Adams at Point Guard

[joshvanklomp]

Cal, and any three of Indiana St, NMSU, and the games in Vegas.

Maybe we only lose 2 or 3, but just a reminder that it's a very young team.

 

[NowherePoke]

I get the tempered expectations talk. But winning HALF of our conf. games will not be a good season. That would be a huge disappointment in my eyes. I am not expecting another NCAA bid but I don't think its unrealistic that we hit 20 wins and play post season somewhere.

It's possible to win only half our conference games and still win 20 games overall.

That being said, I too am on the tempered expectations side. If I had to guess a number right now, I'd say 18-12 overall and 10-8 in MWC.

I agree with the OOC record, but I think 10-8 is exceedingly optimistic in MWC play. We went 11-7 with a senior laden team last year. Sure, we had a couple of health related issues, but that is part of the game and we shouldn't anticipate 100% health this year (Washington just hurt his knee as an example).

Our FB debacle should tell us something. Shyatt is a good coach, but so is Bohl. A young team with less size/athletic ability than its conference peers is destined to struggle. I would say 8-10, but even that might be high. Most impartial observers will pick the Pokes 9th or 10th in the MWC.

 

[joshvanklomp]

I agree with the OOC record, but I think 10-8 is exceedingly optimistic in MWC play. We went 11-7 with a senior laden team last year. Sure, we had a couple of health related issues, but that is part of the game and we shouldn't anticipate 100% health this year (Washington just hurt his knee as an example).

Our FB debacle should tell us something. Shyatt is a good coach, but so is Bohl. A young team with less size/athletic ability than its conference peers is destined to struggle. I would say 8-10, but even that might be high. Most impartial observers will pick the Pokes 9th or 10th in the MWC.

Good point. Honestly, I looked at our nonconference schedule for win estimate, but didn't look much at the MWC. 10 wins could definitely be optimistic.

One thing I will bring up is that Shyatt runs a perimeter-heavy system. People oft criticized him for it last season. However, transitioning to this year, I think it can be beneficial for a team that is now guard-heavy.

 

[ItSucksToBeACSURam]

I agree with the OOC record, but I think 10-8 is exceedingly optimistic in MWC play. We went 11-7 with a senior laden team last year. Sure, we had a couple of health related issues, but that is part of the game and we shouldn't anticipate 100% health this year (Washington just hurt his knee as an example).

Our FB debacle should tell us something. Shyatt is a good coach, but so is Bohl. A young team with less size/athletic ability than its conference peers is destined to struggle. I would say 8-10, but even that might be high. Most impartial observers will pick the Pokes 9th or 10th in the MWC.

Good point. Honestly, I looked at our nonconference schedule for win estimate, but didn't look much at the MWC. 10 wins could definitely be optimistic.

One thing I will bring up is that Shyatt runs a perimeter-heavy system. People oft criticized him for it last season. However, transitioning to this year, I think it can be beneficial for a team that is now guard-heavy.

He was criticized for running a perimeter laden system without great shooters and who's best player was a dominant inside force. This season, like you said, will fit the system much better

 

[poke_addict]

[tweet]https://twitter.com/JoshTAdams14/status/642014316514820096[/tweet]

[tweet]https://twitter.com/Brotherhood05/status/642181113348255745[/tweet]

[tweet]https://twitter.com/Brotherhood05/status/642181383285112832[/tweet]

 

[WilyWapiti]

I love J-Mac, but if he is anything but a sixth man, out talent level isn't where it needs to be yet.

WW

 

[BeaverPoke]

I love J-Mac, but if he is anything but a sixth man, out talent level isn't where it needs to be yet.

WW

How so? He will be better than last season.
He has more D1 experience than anyone besides Adams on the team.

You put J-Mac on the bench then you are relying on a Juco or a bunch of freshmen to be ready to go from day 1. Considering we are a development program, I would suggest going with the 4th year junior, not the frosh.

 

[Coeur d' Alene]

I love J-Mac, but if he is anything but a sixth man, out talent level isn't where it needs to be yet.

WW

How so? He will be better than last season.
He has more D1 experience than anyone besides Adams on the team.

You put J-Mac on the bench then you are relying on a Juco or a bunch of freshmen to be ready to go from day 1. Considering we are a development program, I would suggest going with the 4th year junior, not the frosh.

I think both of you guys are right- as strange as that sounds.

If James or Marshall or both aren't immediate impact players then the recruiting isn't where we all seem to think/hope it is.


But as far as mcm being one of the most experienced players on the team and someone ready and deserving of taking the next step that's right too.

To me it all goes back to the original question here and that's would it be best to play Adams at pg. I personally think the team would be better by starting 2 guys with size and shooting ability with Adams than it would to start a guy who needs to be ball dominant to make an impact. I'd start mcm and whoever is better out of James and Marshall.

 

[poke_addict]

Here is a pretty good read on Josh's strengths.

http://www.todaysu.com/mwc-today/josh-adams-takes-reins-wyoming/

 

[stymeman]

thinking i'm liking that

 

[Coeur d' Alene]

PG- Adams/ Conway-Washington
SG- Marshall/ Lieberman
SF- James/ McM
PF- Herndon/dalton
C- Barnes/ naughton

 

[Coeur d' Alene]

Anybody know what they're doing? Is Adams practicing with or against Marshall/gorski? Or they running him w Lieberman/Conway/Washington

 

[seattlecowboy]

PG- Adams/ Conway-Washington
SG- Marshall/ Lieberman
SF- James/ McM
PF- Herndon/dalton
C- Barnes/ naughton

Not sure why you left Gorski off here but Gorski will probably be starting with the way he can shoot it plus he is a big guard and can post up smaller guards and defend bigger guards. I think Gorski might be the best guard we have after Adams.

I would like to see a starting 5 with Adams, Gorski, James/Mac , Herndon, Barnes/Naughton.

 

[Coeur d' Alene]

PG- Adams/ Conway-Washington
SG- Marshall/ Lieberman
SF- James/ McM
PF- Herndon/dalton
C- Barnes/ naughton

Not sure why you left Gorski off here but Gorski will probably be starting with the way he can shoot it plus he is a big guard and can post up smaller guards and defend bigger guards. I think Gorski might be the best guard we have after Adams.

I would like to see a starting 5 with Adams, Gorski, James/Mac , Herndon, Barnes/Naughton.

I would love to see that lineup as well. I saw tons of potential even though he was completely lost last year. I knew it was possible but was thrilled to hear gorski seemingly took the big step forward that he needed to.

I think Wyoming could be big and physically dominant 1-5. When has that ever happend? If gorski and James are the starters with Adams? How do you cover that? We are always small at the 3, and I know I'm prob putting way too much stock into James being an immediate starter type, but even mcm, or gorski isn't bad size. I just hope our main sf's don't end up being Marshall and Adams

 

[NowherePoke]

PG- Adams/ Conway-Washington
SG- Marshall/ Lieberman
SF- James/ McM
PF- Herndon/dalton
C- Barnes/ naughton

Not sure why you left Gorski off here but Gorski will probably be starting with the way he can shoot it plus he is a big guard and can post up smaller guards and defend bigger guards. I think Gorski might be the best guard we have after Adams.

I would like to see a starting 5 with Adams, Gorski, James/Mac , Herndon, Barnes/Naughton.

I would be very surprised to see Shyatt go big. He prefers to have additional ball handling most of the time. I am confident he will start two small guards (Adams and one of Lieberman/Washington/Conway). No idea what he does at the "3" and the "5". I assume Herndon starts at the "4".

 

[cali2wyo]

I would be very surprised to see Shyatt go big. He prefers to have additional ball handling most of the time. I am confident he will start two small guards (Adams and one of Lieberman/Washington/Conway). No idea what he does at the "3" and the "5". I assume Herndon starts at the "4".

I agree. In Holmgren's piece on Lieberman, Shyatt said he likes to have 2 guys on the court who can act as point guards (last year we almost always saw at least 2 of Grabau, Adams, Lieberman, and Bentz) so for that reason I don't see Aka Gorski, Marshall, or James playing the "2" very often. Like you, I hope Herndon starts at the "4". Mostly because that means Shyatt found a guy between Barnes and Naughton that he can trust for extended minutes. If not, I think our high intensity defense and conditioning will allow us to be undersized and get away with it at times with McManimal at the "4" as we saw at times last year. Since we're throwing around lineups, I guess I'll get in on the act:

In order of playing time:
Guards ("1" and "2"): Adams/Lieberman/Washington/Conway/Aka Gorski/James
SF ("3"): McManamen/Aka Gorski/James/Marshall
PF ("4"): Herndon/Dalton/McManamen/Moemeka
C ("5"): Barnes/Naughton/Herndon

Not sure on how minutes will be distributed, but Adams will obviously get his 30-35 every night. Herndon is so thin still, I don't know if he can handle more than 25-30 minutes/game. On paper, it looks like a lot of guys will see the floor with some at multiple positions. The most likely redshirts in my opinion are Moemeka (due to our yet to be proven "depth" at the "4") and Conway (he's quick and talented so he'll probably end up playing, but with our depth at the guard spots and no guards coming in next year as of now, it makes sense to keep him locked up until then).

Note: I have Marshall somewhat buried at the 3 at the moment because it seems like concussions, etc. have really held him back from learning our system/getting fit. Hopefully he gets healthy in a hurry, I wanna see him play!

 

[seattlecowboy]

PG- Adams/ Conway-Washington
SG- Marshall/ Lieberman
SF- James/ McM
PF- Herndon/dalton
C- Barnes/ naughton

Not sure why you left Gorski off here but Gorski will probably be starting with the way he can shoot it plus he is a big guard and can post up smaller guards and defend bigger guards. I think Gorski might be the best guard we have after Adams.

I would like to see a starting 5 with Adams, Gorski, James/Mac , Herndon, Barnes/Naughton.

I would be very surprised to see Shyatt go big. He prefers to have additional ball handling most of the time. I am confident he will start two small guards (Adams and one of Lieberman/Washington/Conway). No idea what he does at the "3" and the "5". I assume Herndon starts at the "4".

I agree with you. Shyatt is a good coach and sees this team everyday and knows a hell of a lot more than myself about them. :lol: I guess out of my own bias I would like to see a little bigger line up in there especially with the way Gorski can shoot it.

Not trying to slight Lieberman, Washington or anyone else in anyway as I think all of them are good enough to start as well and can see the reason for Shyatt starting them.

 

[wyopig]

I'm just as excited to see how much the returning players have developed as I am to see the new guys. I'm hoping one or two of these freshmen are truly "impact" type players this year. We haven't had a freshman like that in a while. Adams was close, but it's probably been since about Moujeke or Desmar Jackson that we've had a freshman that strikes some fear into opponents. Desmar's game kinds drove me nuts, but he was a good offensive player.

 

[Coeur d' Alene]

PG- Adams/ Conway-Washington
SG- Marshall/ Lieberman
SF- James/ McM
PF- Herndon/dalton
C- Barnes/ naughton

Not sure why you left Gorski off here but Gorski will probably be starting with the way he can shoot it plus he is a big guard and can post up smaller guards and defend bigger guards. I think Gorski might be the best guard we have after Adams.

I would like to see a starting 5 with Adams, Gorski, James/Mac , Herndon, Barnes/Naughton.

I would be very surprised to see Shyatt go big. He prefers to have additional ball handling most of the time. I am confident he will start two small guards (Adams and one of Lieberman/Washington/Conway). No idea what he does at the "3" and the "5". I assume Herndon starts at the "4".

I'm guessing you will be right, just hope we are both wrong. Adams needs a ball mover/shooter next to him. Gorski could play that role. Marshall at the 2 and Adams at the 1 would be unbelievable defensively and athletically. I like Lieberman a lot and think he will be very good as a better than Brett McFall type 6th man. If they start a Lieberman/Conway/Washington type then the best fit with Adams is Lieberman. Hopefully Conway red shirts but even if he doesn't he should be a backup to Adams at the 1. Lieberman play the 2 and 1 off the bench.


No reason to take the ball out of Adams hands. It will cause more mistakes right away but the ceiling of this team is a tier higher with Adams as the point guard.


Adams/Lieberman/Conway/Washington
gorski or Marshall
James or mcmanaman
Herndon/moemeka or dalton
Barnes/noughton


That team out matches almost everyone they play physically. NCAA tourney team


The safe roster
Lieberman/Conway
Adams/Washington/
Marshall or mcM or gorski or James
Herndon/momeka or dalton
Barnes/noughton

That team finishes 4 or 5 in the MWC still

 

[Coeur d' Alene]

Plus you have 13 guys that think they belong as rotation players. This is a really deep team. Or balanced. Because there's going to be 13 guys and only 8, 9, or at the most 10 could get enough time to consider themselves part of the "rotation" there are going to be jammed up spots. With this team it's going to be at the 4 spot and wherever they start Adams will either jam up the 1 spot or the 2 and 3 spots together


Herndon will be tried to be used as a 4 as much as possible. (Presumably Barnes and noughton could not play together?). So that has Herndon (a 25-30 mpg type player) AND Moemeka, dalton, maybe noughton/Barnes?, and then possibly Mcmanama and Justin James all fighting for what 10-15 mpg at the 4?


That's usually the lead up to someone transferring when there isn't the minutes to go around. How do you fix that? Make sure mcmanaman and James are getting the minutes they need at the 3


So then the key is Adams. Where do you want the other minutes jam for your roster. You could have a pg depth chart of
Adams/Lieberman/Conway or Washington
And say tough luck on not playing to 2 of them.


And have a 2 and 3 spots rotation of
Gorski/Marshall/mcmanaman/James (w the guards or momeka/dalton filling in some of the time.
You can keep those 4 happy with 2 spots.


In conclusion :

If you play Adams at sg: lose 2 or 3 players

Play Adams at pg: everybody stays happy and no one/maybe a 3rd or fourth string pg quits