UW Block Grant Budget Amendment

[LanderPoke]

I'm curious why you don't care what gets taught to children and impressionable college students. Democrats and other leftists sure care what is being taught and they are winning because they have cared more than conservatives and have become entrenched in academia. Dems don't give a f-word about academic freedom, or freedom in general, they just want to force their views and ideology on anyone and everyone, so we may as well ensure good social principals are taught and not the principals of marxism and racism as the dems are wont to do.

What are proper courses for a University to teach? Perhaps the Legislature can go through the course catalogue and line item the things that they think are superfluous and indoctrinating every year? Should we go through Coe Library and find all the evil indoctrinating books and burn them on Prexie's Pasture? Impressionable college kids shouldn't be trusted with such filth, right? Also, I'm dying to know: What are "good social principals (sic)" in your book?

The only reason any of the DEI classes exist is because the University mandates them. Few would take them and the departments would probably go out of existence on their own. Anyway, I think a classic liberal arts curriculum would be more beneficial. Instead of requiring Gender Studies or whatever, why not a proper Western Civ class? Anyway, so you think Dems should get their way concerning education and conservatives should just shut up and take whatever the entrenched left-leaning academics come up with?

 

[OrediggerPoke]

What are proper courses for a University to teach? Perhaps the Legislature can go through the course catalogue and line item the things that they think are superfluous and indoctrinating every year? Should we go through Coe Library and find all the evil indoctrinating books and burn them on Prexie's Pasture? Impressionable college kids shouldn't be trusted with such filth, right? Also, I'm dying to know: What are "good social principals (sic)" in your book?

The only reason any of the DEI classes exist is because the University mandates them. Few would take them and the departments would probably go out of existence on their own. Anyway, I think a classic liberal arts curriculum would be more beneficial. Instead of requiring Gender Studies or whatever, why not a proper Western Civ class? Anyway, so you think Dems should get their way concerning education and conservatives should just shut up and take whatever the entrenched left-leaning academics come up with?

You think we should also have the legislature review the syllabi of each professor? It seems regardless as to what you title a class, the professor might deviate from what the legislature believes they ought to teach. I mean, we ought to ensure that our highly impressionable adult college students don’t get any of this filth teaching.

 

[LanderPoke]

The only reason any of the DEI classes exist is because the University mandates them. Few would take them and the departments would probably go out of existence on their own. Anyway, I think a classic liberal arts curriculum would be more beneficial. Instead of requiring Gender Studies or whatever, why not a proper Western Civ class? Anyway, so you think Dems should get their way concerning education and conservatives should just shut up and take whatever the entrenched left-leaning academics come up with?

You think we should also have the legislature review the syllabi of each professor? It seems regardless as to what you title a class, the professor might deviate from what the legislature believes they ought to teach. I mean, we ought to ensure that our highly impressionable adult college students don’t get any of this filth teaching.

No, there needs to be a little more autonomy than that, obviously, but this is a natural push back to the takeover of academia by leftists. Shouldn't what the University teaches reflect the morals and values of the population it represents in some form? Many Wyomingites, including the legislature, aren't cool with all the racism and marxism being taught. I would be fine with those departments still existing, but drop the requirements for student to HAVE to take those classes. If those departments can stand on their own without forcing students to take their classes then they can continue to exist. And don't act like these gender studies classes are pillars of a good education

 

[OrediggerPoke]

You think we should also have the legislature review the syllabi of each professor? It seems regardless as to what you title a class, the professor might deviate from what the legislature believes they ought to teach. I mean, we ought to ensure that our highly impressionable adult college students don’t get any of this filth teaching.

No, there needs to be a little more autonomy than that, obviously, but this is a natural push back to the takeover of academia by leftists. Shouldn't what the University teaches reflect the morals and values of the population it represents in some form? Many Wyomingites, including the legislature, aren't cool with all the racism and marxism being taught. I would be fine with those departments still existing, but drop the requirements for student to HAVE to take those classes. If those departments can stand on their own without forcing students to take their classes then they can continue to exist. And don't act like these gender studies classes are pillars of a good education

I credit my education for providing me with an ability to think and decide on my own. I credit some professors I had with views far opposing mine for the ability to disagree and to take a stand against their view. I am thankful my education wasn’t merely a legislative echo chamber.

I credit colleagues and students challenging my views in various professional courses that I have taught. I am thankful that I had an environment for the exchange of ideas.

I regret that the state I owe a lot to has turned its back on the freedom of thought and speech and the exchange of ideas.

 

[LanderPoke]

No, there needs to be a little more autonomy than that, obviously, but this is a natural push back to the takeover of academia by leftists. Shouldn't what the University teaches reflect the morals and values of the population it represents in some form? Many Wyomingites, including the legislature, aren't cool with all the racism and marxism being taught. I would be fine with those departments still existing, but drop the requirements for student to HAVE to take those classes. If those departments can stand on their own without forcing students to take their classes then they can continue to exist. And don't act like these gender studies classes are pillars of a good education

I credit my education for providing me with an ability to think and decide on my own. I credit some professors I had with views far opposing mine for the ability to disagree and to take a stand against their view. I am thankful my education wasn’t merely a legislative echo chamber.

What you are describing is an environment that USED to exist in academia.. and really not all that long ago from what I've gathered from my readings. This is what it should be like, but it's turning, or has turned into a leftist echo chamber where you are ostracized if you express a view point contrary to the leftist orthodoxy. And this really isn't an exaggeration. Look at the dem to republican ratio

https://www.natcom.org/sites/default/files/publications/NCA_C-Brief_2017_March.pdf

You don't think a little balance is needed? You don't want things brought back to the center? It IS an echo chamber currently and not a Wyoming Republican legislative echo chamber.

 

[ragtimejoe1]

No, there needs to be a little more autonomy than that, obviously, but this is a natural push back to the takeover of academia by leftists. Shouldn't what the University teaches reflect the morals and values of the population it represents in some form? Many Wyomingites, including the legislature, aren't cool with all the racism and marxism being taught. I would be fine with those departments still existing, but drop the requirements for student to HAVE to take those classes. If those departments can stand on their own without forcing students to take their classes then they can continue to exist. And don't act like these gender studies classes are pillars of a good education

I credit my education for providing me with an ability to think and decide on my own. I credit some professors I had with views far opposing mine for the ability to disagree and to take a stand against their view. I am thankful my education wasn’t merely a legislative echo chamber.

I credit colleagues and students challenging my views in various professional courses that I have taught. I am thankful that I had an environment for the exchange of ideas.

I regret that the state I owe a lot to has turned its back on the freedom of thought and speech and the exchange of ideas.

The revealing facts unfolding in the ai world and established in the big tech world has justifiably stoked fears of the same occurring in academics. There clearly is data supporting that concept; the extent at UW? I have no idea.

WYO legislature is a bit misguided, however. It isn't so much what is taught, as much as it is what is not taught. Ensuring additional perspectives are included in the curriculum and Lander's suggestion of dropping the requirement to take the courses would likely be sufficient. Also great idea to require those to stand on their own.

 

[Itsux2beaewe]

No, there needs to be a little more autonomy than that, obviously, but this is a natural push back to the takeover of academia by leftists. Shouldn't what the University teaches reflect the morals and values of the population it represents in some form? Many Wyomingites, including the legislature, aren't cool with all the racism and marxism being taught. I would be fine with those departments still existing, but drop the requirements for student to HAVE to take those classes. If those departments can stand on their own without forcing students to take their classes then they can continue to exist. And don't act like these gender studies classes are pillars of a good education

I credit my education for providing me with an ability to think and decide on my own. I credit some professors I had with views far opposing mine for the ability to disagree and to take a stand against their view. I am thankful my education wasn’t merely a legislative echo chamber.

I credit colleagues and students challenging my views in various professional courses that I have taught. I am thankful that I had an environment for the exchange of ideas.

I regret that the state I owe a lot to has turned its back on the freedom of thought and speech and the exchange of ideas.

All well and good up and until the liberal professor realized you’re a conservative and grades according to your political ideology, versus your ability to comprehend the material being taught. May not be widespread at UW, but it is happening in colleges and universities, and has for years. Unfortunately it isn’t just in college, it’s happening K-12. Hence…….indoctrination. Why do you think parents want a voucher system so they can choose a different school that isn’t has influenced by liberal ideology? Why do you think the teachers unions always support the democratic or liberal Presidential candidate? Are you really naive enough to believe it doesn’t continue into college…….. ?

 

[LawPoke]

You think we should also have the legislature review the syllabi of each professor? It seems regardless as to what you title a class, the professor might deviate from what the legislature believes they ought to teach. I mean, we ought to ensure that our highly impressionable adult college students don’t get any of this filth teaching.

No, there needs to be a little more autonomy than that, obviously, but this is a natural push back to the takeover of academia by leftists. Shouldn't what the University teaches reflect the morals and values of the population it represents in some form? Many Wyomingites, including the legislature, aren't cool with all the racism and marxism being taught. I would be fine with those departments still existing, but drop the requirements for student to HAVE to take those classes. If those departments can stand on their own without forcing students to take their classes then they can continue to exist. And don't act like these gender studies classes are pillars of a good education

What are the morals and values of people in Wyoming? Who decides?

Ultimately, I generally agree with the general tenets of the 1862 Morrill Act as a starting point for what UW should focus on: teaching of practical agriculture, science, military science, and engineering. However, the other piece of the land grant movement is often forgotten or intentionally denied and shouldn't be - this being that these practical studies should not be pursued "without excluding other scientific and classical studies". Sure - teach readin', writin' and 'rithmetic (then the question is, what are we allowing students to read, write and figure) - but most of professional and personal life is about relating to one another and understanding perspectives. Historically, in places that were rural and remote, the university was more liberal just because they invited more diverse populations (thought and race and gender) than existed in the regular population. Good, bad or indifferent, that will likely always be the case. To me, the answer isn't to censor anyone (left, right, middle, socialist, industrialist...whatever). If cutting Women's Studies was rooted in budget concerns - that would be one thing. But the amendment - and the shift from the block grant model amendment - are not about budget concerns. They are about the Wyoming Legislature censoring what they think they don't like - when I would bet most legislators have no clue what is actually taught in a women's studies or american folklife course. I guess I have more faith in students and people to think freely and sort it out on their own.

 

[LawPoke]

I credit my education for providing me with an ability to think and decide on my own. I credit some professors I had with views far opposing mine for the ability to disagree and to take a stand against their view. I am thankful my education wasn’t merely a legislative echo chamber.

I credit colleagues and students challenging my views in various professional courses that I have taught. I am thankful that I had an environment for the exchange of ideas.

I regret that the state I owe a lot to has turned its back on the freedom of thought and speech and the exchange of ideas.

All well and good up and until the liberal professor realized you’re a conservative and grades according to your political ideology, versus your ability to comprehend the material being taught. May not be widespread at UW, but it is happening in colleges and universities, and has for years. Unfortunately it isn’t just in college, it’s happening K-12. Hence…….indoctrination. Why do you think parents want a voucher system so they can choose a different school that isn’t has influenced by liberal ideology? Why do you think the teachers unions always support the democratic or liberal Presidential candidate? Are you really naive enough to believe it doesn’t continue into college…….. ?

When I attended UW, I was just right of Rush Limbaugh. The world has taught me a lot since then, but I took courses from very liberal profs. I was outspoken in class. I never experienced any diminution in my grade from my conservative worldview. I was challenged. I was questioned. But I was also celebrated and encouraged. They loved the back and forth. Iron sharpens iron. I have no doubt that what you said may happen - but I just don't believe it happens a lot. I do think other students push guilt onto white males - and wrongly question their motives and thinking. I did experience that. But almost universally from other students - not faculty.

As for K-12 in Wyoming, I think our teachers do a great job - as do our administrators. My sons and their friends (and I) have all received amazing educations. When I ask about litterboxes in bathrooms, trans issues being discussed, etc. - my boys just laugh. When I ask about what books they are reading or classes they are taking - they are still mostly the classics that I studied from. Some are edgy - but most aren't. What I see more than anything are local schoolboards conflating national fearmongering with non-existent situations in Wyoming schools to score political points and scare people. I don't much care about vouchers, so long as my tax dollars don't go to racists, sexists and bigots - which was what many private schools were founded on after the Civil Rights Act. Many charter and even religious schools are fantastic.

 

[OrediggerPoke]

Guess What - you really can’t currently develop a hydrogen, nuclear, natural gas to hydrogen, coal to natural gas, oil and natural gas produced water to hydrogen, etc…project without an ‘energy justice’ or ‘social justice’’ evaluation. This is because these new projects have such high capital costs that private energy will only agree to undertake them if they can qualify for available federal grant dollars (such as under the Infrastructure and Investment Jobs Act). Well congressional limitations and agency rules (under DOE) require the ‘energy justice’ analysis to qualify for the dollars.

While I disagree strongly with these restrictions, the legal path has unfortunately been set. So if Wyoming wants these potentially fossil fuel incentivizing projects, then it has to be subject to these ‘energy justice’ evaluations. Should the University and legislature just say we don’t educate students in these necessary energy career paths so take your project somewhere else?

 

[ragtimejoe1]

Guess What - you really can’t currently develop a hydrogen, nuclear, natural gas to hydrogen, coal to natural gas, oil and natural gas produced water to hydrogen, etc…project without an ‘energy justice’ or ‘social justice’’ evaluation. This is because these new projects have such high capital costs that private energy will only agree to undertake them if they can qualify for available federal grant dollars (such as under the Infrastructure and Investment Jobs Act). Well congressional limitations and agency rules (under DOE) require the ‘energy justice’ analysis to qualify for the dollars.

While I disagree strongly with these restrictions, the legal path has unfortunately been set. So if Wyoming wants these potentially fossil fuel incentivizing projects, then it has to be subject to these ‘energy justice’ evaluations. Should the University and legislature just say we don’t educate students in these necessary energy career paths so take your project somewhere else?

And those requirements can go away just as quickly as they were implemented.

 

[OrediggerPoke]

Guess What - you really can’t currently develop a hydrogen, nuclear, natural gas to hydrogen, coal to natural gas, oil and natural gas produced water to hydrogen, etc…project without an ‘energy justice’ or ‘social justice’’ evaluation. This is because these new projects have such high capital costs that private energy will only agree to undertake them if they can qualify for available federal grant dollars (such as under the Infrastructure and Investment Jobs Act). Well congressional limitations and agency rules (under DOE) require the ‘energy justice’ analysis to qualify for the dollars.

While I disagree strongly with these restrictions, the legal path has unfortunately been set. So if Wyoming wants these potentially fossil fuel incentivizing projects, then it has to be subject to these ‘energy justice’ evaluations. Should the University and legislature just say we don’t educate students in these necessary energy career paths so take your project somewhere else?

And those requirements can go away just as quickly as they were implemented.

I wish. Let’s be realistic, Congress can’t get anything done. The dollars were largely tied to and allocated under the Infrastructure Investment and Job Act. Repeal of the energy funds wouldn’t help. Amendment to that bill appears unlikely. We are 50 plus years into the National Environmental Policy Act, which everyone seems to agree has been nothing but a disaster preventing development, yet we can’t get any significant changes to it through multiple administrations.

 

[ragtimejoe1]

And those requirements can go away just as quickly as they were implemented.

I wish. Let’s be realistic, Congress can’t get anything done. The dollars were largely tied to and allocated under the Infrastructure Investment and Job Act. Repeal of the energy funds wouldn’t help. Amendment to that bill appears unlikely. We are 50 plus years into the National Environmental Policy Act, which everyone seems to agree has been nothing but a disaster preventing development, yet we can’t get any significant changes to it through multiple administrations.

Yes, but the requirements to obtain the funding can be altered without congressional approval. It happens all the time with other funding sources. I don't know specifically for these energy funds, but I'd be shocked if the specific diversity criteria were coded into law.

 

[LanderPoke]

All well and good up and until the liberal professor realized you’re a conservative and grades according to your political ideology, versus your ability to comprehend the material being taught. May not be widespread at UW, but it is happening in colleges and universities, and has for years. Unfortunately it isn’t just in college, it’s happening K-12. Hence…….indoctrination. Why do you think parents want a voucher system so they can choose a different school that isn’t has influenced by liberal ideology? Why do you think the teachers unions always support the democratic or liberal Presidential candidate? Are you really naive enough to believe it doesn’t continue into college…….. ?

As for K-12 in Wyoming, I think our teachers do a great job - as do our administrators. My sons and their friends (and I) have all received amazing educations. When I ask about litterboxes in bathrooms, trans issues being discussed, etc. - my boys just laugh. When I ask about what books they are reading or classes they are taking - they are still mostly the classics that I studied from. Some are edgy - but most aren't. What I see more than anything are local schoolboards conflating national fearmongering with non-existent situations in Wyoming schools to score political points and scare people. I don't much care about vouchers, so long as my tax dollars don't go to racists, the deed and bigots - which was what many private schools were founded on after the Civil Rights Act. Many charter and even religious schools are fantastic.

I agree my kids are mostly getting a good public education going to school in Wyoming. There is still some woke shit, though. They do this thing called "Wit and Wisdom" and it's basically critical race theory. I have to properly educate my kids on things. It's all about the first immigrant to do this and the first minority to do that and how oppressed everyone was from the white European colonizers - and they don't learn any traditional American history. Also, the math now, imo, is stupid AF. Maybe the math they do now is somehow training their brains to do next level stuff, but I doubt it. Science education is top notch though.

 

[doreno5]

Gentlemen and ladies, can we get back to discussing sports?

 

[Wyokie]

Gentlemen and ladies, can we get back to discussing sports?

:rofl: :rofl: No can do since both of the $$$ making athletic programs at UW stink!!!! :roll:

 

[sandiegopoke]

catastrophic AGW

I've got bad news for you if you think this "indoctrination." :rofl:

 

[LanderPoke]

catastrophic AGW

I've got bad news for you if you think this "indoctrination." :rofl:

lol at you

 

[HR_Poke]

I’m guessing ExpatPoke, right above yours stepped foot on UWs campus recently. Actually was in classrooms. His take is different than yours.

He also thinks this is a bad idea, does he not. I have no idea what his degree is in, maybe it was some kind of liberal arts degree due all I know. I can tell you, with my science degree, I didn’t have to take any of these kind of classes. Lots of math, science, and history for me. Little bit of anthropology too. Maybe that was my forced diversity indoctrination credit Graduated in 15, so I stepped foot in a lot of classes.

You didn’t address the fact that entire MBA program tries to push everyone to work in Oil and Gas. That’s convenient.
Am I clamoring to have government regulate that? Nope.

And we aren’t in any way affiliated with the University.

Like I said, I’m a republican, more socially libertarian than anything I guess as in I’m not trying to control what gets taught, thought, and done in people’s bodies, bedrooms, and private lives. And frankly, I too find all the stuff you guys are so worked up about to be silly. But you have to recognize that we’re dealing with two sides of the same stupid coin here. You don’t solve the problem of people trying to force their beliefs on somebody by forcing your opposite beliefs on somebody. The far left and the far right are equally repugnant to me, both sides want to force their beliefs on everyone through government. I find the vast majority of people fall into those categories, nanny state types. Cry when the other side does it and turn a blind eye when their team gets away with, if not endorsing it outright.

I got a BS in Biology and GIS on the old catalog prior to the change over in ~2003 at UW. The college of arts and sciences required several humanities classes under the old catalog to get a degree. There was an art credit, 3 English credits, 2 math credits as well as 2 upper division courses outside of your major. The point of a liberal arts degree which includes most of the science degrees offered at the university require you to take humanities classes to make you a more well rounded individual. My wife got a BS in accounting from UW and she had similar requirements from the Business College in terms of getting credits in biology, Spanish and Womens studies to fill out her humanities requirements. It was very common to take a couple of these classes.

 

[laxwyo]

University faculty went from something like 75% democrat to 99% and dudes are here arguing that they’re bastions of free thought and expression :lol:

Dudes, the university you remember doesn’t exist anymore. sure, Wyoming hasn’t gone down with the ship yet but it’ll get there. You remember the meltdown about Lummis saying there’s only two genders and our limp wristed president had to write an apology?

I say let the free market decide. Find a way to make them stand on their own and then cut it all out. Purple hair weirdos can go to liberal arts colleges to learn that nonsense. Yes, there’s schools just for worthless stuff. Wyoming should stick to math, science, tech, business etc.