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MW Media Days

ragtimejoe1 said:
Those programs have had some success in some years over the past few years in mbb or fb. I'm assuming they and suds outdo is in ad department spending and nil.

csu outspends most of the mwc so they must have 0 nil??

If there is a pac2/mwc merger, we better just jump to fcs. We won't stand a chance with 2 more teams that have bigger budgets and I'm sure more nil.
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It's possible to be bad for multiple reasons. Maybe you have no investment, bad coaching, bad department vision, and a marginal national brand that puts a low ceiling on recruiting. Fixing 3 of those 4 may move the needle some but not much. If you rate the MWC programs on those metrics....BSU is high in all of them. Wyoming has competed ok (in football) with the non BSU teams in the league...I just can't see us ever having a dominant stretch like BSU has had no matter who is the coach.

I'm assuming the calls to drop to fcs are made in some sort of jest.
 
307bball said:
It's possible to be bad for multiple reasons. Maybe you have no investment, bad coaching, bad department vision, and a marginal national brand that puts a low ceiling on recruiting. Fixing 3 of those 4 may move the needle some but not much. If you rate the MWC programs on those metrics....BSU is high in all of them. Wyoming has competed ok (in football) with the non BSU teams in the league...I just can't see us ever having a dominant stretch like BSU has had no matter who is the coach.

I'm assuming the calls to drop to fcs are made in some sort of jest.
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Not in jest. If the best we can hope for, should wsu and osu be a part of our conference, is 8th place or worse due to spending and nil, then fcs might be a better option.

The bsu crap is like the air raid crap. Nobody is thinking wyo will be a bsu or bohl needed an air raid offense. I guess fsu, sjsu, and usu are out of reach too. Must be all the nil money, I guess.

Of current members:
Football titles bsu-5; fsu-4; csu-3; suds-3; sjsu-1; usu-1

Wbb csu-7; bsu-7; unm-7; suds-7; fresno-7; unlv-3; wyo-1

Mbb (tourney and reg season combined) suds-16; unm-9; nv-4; unlv-4; bsu-3; wyo-3; af-1; csu-1; fsu-1

wyo soccer has a couple and I think that's it. We aren't championship competitive in sports where nil has no impact much less those where spending matters. Let the excuse train fire up. We're going to need a lot of train cars to carry them all.
 
ragtimejoe1 said:
Not in jest. If the best we can hope for, should wsu and osu be a part of our conference, is 8th place or worse due to spending and nil, then fcs might be a better option.

The bsu crap is like the air raid crap. Nobody is thinking wyo will be a bsu or bohl needed an air raid offense. I guess fsu, sjsu, and usu are out of reach too. Must be all the nil money, I guess.

Of current members:
Football titles bsu-5; fsu-4; csu-3; suds-3; sjsu-1; usu-1

Wbb csu-7; bsu-7; unm-7; suds-7; fresno-7; unlv-3; wyo-1

Mbb (tourney and reg season combined) suds-16; unm-9; nv-4; unlv-4; bsu-3; wyo-3; af-1; csu-1; fsu-1

wyo soccer has a couple and I think that's it. We aren't championship competitive in sports where nil has no impact much less those where spending matters. Let the excuse train fire up. We're going to need a lot of train cars to carry them all.
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I see... I think I'm with you if your contention is that we should have had multiple titles since the inception of the MWC. Our athletic department does not produce champions in much of anything. They have been competitive at times in BB (men's and women's) and FB but there is a big gap between the best and the rest in the MWC.

Let's consider just football for a moment....you mentioned SJSU, CSU and USU as all having won a conference title(s) in the MWC....I think I would trade our success for Utah States over the time period of the MWC but I don't think I would say the same for CSU and SJSU. That being said...when people think of MWC football they don't think of any of those teams...it's BSU followed by a gap then probably AFA, Fresno, and SDSU. Anybody whose head is screwed on straight acknowledges that what BSU is doing in football is not replicable at Laramie (is this for sure true?) or perhaps anywhere else in the MW. The better question is why can't we move up into that gap between BSU and the rest? It does not appear that raw budget expenditure is the key variable. Those are schools that we spend roughly similar to (including Boise St btw if you don't consider NIL).

Something has obviously been rotten in Denmark (Laramie) when it comes to winning athletic conference championships. I believe that that the source of that is more complex than any of us (including myself) can get our minds around. There is no way that across all the sports we have just rolled snake-eyes with coaches over and over. Whatever Wyoming athletics has had going for them as it pertains to (now distant) past success is so far gone now that only people my age or older have much of a first hand memory of it. Almost everything has changed since those years...Wyoming has been left behind by most of those changes. I grew up in Wyoming in the 70s and 80s...guess what? go back to those places I grew up and they look the same! Can you say the same about Logan? Fort Collins? Boise? That lack of development and progress is killing a lot of things in Wyoming ... not just college athletics.

Whatever....I have become an advocate for just bringing out the axe for everybody if they don't win in 2 to 4 years. Not because it will help if they do that...but at least I won't have to listen to the numbskulls that think it's rooted in some sort of "acceptance of mediocrity".
 
Yeah, those numbskulls, College Sports Associates, have no idea about college athletics. Damn outside professionals coming in here with the audacity to suggest Cowboy Tough has a culture problem. The problems are so complex that they're insurmountable by anyone or anything. Idiots.
 
ragtimejoe1 said:
Yeah, those numbskulls, College Sports Associates, have no idea about college athletics. Damn outside professionals coming in here with the audacity to suggest Cowboy Tough has a culture problem. The problems are so complex that they're insurmountable by anyone or anything. Idiots.
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Culture problem ≠ acceptance of mediocrity.

There absolutely is a culture problem but it's not singular to Wyoming...and it's not just an acceptance of mediocrity that is the largest or even dominant part of that problem.

Wyoming will continue to bump along but it has been left behind. There is no visionary that turns it around, no university president, or coach, or AD is going to bring back any kind of past glory.

Ironically....if Coach Tuna Melt puts together a Roach-like run, we both look like idiots!
 
You realize they coined the term accepting of mediocrity as it relates to WYO athletics, right?

Well, let's pack it in and turn out the lights. Looks like ad budget, lack of NIL, and extremely complex undefineable issues will prevent WYO from ever challenging for the upper end of the conference. Pack it in or join fcs. At least make athletics stand on its own without student fees or taxpayer money.
 
ragtimejoe1 said:
You realize they coined the term accepting of mediocrity as it relates to WYO athletics, right?

Well, let's pack it in and turn out the lights. Looks like ad budget, lack of NIL, and extremely complex undefineable issues will prevent WYO from ever challenging for the upper end of the conference. Pack it in or join fcs. At least make athletics stand on its own without student fees or taxpayer money.
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The term accepting mediocrity was coined to describe Wyoming Athletics? Now I've truly heard everything.
 
307bball said:
The term accepting mediocrity was coined to describe Wyoming Athletics? Now I've truly heard everything.
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They (CSA) coined the term/made it mainstream IN RELATION TO Wyo athletics.

Here's a budget fact, taxpayers and student fees spend nearly 2500 per enrolled student at UW to fund athletics (44% +/- of the ad budget). The next closest is HI at 1900 then nv at 1400. We're asking an awful lot of students and taxpayers to fund teams hindered by undefineable issues preventing the ability to compete at the top of the conference. Not sure that's very ethical.
 
ragtimejoe1 said:
They (CSA) coined the term/made it mainstream IN RELATION TO Wyo athletics.

Here's a budget fact, taxpayers and student fees spend nearly 2500 per enrolled student at UW to fund athletics (44% +/- of the ad budget). The next closest is HI at 1900 then nv at 1400. We're asking an awful lot of students and taxpayers to fund teams hindered by undefineable issues preventing the ability to compete at the top of the conference. Not sure that's very ethical.
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Except that isn’t a budget fact. It is verifiably false:

Tuition and Fees

Information on tuition and fees at the University of Wyoming.
www.uwyo.edu www.uwyo.edu

I personally believe students should be provided an ‘opt-in’ choice as to whether to pay any athletics fees and the opt in providing the student free athletic event attendance. But regardless, UW’s student fee is much much lower.
 
OrediggerPoke said:
Except that isn’t a budget fact. It is verifiably false:

Tuition and Fees

Information on tuition and fees at the University of Wyoming.
www.uwyo.edu www.uwyo.edu

I personally believe students should be provided an ‘opt-in’ choice as to whether to pay any athletics fees and the opt in providing the student free athletic event attendance. But regardless, UW’s student fee is much much lower.
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Is that all you got? I'll let you add more to back up your nonsense before I make you look silly.

State support + student fees divided by student enrollment is just under 2500 per enrolled student which far exceeds other mwc schools.

Step up. If wyo can't compete because of nil, budgets, and other undefineable factors, the students and taxpayers are getting a bad deal. Put it in the hands of voters or hold the athletic department accountable.
 
ragtimejoe1 said:
They (CSA) coined the term/made it mainstream IN RELATION TO Wyo athletics.

Here's a budget fact, taxpayers and student fees spend nearly 2500 per enrolled student at UW to fund athletics (44% +/- of the ad budget). The next closest is HI at 1900 then nv at 1400. We're asking an awful lot of students and taxpayers to fund teams hindered by undefineable issues preventing the ability to compete at the top of the conference. Not sure that's very ethical.
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The idea that mediocrity and the acceptance of it is the enemy of excellence is older than the United States... Much less the university of Wyoming. However... That merely obscures the excellent point you go on to make....I share your concern about the ethical case for spending on athletics at the level that cite. Has the pond just grown too big for Wyoming? If the ghost of Paul Roach possessed Burman tomorrow and Nick Saban decided he wants a challenge and takes over the defensive coordinator spot from Aaron Bohl.... How good is the team in three years? If we can't get or keep talent because we can't pay them....I don't think it matters.

Anyways... As long as things stay the way they are, you and I can have this argument. The only way to disprove it is a conference championship (for you) and a run of years with 9+ wins per year (for me).
 
ragtimejoe1 said:
Is that all you got? I'll let you add more to back up your nonsense before I make you look silly.

State support + student fees divided by student enrollment is just under 2500 per enrolled student which far exceeds other mwc schools.

Step up. If wyo can't compete because of nil, budgets, and other undefineable factors, the students and taxpayers are getting a bad deal. Put it in the hands of voters or hold the athletic department accountable.
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How much did you pay in state income tax last year? The fee number per student is right there for you to view. A $466 per student fee that includes student health, recreation and athletics. Do we really need to go through where the state appropriated dollars for university funding actually come from again?
 
OrediggerPoke said:
How much did you pay in state income tax last year? The fee number per student is right there for you to view. A $466 per student fee that includes student health, recreation and athletics. Do we really need to go through where the state appropriated dollars for university funding actually come from again?
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Go look at what UW reports. You're wrong. The sports budgets aren't hard to find. Knights commission.

My point is fact.. If sports are front door to drive enrollment and enrollment drops, what does that mean? It's time for accountability or cuts.
 
ragtimejoe1 said:
Go look at what UW reports. You're wrong. The sports budgets aren't hard to find. Knights commission.

My point is fact.. If sports are front door to drive enrollment and enrollment drops, what does that mean? It's time for accountability or cuts.
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Haha ok dude. I know I am right and it’s not even a debate. ‘Taxpayers and student fees’ do not pay $2500 per student for athletics. Once again - I’d suggest you do a little research on state revenues and university appropriated dollars and where those dollars originate.
ragtimejoe1 said:
I'll accept your apology tomorrow when I show with links how much of a fool you are. Might be 41-=44% but the +/- should cover that
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OrediggerPoke said:
Haha ok dude. I know I am right and it’s not even a debate. ‘Taxpayers and student fees’ do not pay $2500 per student for athletics. Once again - I’d suggest you do a little research on state revenues and university appropriated dollars and where those dollars originate.
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40%+ of the athletic budget comes from state and student fees. Divide that by 8400 or whatever students and there you go. I doubt you apologize but that's ok.
 
ragtimejoe1 said:
40%+ of the athletic budget comes from state and student fees. Divide that by 8400 or whatever students and there you go. I doubt you apologize but that's ok.
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So you no longer agree with your previous assertion that this funding comes from ‘taxpayers’? And you have now changed your mind that it comes from state allocated dollars including dollars originating with the federal Morrill Act and mineral extraction on both state and federal lands? Thank you! We all appreciate you admitting when you’re wrong and moving on.
 
OrediggerPoke said:
So you no longer agree with your previous assertion that this funding comes from ‘taxpayers’? And you have now changed your mind that it comes from state allocated dollars including dollars originating with the federal Morrill Act and mineral extraction on both state and federal lands? Thank you! We all appreciate you admitting when you’re wrong and moving on.
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LMFAO at this guy that govt money doesn't come from taxes. The govt only gives what it takes which is also fact.
 
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