Fixing this

[hithere]

It's time the BOT learns that Athletics are the front porch of a University. No doubt there are staff and alumni who believe direct investment in academics is priority number one, and to an extent it is, however, it's also time for them to recognize the reality of the ROI on positive brand-building and brand-image. Over the long term, investment in brand (and the brand starts with Athletics, primarily Football and Men's Basketball) will return as much, if not more than direct investment in academics.

Not even close. The "front porch" of a university is its academic reputation and performance. That's what attracts good students and faculty, who attract more good faculty and students, etc.

Entertainment is nice, and entertainment gives some alums a nice way to connect with their old university, but it's the guest bedroom, not the front porch.

...Well, if defining a university's excellence by its academics is a peculiarly Wyoming attitude....then I'm Wyoming to the core.

And proud of it.

Yes, you're sure Wyoming to the core. Where'd you go in this thread?

From past posts, I remember your arguments and positions being in line with you being one of Burman's biggest fans. You also purport to being in the know when it comes to UW administrative direction and choices relevant to athletics. If you're not, then great, you're just another dingleberry like me posting on a message board.

But please be sure to check out the Athletics Department's Intercollegiate Athletics Strategic Plan for 2015-2021. Pay especially close attention to the section on Service to the State of Wyoming on page 6 of 7. ICA's goal is to serve as the "front porch of the institution."

Now in addition to this particular stated goal, the other sections of this plan can get fairly comical related to progress. Notably, how ICA, in their one year review sections, tout great accomplishments and vast progress related to being able to compete for Conference Championships (except football). Or how all head coaches were retained for 2014-2015. (Not sure on the metric, is this a good thing? Because Burman in the past has expressly defended his record of firing coaches that aren't getting things done)

But going back to serving as the front porch of the university, UW Athletics trumpets that the county, state and surrounding area should be figuratively on their knees in deep appreciation of how much UW athletics directly benefits these entities. In addition, UW's athletic website, Facebook page (Ha!), radio broadcasts, and coaching camps all generate "national media stories" for UW.

Jesus H. Christ. This is beyond ridiculous.

Tom Burman doesn't grasp that by having the word Wyoming plastered on all uniforms, these podunk "accomplishments" (Facebook likes! Seriously?) will happen IN SPITE OF him being the AD. What in the name of Pete's Dragon does Tom think he and his staff are doing that's so uniquely special?!?! By his deft and adroit hand, UW athletics is generating "national media stories" that feature UW athletics? Well, he's right. Just this season I've seen national media covering that 3 time FCS national championship coach Craig Bohl is 0-6. His team just lost to a program that hadn't won an OOC road game since Reagan. The football team (who tries very, very hard) hasn't come within single digits of a team they've played all year.

The volleyball team was ranked for a week and the campus has new buildings. Throw a goddamn parade.

I'm not advocating firing Bohl before the year 2018. His hiring was artistically savant-like on Burman's part. Hire a well respected FCS coach that runs an entirely different system to the previous bad hire made by Burman, give him five years to build TUFF players and establish a TUFF, ROOTIN',TOOTIN' "sliding is for pussies" culture and then after half a decade, re-evaluate. Burman, you sly motherfucker. Nice move.

I'm advocating that the average fan please take a look at the overall record and accomplishments of the AD who has been here for nine years, analyze whatever metrics one would choose, (he hasn't murdered anyone!) and decide if he should be given more time to continue to navigate H.M.S. EverythingIsHunkyDory down the mighty mediocrity river.

I blame my parents for birthing me in this state and encouraging my budding interest in all things brown and gold. Fuck you, mom. Eat shit, dad.

 

[SnowyRange]

I'm advocating that the average fan please take a look at the overall record and accomplishments of the AD who has been here for nine years, analyze whatever metrics one would choose, (he hasn't murdered anyone!) and decide if he should be given more time to continue to navigate H.M.S. EverythingIsHunkyDory down the mighty mediocrity river.

You seem angry.

But here's my prognostication about Burman: if Bohl succeeds, Burman will be here until he wants to leave. If Bohl fails, then Burman will be out.

 

[McPeachy]

But here's my prognostication about Burman: if Bohl succeeds, Burman will be here until he wants to leave. If Bohl fails, then Burman will be out.

:rofl:

If we had a president with any balls (I am looking at you Buchanan) - Burman doesn't make it past the Schroyer debacle. The fail in that, is still felt on game-days in the AA to this day. It could easily go down as the $5,000,000 mistake (at this point), that Mr. Ball-less just seemed to glance right over.

I am betting that the next UW president isn't going to just sit idly by, and allow UW athletics to "do more with less" - or "the same with the same" as it is more appropriately referred to these days. Regardless of what Bohl accomplishes in 2020. Burman won't have (and shouldn't have) that much time.

 

[SnowyRange]

I am betting that the next UW president isn't going to just sit idly by, and allow UW athletics to "do more with less" - or "the same with the same" as it is more appropriately referred to these days. Regardless of what Bohl accomplishes in 2020. Burman won't have (and shouldn't have) that much time.

You sure are fond of your little moving emojis.

Oh, I don't pretend to be able to see the future. If I could, I wouldn't be here.

It's just my guess: as goes Bohl, so goes Burman. It seems to be the way the world works for ADs...you don't get two coaching hires in a row that don't pan out.

 

[ragtimejoe1]

It's just my guess: as goes Bohl, so goes Burman. It seems to be the way the world works for ADs...you don't get two coaching hires in a row that don't pan out.

Signed Schroyer and DC.

 

[PokeOLoco]

^

 

[SnowyRange]

Signed Schroyer and DC.

Exactly. Those were strike one. So, in basketball, there isn't a strike two. But in football, the jury's still out.

 

[ragtimejoe1]

Signed Schroyer and DC.

Exactly. Those were strike one. So, in basketball, there isn't a strike two. But in football, the jury's still out.

:lol: He gets 2 strikes in every sport!!???


For all our new WYO fans, you are starting to see the issue with WYO athletics. LMFAO. Wow, just wow.

 

[McPeachy]

I am betting that the next UW president isn't going to just sit idly by, and allow UW athletics to "do more with less" - or "the same with the same" as it is more appropriately referred to these days. Regardless of what Bohl accomplishes in 2020. Burman won't have (and shouldn't have) that much time.

You sure are fond of your little moving emojis.

Oh, I don't pretend to be able to see the future. If I could, I wouldn't be here.

It's just my guess: as goes Bohl, so goes Burman. It seems to be the way the world works for ADs...you don't get two coaching hires in a row that don't pan out.

Ya, I love those little moving emojis. They are great.

And same here. And same here.

Burman has had more than 9 lives...

2 hires in a row is the exact same as firing the one he inherited, just to fire the replacement he hired (after he extended their contracts). And that is true in both football and basketball. That is inexcusable, but was allowed because hey, he is our Wyoming guy!

{Insert emoji with middle finger extended here}

 

[SDPokeFan]

You're the guy who spends a fortune to get to base camp on Everest, then takes the first flight to Australia, walks up Mt. Cook then is satisfied he climbed the tallest peak on the continent. Our fan base could use some serious purging. We don't need Hudsons who just want to wave the white flag and hope the monsters don't eat us. You must've been a French major...

Each time you disagree with someone you resort to ridiculous personal attacks. Frankly this does nothing for your argument but speaks volumes.

While I disagree with Stutzriem and believe that a good investment in athletics is a good investment in the University itself and its academic programs, there is no denying that he states an opinion with evidence to support his opinion and should be respected for that.

Get over yourself.

You haven't truly gotten to him until he dedicates his signature line to you. You guys haven't even scratched the surface of what I've accomplished in his "world of men."

FYI, most "men" are over five feet tall and no longer attend high school. I think you need some clarification on that...

Are you suggesting that Matt Roloff isn't a man? Sir he has sired some four children. I will let you insult me, but I'll be damned if I'm going to sit back and let you insult Little People, Big World.

P.S. I don't think you get to decide who is a fan, and who isn't. Who are you to decide how everyone should think? I'm guessing you listen to a lot of Rush Limbaugh.

 

[SnowyRange]

2 hires in a row is the exact same as firing the one he inherited, just to fire the replacement he hired (after he extended their contracts). And that is true in both football and basketball. That is inexcusable, but was allowed because hey, he is our Wyoming guy!

First, don't get me wrong, I think ADs are on...no sure how to say this...no-fault contracts. They will get fired if coaching hires don't pan out -- and stay on if they do -- no matter the defensibility of the hire when made.

Second, here's how I view Burman's major sport hires: I thought Schroyer was a bad hire, inexplicable, from the day it was announced. Just terrible. As for DC, quite the opposite. That was a good hire, I thought -- along with, I might add, about everyone else who weighed in on the topic, including the national press. But that was a good hire that just didn't pan out. No one could have guessed we were hiring Charlie Weis. (And I don't put as much weight as you on the extension thing; I just see that as the way the game is played.)

But, putting that all together, I don't think the argument about whether Schroyer or DC were good or bad choices at the time matters at all. All that matters is whether they pan out. They didn't. And then comes my theory/observation that in any major sport no AD survives two hires like that in a row.

A corollary is that an AD can save himself with an immediate next hire if it pans out. On the basketball front, Burman did that with Shyatt. You and I could yell all day long about how bad the Schroyer hire was from day one, and they'd look at us like we were children throwing a tantrum. "You want Burman gone because the basketball team is...um...look we just won the MWC tourney and went to the NCAAs." They'd take us out on a dolly like Hannibal Lecter.

That's why I think it boils down to Bohl.

Just my :twocents:

God, I wish those pennies moved.

(ETA: there's a nice laboratory experiment going on for this right now. Pat Haden at USC. After Lame Kitten and that Poor Old Sot Sarkisian, we'll see how he fares.)

 

[ragtimejoe1]

Elsewhere, the AD actually does more and is judged by more than just coaching hires. The coaching jobs at WYO have become more challenging under Burman's tenure and that is fact.

Coaches at WYO have to win despite Burman and he is not held accountable.

 

[hithere]

You seem angry.

But here's my prognostication about Burman: if Bohl succeeds, Burman will be here until he wants to leave. If Bohl fails, then Burman will be out.

Yes, I am. And I'm venting on a forum specifically designed to allow for the airing of my grievances, just like you.

I'm glib sometimes as well but sports is serious stuff so I'm sticking for the time being to facts related to the whitewashing of a dunce of an AD's record due to apathy and bitch mentality.

 

[Wyovanian]

You're the guy who spends a fortune to get to base camp on Everest, then takes the first flight to Australia, walks up Mt. Cook then is satisfied he climbed the tallest peak on the continent. Our fan base could use some serious purging. We don't need Hudsons who just want to wave the white flag and hope the monsters don't eat us. You must've been a French major...

Each time you disagree with someone you resort to ridiculous personal attacks. Frankly this does nothing for your argument but speaks volumes.

While I disagree with Stutzriem and believe that a good investment in athletics is a good investment in the University itself and its academic programs, there is no denying that he states an opinion with evidence to support his opinion and should be respected for that.

Get over yourself.

You haven't truly gotten to him until he dedicates his signature line to you. You guys haven't even scratched the surface of what I've accomplished in his "world of men."

FYI, most "men" are over five feet tall and no longer attend high school. I think you need some clarification on that...

Are you suggesting that Matt Roloff isn't a man? Sir he has sired some four children. I will let you insult me, but I'll be damned if I'm going to sit back and let you insult Little People, Big World.

P.S. I don't think you get to decide who is a fan, and who isn't. Who are you to decide how everyone should think? I'm guessing you listen to a lot of Rush Limbaugh.

Your guess is wrong.

I'm just calling it like I see it. The naked emperor calling himself well-dressed is not a clothed emperor. You can call yourself a fan all you want, but I think a lot of people, after reading your posts, would at least put an asterisk next to the word "fan" when it comes to you.

 

[Cowduck]

Gonzaga is the example some were searching for here. 15-20 years ago they played in a high school size gym and you could show up halfway through and walk down and sit court side. Now they sell out every game and it's the hottest ticket in Spokane. But that isn't all their basketball success did. It went from a "little church school" to expanding their entire campus and facilities both academically and athletic. I don't know the numbers but applications to enroll expanded by thousand percentage points or more

Athletics makes a huge impact on the image of a university. Like it or not. And yes the academics should be and are more important, but those not understanding the importance of Athletics in keeping alumni and boosters and money involved w the university are being naive. And those thinking that the difference wouldn't matter between d1 and 2 are being even more naive. Actually that view shouldn't be called naive, just plain ignorant

Grand Canyon University is doing the same thing and its working.

Eh, I don't know about that. GCU may be pouring money into its athletics programs, but as long as it is a for-profit racket its image will continue to be "University of Phoenix with a basketball team." I don't know anyone who takes it seriously as an academic or research institution.

 

[Yabadabadoo]

Rush Limbaugh is the most successful and most listened to talk radio show host in the world. If anyone admits to listening to him (I do on occasion) they would be in pretty decent company.

Liberalism is, after all, a mental disorder, with nothing substantive to show for it's agendas...ever.

 

[BeaverPoke]

Signed Schroyer and DC.

Exactly. Those were strike one. So, in basketball, there isn't a strike two. But in football, the jury's still out.

DC was a bad hire but the jury is out on Bohl?

How? DC took us bowl games. Bohl has won 4 games in 1.5 seasons.

 

[SnowyRange]

DC was a bad hire but the jury is out on Bohl?

No, DC was an acceptable hire, but he didn't pan out.

And, yes, Bohl was an acceptable hire, but we've yet know if he pans out. We'll see if his approach works in 2-3 years.

 

[CowboyNV]

Rush Limbaugh is the most successful and most listened to talk radio show host in the world. If anyone admits to listening to him (I do on occasion) they would be in pretty decent company.

Liberalism is, after all, a mental disorder, with nothing substantive to show for it's agendas...ever.

I won't take the bait, Dino, but I'll happily trade you blow for blow mentally any day.

Signed,

One fiercely independent liberal.

 

[GoPokes86]

But here's my prognostication about Burman: if Bohl succeeds, Burman will be here until he wants to leave. If Bohl fails, then Burman will be out.

:rofl:

If we had a president with any balls (I am looking at you Buchanan) - Burman doesn't make it past the Schroyer debacle. The fail in that, is still felt on game-days in the AA to this day. It could easily go down as the $5,000,000 mistake (at this point), that Mr. Ball-less just seemed to glance right over.

I am betting that the next UW president isn't going to just sit idly by, and allow UW athletics to "do more with less" - or "the same with the same" as it is more appropriately referred to these days. Regardless of what Bohl accomplishes in 2020. Burman won't have (and shouldn't have) that much time.

I hope this is sarcasm. It's deeper seated than just with the president, who we all know is a puppet for the board of trustees, which is where this entrenched attitude of "good enough is good enough, and do more with less" comes from.