Burman ceiling is not WYO's ceiling.

Rebranding you ask? Good point; maybe just some branding. Alumni engagement would be a good start. State engagement. Game day atmosphere. Something. Anything other than poor us. We are so isolated and our job is so hard.

You want evidence of lack of vision? Burman when DC was hired he spoke about difficulties of recruiting to Wyoming and how the spread was the only way to go in order to overcome talent deficiencies. Then he does a 180 with Bohl and talks about the importance of smash mouth football. That is a clear symptom of a man without vision for the program.

Riddle me this? How much worse could it possibly have been the past 8 years if we had any primate in Burman's job as opposed to Burman himself? I'll give you a hint; not much.

The fact that he swung and missed with Schroyer and DC isn't forgivable? No shot at redemption? One hire for each sport and that's it? Ultimately DC turned out to be the wrong fit - but does Burman get any credit for hiring a coach in DC that culminated in 2 Bowl trips? His re-directs in both sports are much better hires and fits. How many AD's have made hires that did not work out? Look it I'm not here as an apologist for Tom Burman, but I think that the criticism goes well past where it should be. If we lose tonight against Utah State I can practically see the messages here already that it was somehow connected to Burman. Us not getting to the NCAA Tournament again this season, it's Burman's fault. CBI 3 years running - again, Berman's fault. Craig Bohl's unattractive sideline apparel last season? Berman's fault, of course.

Besides tuitions the state by far and away (unless Gerry Spence writes a huge check) is the University's best source for revenue on a year in and year out basis. You cite chapter and verse your critical points - but you seem to offer nothing in the way of alternate plans of action. So stop asking the state for money and..? Look it, I think the way to raise more revenue is through things like installing brown & gold seats at the stadium the way that CSU did a few years ago and having people pony up some $ for them - but really how much more $ are we talking. Give me a substantive plan of action that will allow us to reap more consistent streams of revenue because I'm all ears.

Gameday atmosphere? Here I will cede you some ground. Removing Tailgate Park was a big mistake IMO. The in-game entertainment during stoppages in play at The War are poorly produced. The sound system is amateurishly bad, and the PA Announcer sounds like a track announcer at a local OTB parlor giving out the winning tickets. The guy has zero presence and they should hire a new voice - or at the very least let the guy who does the basketball games do the football games.

So far as outreach is concerned I believe a Cowboy Caravan should canvass the state each year spreading the gospel so to speak of Wyoming Football and Basketball. However the fact of the matter is that the isolation of many of the communities and their respective populations provides UW with many more challenges than virtually all other D-1 schools...on the other hand I'd like to see the level of community outreach upgraded and enhanced.

Overall I previously stated that Burman has done a good to above average job in most areas factoring in the myriad elements and moving parts that are a part of the landscape that he and others in his position are confronted with daily.

I maintain this feeling to date...pending a further review that should be fluid at all times.

 

[ItSucksToBeACSURam]

Show me a trophy! All this other shit is supposed to lead to banners and we are not getting it done anywhere. As has been said ad nauseum, it starts with poor ol' Tom.

I sometimes find myself discounting other programs like like those in the MAC, Sunbelt, and C-USA and have recently come to realize that, right now and with our only non-MWC sanctioned sport being the exception, Wyoming teams strike no fear in anyone within the MWC or any other conferences (including our 1-AA football foes). Don't want to admit it but we are an ALSO RAN! Records don't lie - especially for this length of time. THAT rests squarely on Tom's shoulders.

So...When we do start winning championships, he gets the credit right? Since coaches, assistants, and players have no share of the blame, they get no share of the glory. There is a lot that truly is a direct result of Tom, but he's not out on the road recruiting players, he's not in the gyms pushing guys to get better, he's not the one on the field (court) under performing. Tom Burman didn't go out and kick a knocked out dude in the face just like Tom Burman didn't start Howdy Doody-gate. He can control what he can control, and he should be held accountable for that. There is plenty that is not his fault.

 

[McPeachy]

Here we go again...

A dried up Irish Setter dog turd could have maintained...what has been maintained...athletically, at the University of Wyoming. He has cultured and grown a breeding ground for mediocrity and apathy. He works as little as possible, as little as he can, and has assembled a staff that rivals the three stooges, but with less skill, and less presence. He has dummied down the department to a very comfortable level...and will forever keep it that way. He has done nothing to buck the trend, to rock the boat...to create the sleeping giant that Wyoming athletics even once was.

If you give Burman credit for hiring and winning, you have to give him credit for hiring and losing, and firing and losing. And extending and still losing. And all that other shit. But...take that all out of the equation, and the guy is about as lazy and uninspiring an athletic director as we could have. But he gets a free pass, because he is a "Wyoming Guy." And he gets a free pass, because by and large, Wyoming fans of today - DON"T KNOW WHAT IT IS LIKE TO BE A WINNER...and most are fine with that...as there is always next year.

:thumbdown:

 

[DocHolliday]

Here we go again...

A dried up Irish Setter dog turd could have maintained...what has been maintained...athletically, at the University of Wyoming. He has cultured and grown a breeding ground for mediocrity and apathy. He works as little as possible, as little as he can, and has assembled a staff that rivals the three stooges, but with less skill, and less presence. He has dummied down the department to a very comfortable level...and will forever keep it that way. He has done nothing to buck the trend, to rock the boat...to create the sleeping giant that Wyoming athletics even once was.

If you give Burman credit for hiring and winning, you have to give him credit for hiring and losing, and firing and losing. And extending and still losing. And all that other shit. But...take that all out of the equation, and the guy is about as lazy and uninspiring an athletic director as we could have. But he gets a free pass, because he is a "Wyoming Guy." And he gets a free pass, because by and large, Wyoming fans of today - DON"T KNOW WHAT IT IS LIKE TO BE A WINNER...and most are fine with that...as there is always next year.

:thumbdown:

McPeachy I more than respect what you wrote, but while your note is long on hearsay, it is short on substance and details.

In regard to your points about Burman being lazy and his staff being incompetent, would you kindly provide some information about these two elements with some specifics?

I look forward to your more detailed response to bolster your argument and points of view.

 

[SnowyRange]

A dried up Irish Setter dog turd could have maintained...what has been maintained...athletically, at the University of Wyoming. He has cultured and grown a breeding ground for mediocrity and apathy. He works as little as possible, as little as he can, and has assembled a staff that rivals the three stooges, but with less skill, and less presence.

Not so.

But, in any event, all blame always falls on ADs. That's just the way the world works, as they sit at the top of the pyramid. And when there is credit to dish out, not so much trickles up.

It just goes with the territory, which is why ADs last on average about 7 years.

 

[HiCountryCowboy]

Show me a trophy! All this other shit is supposed to lead to banners and we are not getting it done anywhere. As has been said ad nauseum, it starts with poor ol' Tom.

I sometimes find myself discounting other programs like like those in the MAC, Sunbelt, and C-USA and have recently come to realize that, right now and with our only non-MWC sanctioned sport being the exception, Wyoming teams strike no fear in anyone within the MWC or any other conferences (including our 1-AA football foes). Don't want to admit it but we are an ALSO RAN! Records don't lie - especially for this length of time. THAT rests squarely on Tom's shoulders.

So...When we do start winning championships, he gets the credit right? Since coaches, assistants, and players have no share of the blame, they get no share of the glory. There is a lot that truly is a direct result of Tom, but he's not out on the road recruiting players, he's not in the gyms pushing guys to get better, he's not the one on the field (court) under performing. Tom Burman didn't go out and kick a knocked out dude in the face just like Tom Burman didn't start Howdy Doody-gate. He can control what he can control, and he should be held accountable for that. There is plenty that is not his fault.

When do you think we'll start winning championships? I mean that honestly. I guess we came close w/Women's Soccer this year, but I can't think of another "near miss" in recent history besides that. If you think it is football, we've got a long wait cause even if we see dramatic improvement, Boise will still manhandle us. Night and day, us vs. them...

 

[ragtimejoe1]

Anyone stop to think that our limitations might be because of Burman? Maybe we don't have donors because we don't have leadership. Somehow he convinced fans that his incompetence is an inherent challenge at WYO through no fault of his. Amazing.

A leader is a leader in title only if no one follows.

 

[ItSucksToBeACSURam]

Anyone stop to think that our limitations might be because of Burman? Maybe we don't have donors because we don't have leadership. Somehow he convinced fans that his incompetence is an inherent challenge at WYO through no fault of his. Amazing.

A leader is a leader in title only if no one follows.

This is quite possible. Attack him for things like this, the in the floor/court shortcomings can't be all on him too

 

[jessejames02]

I want Bohl and Shyatt to do well and think they will. If they do, Burman stays. If either of them is a bust Burman should be out too regardless of how the other does.

 

[BJC]

"(unless Gerry Spence writes a huge check)"

Gerry Spence...the people's hero.....not sure if he is a good man but his Law Firm......can kick rocks.

So much for sticking up for the little guy. Sorry for the rant :tickedoff: