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P12 - MWC

rocket city poke said:
Worse yet, they took Utah State. 20 years ago Utah State was irrelevant. For most of the 1980's USU was in the PCAA, then went to the Big West in the 1990's, then had 2 years as an independent where they were completely irrelevant. Then the Sun Belt which was more near irrelevancy. That was in 2004. There is just no way you could have thought that back in 2004 Utah State would have had this type of success / transition.

And I think the MWC is about to get steamrolled as well. It's going to be tough to see the MWC surviving.
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I'd counter that at this time we have no idea what league we and the rest of the g5 will be playing in. IMO, odds are that we and the rest of G5 will soon be excluded fron the playoff and whatever the big schools form. If that's correct, all this conference shuffling won't matter.
 
ragtimejoe1 said:
odds are that we and the rest of G5 will soon be excluded fron the playoff and whatever the big schools form. If that's correct, all this conference shuffling won't matter.
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Ditto.

Wyoming might very well find being in the FCS with the Montana’s the best fit for our facilities and relevancy if determined to be acceptable by the Big Sky.

The shift is seismic and the Wyoming strategy is how to survive when unable to do anything while at the mercy of everyone else.
 
PorkerPoke said:
Ditto.

Wyoming might very well find being in the FCS with the Montana’s the best fit for our facilities and relevancy if determined to be acceptable by the Big Sky.

The shift is seismic and the Wyoming strategy is how to survive when unable to do anything while at the mercy of everyone else.
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I understandably have a minority opinion on this but I have felt for years that UW could be more viable at the FCS level.

The schools in the Big Sky are relatively the same size. The Montana, South Dakota, and North Dakota schools compete for football championships. Wyoming residents would likely still support the university athletic programs. It would be more exciting to support a football team that has a chance to win it all. UW could still get pounded in big money games to help them financially.

A rivalry with a neighboring state school will be just as fun as the green ooze that lies south of the border.

Instead, they will be a member of a fledgling conference with no hope to compete for anything. The money from reported P-7 payouts will only help UW for a few years and most likely be diluted over time. I’m not certain how the NCAA lawsuit will affect the coffers, either? A lot of the money gained by the traitors’ departures may already be spent trying to comply with that lawsuit.
 
The big question, imo, is what forms one rung below the power league? Whatever that is, we want the MWC to be part of it. Ideally, it will be the pac +G5. Aac and pac will try to dominate the postseason format but they won't have the media juice to do so.

If and big if, the G5 +pac end up in a division with a playoff, WYO ended up in a pretty good spot. We'll be coming from a conference that we should be competitive to get into the post season.

Everything depends on what happens at the top and what the fallout is. My worry is that big12 and acc are left out sans a few teams. They and the pac/aac form a new league below the power league and we're left deciding if fcs or a new g5 league is the way forward
 
Bear Claw said:
I understandably have a minority opinion on this but I have felt for years that UW could be more viable at the FCS level.

The schools in the Big Sky are relatively the same size. The Montana, South Dakota, and North Dakota schools compete for football championships. Wyoming residents would likely still support the university athletic programs. It would be more exciting to support a football team that has a chance to win it all. UW could still get pounded in big money games to help them financially.

A rivalry with a neighboring state school will be just as fun as the green ooze that lies south of the border.

Instead, they will be a member of a fledgling conference with no hope to compete for anything. The money from reported P-7 payouts will only help UW for a few years and most likely be diluted over time. I’m not certain how the NCAA lawsuit will affect the coffers, either? A lot of the money gained by the traitors’ departures may already be spent trying to comply with that lawsuit.
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Personally, I wholeheartedly support UW moving to FCS. We can compete at a high level, and the regional rivalries would be fun to watch.
 
I've followed Wyoming sports for 3 decades. I am not a fair-weather fan. I travel to see at least one or two games a year. Just about to make alumni donation (wife asked as I am writing this). If Wyoming moves to FCS, I will never travel to or watch another game. Wyoming will be irrelevant and I will close the door on that chapter. End of story.

Wyoming was horrible last year. But we are generally competitive in the Mountain West. Our problem is out of conference and away games. But we still managed to close out the season pretty well with a good game against Boise State and a win against Washington State. And attendance is about what Washington State musters.

I cannot stand FCS discussion. Nevarez got played so we should move down. Whatever.
 
Midwest Cowboy said:
I've followed Wyoming sports for 3 decades. I am not a fair-weather fan. I travel to see at least one or two games a year. Just about to make alumni donation (wife asked as I am writing this). If Wyoming moves to FCS, I will never travel to or watch another game. Wyoming will be irrelevant and I will close the door on that chapter. End of story.

Wyoming was horrible last year. But we are generally competitive in the Mountain West. Our problem is out of conference and away games. But we still managed to close out the season pretty well with a good game against Boise State and a win against Washington State. And attendance is about what Washington State musters.

I cannot stand FCS discussion. Nevarez got played so we should move down. Whatever.
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Help me understand, genuinely trying to understand the perspective.

Over the past decade, the football team posted an overall record of 63–60 and a Conference record of 39–45… that’s not exactly anything to write home about.

Personally, I’d rather see us chase national competitiveness in the FCS than “generally competitive” in a floundering MWC, with no real path to any meaningful postseason besides the snoop dog, barstool, TikTok bowl game against a MAC team.
 
PAPoke said:
Help me understand, genuinely trying to understand the perspective.

Over the past decade, the football team posted an overall record of 63–60 and a Conference record of 39–45… that’s not exactly anything to write home about.

Personally, I’d rather see us chase national competitiveness in the FCS than “generally competitive” in a floundering MWC, with no real path to any meaningful postseason besides the snoop dog, barstool, TikTok bowl game against a MAC team.
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I personally think we would end up middle of the pack in FCS at best. If nothing changed in terms of program support and investment, and we still were able to get the same recruits, the same donations, the same attendance, pay the coaches the same amount, etc then sure we could probably win a lot in FCS.

But if we move to FCS I see all of that changing. We won't get the same recruits, our television coverage will be less making us less desirable to the recruits we currently get. We will have less players on the team because FCS has lower scholarship limit, I think our donations will definitely drop down, our tv money will be less, we won't pay our coaches as much, I think our attendance will drop (look no further than when we play on FCS team at home it's usually one of the lower attended games), and we will still be in a remote location that is cold and windy.

We might have a couple years of success just based on starting from a higher basis of money in FCS, but I believe in a short 3 years or so we will be middle of the pack FCS because the financial and other support of the program would move to middle of the pack FCS standards within a few years of the move
 
WyomingAg said:
I personally think we would end up middle of the pack in FCS at best. If nothing changed in terms of program support and investment, and we still were able to get the same recruits, the same donations, the same attendance, pay the coaches the same amount, etc then sure we could probably win a lot in FCS.

But if we move to FCS I see all of that changing. We won't get the same recruits, our television coverage will be less making us less desirable to the recruits we currently get. We will have less players on the team because FCS has lower scholarship limit, I think our donations will definitely drop down, our tv money will be less, we won't pay our coaches as much, I think our attendance will drop (look no further than when we play on FCS team at home it's usually one of the lower attended games), and we will still be in a remote location that is cold and windy.

We might have a couple years of success just based on starting from a higher basis of money in FCS, but I believe in a short 3 years or so we will be middle of the pack FCS because the financial and other support of the program would move to middle of the pack FCS standards within a few years of the move
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Appreciate the post. I’ll admit I’m not as steeped in Cowboy history as some of you, and I get that moving to FCS hits an emotional nerve. But I don’t think it’s unreasonable to ask what, exactly, we’re holding on to.

Yeah, we’ve had a few solid MWC seasons, but we’re not playing for anything meaningful. Most years, we’re scratching for .500 and a bowl invite that no one outside this time zone cares about. That might be enough for some, but not for most of this board.

I’d rather chase titles in a competitive FCS league with regional rivals I could travel to. Montana State, NDSU, SDSU, South Dakota (Final Four FCS teams, by the way)? That fires me up more than a Wednesday night in front of 9,000 fans against Hawaii.

And no, I don’t buy that everything collapses if we drop. Sure, some financials shift, but it’s not like we’re rolling in cash or recruits now. Being consistently competitive in a respected FCS league could energize the base in a way this version of the MWC just… doesn’t.

The 2026 Mountain West will be Wyoming, Air Force, Nevada, UNLV, New Mexico, San Jose State—and probably some lame call-ups. That’s not a prestigious league. Our best-case scenario? Maybe a conference title in a watered-down G5. The NY6 path? Not happening. The bowl lineup? Boise, Tucson, Albuquerque; maybe Hawaii if the stars align. The MW Bowl Game affiliations are pretty terrible.

Meanwhile, FCS offers playoff games with real stakes, real energy, and real rivalries.

I’m not trying to dismiss what this program means to longtime fans. I just want Wyoming football to matter somewhere, because right now, it doesn’t feel like it does.
 
Moving to the FCS makes perfect sense. Particularly in men's basketball where our conference winning percentage during Burman's tenure is 37% with three winning seasons in conference play during the past 20 years. THat's not mediocre that's bad.

Why it won't / doesn't happen -- Burman wouldn't be making $500k a year to be the AD in the Big Sky, none of the associate AD's would be making their outrageous salaries, UW would have to cut sports like golf, women's tennis, track and field and assistant coaching jobs in football and basketball and those people all make good salaries as well. Additionally, UW sunk a lot of money into previous facilities including the AA, the new seating at War Memorial, this new pool. All of this infrastructure spending was designed to keep UW in the top tier of college athletics so now the administrators and coaches have to keep trying to piece together some type of "big time" conference to sell the legislature and BOT on to keep funding this calamity. It doesn't fool anybody with any real knowledge of college athletics, but it seems to work on the good old boys in the legislature and BOT.
 
I ain’t gonna lie. The whole mess with the Maggie’s and the goats moving up is something that really pisses me off. The goats haven’t been relevant in football, and have had a mediocre basketball team, and they are selected. I’m not convinced their viewership is more than UWs. Potential possibly, but CU and AFA have more potential in my opinion. I ain’t gonna lie. It pisses me off. I want to see nothing more than them become bottom dwellers. But, that means Oregon St and Wazzoo have some success and I despise them as well. They aren’t relevant or they would have been asked to join the BIG. So, a mediocre conference that isn’t a whole lot above the MW and the MW members get screwed. I hate the whole thing enough that I have little excitement about college sports. I’m about done. I despise Goat U and the other traitors.
 
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Itsux2beaewe said:
I ain’t gonna lie. The whole mess with the Maggie’s and the goats moving up is something that really pisses me off. The goats haven’t been relevant in football, and have had a mediocre basketball team, and they are selected. I’m not convinced their viewership is more that UWs. Potential possibly, but CU and AFA have more potential in my opinion. I ain’t gonna lie. It pisses me off. I want to see nothing more than them become bottom dwellers. But, that means Oregon St and Wazzoo have some success and I despise them as well. They aren’t relevant effort or they would have been asked to join the BIG. So, a mediocre conference that isn’t a whole lot above the MW and the MW meme ers get screwed. I hate the whole thing enough that I have little excitement about college sports. I’m about done. I despise Goat U and the other traitors.
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Totally hear the frustration... None of this was earned on the field. But the reality is, these moves aren’t about football or basketball success anymore. CSU gives the Pac-12 a way back into the Denver market, which they lost when CU left. That matters when you’re trying to show media partners you still have reach.

Comparing UW and CSU from a pure business lens isn’t even close. CSU has a bigger enrollment, just poured $200M+ into a new stadium, and sits in a more accessible location with better recruiting potential. Plus, it checks the boxes for research output and academic fit, which university presidents actually care about.

It’s definitely not about who’s actually winning games right now, nor is about anything that made college athletics special. But it’s the same playbook that’s been driving realignment for years... markets, money, and perceived prestige. And that’s why programs like UW are either on the outside or barely hanging on, while a team like CSU gets the nod. Doesn’t mean it’s the right, college athletics is no longer about the passion.
 
PAPoke said:
Appreciate the post. I’ll admit I’m not as steeped in Cowboy history as some of you, and I get that moving to FCS hits an emotional nerve. But I don’t think it’s unreasonable to ask what, exactly, we’re holding on to.

Yeah, we’ve had a few solid MWC seasons, but we’re not playing for anything meaningful. Most years, we’re scratching for .500 and a bowl invite that no one outside this time zone cares about. That might be enough for some, but not for most of this board.

I’d rather chase titles in a competitive FCS league with regional rivals I could travel to. Montana State, NDSU, SDSU, South Dakota (Final Four FCS teams, by the way)? That fires me up more than a Wednesday night in front of 9,000 fans against Hawaii.

And no, I don’t buy that everything collapses if we drop. Sure, some financials shift, but it’s not like we’re rolling in cash or recruits now. Being consistently competitive in a respected FCS league could energize the base in a way this version of the MWC just… doesn’t.

The 2026 Mountain West will be Wyoming, Air Force, Nevada, UNLV, New Mexico, San Jose State—and probably some lame call-ups. That’s not a prestigious league. Our best-case scenario? Maybe a conference title in a watered-down G5. The NY6 path? Not happening. The bowl lineup? Boise, Tucson, Albuquerque; maybe Hawaii if the stars align. The MW Bowl Game affiliations are pretty terrible.

Meanwhile, FCS offers playoff games with real stakes, real energy, and real rivalries.

I’m not trying to dismiss what this program means to longtime fans. I just want Wyoming football to matter somewhere, because right now, it doesn’t feel like it does.
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No disagreement on the terrible bowl tie ins for the mw. My hope is the bowls go away and we end up with some middle tier playoff with the current G5 instead of the bowls.

For me playing any of the Montana State, NDSU, SDSU, South Dakota doesn't energize me at all. Some of those we have played as our FCS game on a given year, and in my opinion it was the least exciting game on the schedule of that year.

I also tend to think that if we drop to FCS we will be playing FCS teams on Saturdays with 13000 to 15,000 fans in the stands. I think our average attendance will definitely drop if our entire schedule is FCS.

The reason I think we end up mid-tier FCS, is right now when we compete against those schools for recruits we can at least sell that we are still FBS and that may make a difference to some recruits and it puts us in the battle with schools like CSU and New Mexico for recruits that want to still be in FBS. Once we move down, those recruits won't come to us that want to be an FBS and we no longer can sell that against the Montana State, NDSU, etc. Then we will be a small school in a cold remote location that loses one of our recruiting pitches that perhaps currently wins us those recruiting battles against other FCS schools.

I expect the better FCS recruits will still go to the four schools that you listed that were in the final four of their playoff, they won't be jumping to us just because we dropped down from FBS.
 
PAPoke said:
Help me understand, genuinely trying to understand the perspective.

Over the past decade, the football team posted an overall record of 63–60 and a Conference record of 39–45… that’s not exactly anything to write home about.

Personally, I’d rather see us chase national competitiveness in the FCS than “generally competitive” in a floundering MWC, with no real path to any meaningful postseason besides the snoop dog, barstool, TikTok bowl game against a MAC team.
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i am not trying to be disrespectful to anyone on this forum. To me, FCS is just an also ran conference. We have been competitive for the last 10 years. But for this last year, we would have been a 500 team. Bohi had two years of rebuilding and did a good job (but it took time and his record sucked for those years). We have been owned by Boise State but not by any other program in MWC. We were a Cowboy tough team and knocked down some much bigger programs. Missouri, Texas Tech, Tennessee, UCLA, etc. I sometimes watch replays of those games and it makes me happy. I like knowing that Josh Allen, Chad Muma, Logan Wilson, Andrew Wingard, Carl Granderson, Tashaun Gipson, Brian Hill, Frank Crum, etc. played ball at Wyoming. I like NFL day at Wyoming. I like being an underdog and people saying...why would anyone schedule a game at Wyoming? I absolutely loved watching Carta Samuels face on the sideline when we beat Missouri. I loved the safety dance with BSU. Man, I have some great memories of this team and I do not want that to end. It will with FCS.

I do not care at all about FCS teams. I would probably find another underdog to root for but my kids go to St. Thomas (its like a high school atmosphere and no one cares) and the other at Marquette. I hate the Badgers.

A change to FCS would just be raising a white flag and giving up. Also, I know we were all disappointed with last year. We knew with NIL and the portal we were already in troubled waters. But who knows if Wyoming would have been in the discussion had we had a better year. For this, I think last year might have been more damaging than we can imagine. Just bad timing.

When I am done with work, I would like to move back to Laramie. I love the people, I love the state, I love UW and I love fishing. But I really love Cowboy football. I would love to see every home game and travel to different venues. We are already looking at places...still a couple years out. But if Wyoming dropped to FCS, it would matter. Kind of like the CFL vs. the NFL. Who cares.... Heck, I could move to South Carolina and be a Gamecocks fan. A joke.

But that is just me. If it is just about winning, just drop all the way down to the lowest level and by goodness dominate. Only, we would not. There's not a single Frank Crum or Logan Wilson who would play for Wyoming because its home.

Before dropping, I would prefer that Wyoming just end the program. Again, that is just me. One last comment, my youngest son is thinking about UW. He loves Laramie and the Cowboys. He told me he would not go to a school that does not have an FBS program. The energy on campuses on game day and school spirit is driven by these programs. It is part of college life (which I desperately missed as an undergrad). He laughs and teases my daughter when we watch a St. Thomas game. He was thrilled to be at the BYU game this past year even though we sucked.

This is all anecdotal and I am not trying to convince anyone. You asked for my perspective...there it is.
 
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Midwest Cowboy said:
I've followed Wyoming sports for 3 decades. I am not a fair-weather fan. I travel to see at least one or two games a year. Just about to make alumni donation (wife asked as I am writing this). If Wyoming moves to FCS, I will never travel to or watch another game. Wyoming will be irrelevant and I will close the door on that chapter. End of story.

Wyoming was horrible last year. But we are generally competitive in the Mountain West. Our problem is out of conference and away games. But we still managed to close out the season pretty well with a good game against Boise State and a win against Washington State. And attendance is about what Washington State musters.

I cannot stand FCS discussion. Nevarez got played so we should move down. Whatever.
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Either way we’re irrelevant, thanks to decades of shitty leadership, coaching, and a complete lack of accountability.

A career sub .500 curmudgeon with zero conference championships is on our Rushmore for fuck sake. We have a Teflon AD that has somehow outlasted several career ending hires and publicly admitted that mediocrity is an acceptable standard.

In that regard we aren’t even FCS caliber.
 
Before any fcs discussions, we need to see what the landscape of cfb will be. The effects of the House Settlement can't be understood. Revenue sharing and NIL and payments for the Settlement itself? There will be lots of programs, big and small that will struggle with this.

It's clear that at minimum sec and big10 are either going to split or ask for so much unequal revenue/playoff access that the system will be very unstable eventually leading to split.

The split will likely be along the lines of who can afford to pay (at a high level) to play. Maybe not even all the power schools will be able to afford it? Maybe it will just be along p4 vs g6 lines? Bottom line is that we don't even know what college football will look like in 5 or 10 years, but I think it is certain that it will look much different.

We'll now be in a situation that we can or should be able to compete more consistently for mwc championships. We still have power schools on the schedule. csu vs WYO has had very little conference implications anyway and they're still on the schedule. usu? I'm glad they're gone and off the schedule. Uneven distribution to kiss bsu behind? They're a loss and obvious name brand but glad to get rid of sweetheart deals. fsu and suds? Good programs but I honestly didn't care about playing them anyway. If they weren't on the rotation,it didn't bother me.

Yeah, certainly a weaker conference but I don't think it's that bad. Winning in this conference with a decent ooc slate might be better than .500 or worse in a stronger conference? We're on a new boat and likely sailing in new waters in the not too distant future. I want to see how all of this goes before thinking about fcs, fbs, etc. There might not even be a fbs any longer?
 
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