• Hi Guest, want to participate in the discussions, keep track of read/unread posts and more? Create your free account and increase the benefits of your WyoNation.com experience today!

The battle ensues.

kansasCowboy

kansasCowboy

Well-known member
Wyoalum87 and whomever else tends to disagree with me,

This is in response to Wyoalums post against me earlier yesterday, I've since not been able to find the thread, but I'm sure you remember it.

Strong contributor... Sounded like you were getting ready to go off on how much you all give again. But when it comes to conversing in these threads on this board, I'm a key contributor. Sometimes I argue, especially when I strongly disagree with fellow fans tearing down players, coaches and the overall program. That's the beauty of this site and of argue and debate.

But every time i prove someone wrong on here, I either get ignored, scoffed at or I get an " agree to disagree." None of those are contributions to a discussion. I really don't appreciate you calling me out either.

So for starters according to you the team playing crappy last week is the coaches fault. Okay, so:
Smith throwing balls in the turf or behind his WRs, to you that's the coaches fault, right? Even though Brett has proved his accuracy time and again.
Herron having long balls land right in his hands on four different occasions and drops it, that's coaching, right?
Walker Madden getting his butt handed to him by defenders play after play, all game long. Getting frustrated and called for two holding penalties that negated to big plays, in your mind that's the coach?
The O-Line not showing up at all, couldn't give Smith 2 sec to throw the ball. Smith constantly getting hit from the blindside ant couldn't open a decent hole for Wick to get anything going, that's coaching? Even though our O-Line has proven to open big holes for Wick to run through this season.
What about the faulty handoffs all day long between Smith and Wick? They've handled the handoffs perfectly fine all year long but almost every handoff between them on Saturday was either bobbled or dropped. But I bet you blame the coaches huh?
I know you don't like to place the blame on the players but they are the ones on the field that are supposed to execute the plays. The coaches can't go out and do it. The fans, even though they'd love to can't go on the field and make the plays. So who does the responsibility fall on? The players.

Moving on, I've never said I don't want to hear any of you "bitch", I've joined the conversations and even started my own. I'm a regular here, and I've been engaged in almost every thread since the game. I've taken on practically this entire board since the game, while keeping my composure. So, again, I do not appreciate you trying to call me out.
I think your starting to get me mixed up with someone else too, cause I've not called anyone names when I don't agree. I give valid points with facts and examples only to have you and others on here slam me!

I've been refuting a lot of what's been said on here in the last four weeks now, I can't help that you all just don't like hearing it.

You telling me to ," stick my head where the sun don't shine" is far worse than anything I've ever said to any of you. You've "rolled your eyes" at my example of my own team and give me a quote as if it's some sort of advice. How about you prove to me that you legitimately know what your talking about before you offer me any kind of advice?

You are right on a few things though, us Cowboy fans aren't a shy bunch. And just like you, I will not be intimidated. I've been respectful, but, I sure as he'll won't back down!
 
Good post. I noticed the whole team seemed off, including the items you mentioned. But the most glaring is the handoffs to wick. They practice that every day, they have played 6 games previous where it wasn't a problem. Something happened to the players to lose focuse for this game. I don't know if they don't want to play for DC anymore, or they just got cocky and thought it should be a walk in the park. But for some reason they didn't show up, and I don't know why. I'm hoping that the loss solves their attitude issues, but only time will tell.
 
Lack of focus, being overly cocky, not wanting to play for DC anymore.....whatever happened on Saturday was embarrassing. DC needed to have these guys match the intensity that CSU had and he didn't. I thought we were progressing, but that loss took the wind out of my sails. DC better be able to pull a few more wins out of his ass otherwise it might be time. I understand giving the coach time, but games like what we witnessed on Saturday shouldn't happen. That goes for the Texas State game as well....which I thought was more about the lightning delay, but now I'm just not sure what to think.

Beat SJSU and restore some faith Pokes.
 
JimmyDimes said:
Lack of focus, being overly cocky, not wanting to play for DC anymore.....whatever happened on Saturday was embarrassing. DC needed to have these guys match the intensity that CSU had and he didn't. I thought we were progressing, but that loss took the wind out of my sails. DC better be able to pull a few more wins out of his ass otherwise it might be time. I understand giving the coach time, but games like what we witnessed on Saturday shouldn't happen. That goes for the Texas State game as well....which I thought was more about the lightning delay, but now I'm just not sure what to think.

Beat SJSU and restore some faith Pokes.
Click to expand...

didn't think about it this way, but you might be on to something, maybe DC's way too tough to play for????
 
Team respect of the coach/coaching staff/athletic department is as important as physical conditioning and learning/practicing their particular assignments for a game. If you don't have respect in those areas, your attitude becomes "I don't care", and when that happens we get the results like we saw this last Saturday. I've experienced this myself and I have seen this many times. You can't just say the players aren't making the plays - it goes much deeper than that. Some coaches & administrators don't understand that.
 
Kansascowboy you sure do like to make excuses for the coach. I hope you take more accountability in your own coaching.

Yes, the players have to perform. However, it is the coach's responsibility to prepare the team to play. It is the coach's responsibility to either help or remove an O-lineman that is getting dominated (before the lineman goes and commits two holds and gives up a sack in a matter of a few plays). It is the coach's responsibility to call plays with a higher completion success when the QB is struggling. It is the coach's responsibility to make adjustments on defense throughout the game. It is the coach's respnsibility to put faith in the team and not punt the ball when the game is mathermatically still in doubt.

Following your line of reasoning a coach should NEVER be fired, because after all it is always the players that should make the plays and the fault can't lie with the coach. Our coaches are 40+ years old, they should be able to handle the critisism. Personally, I don't care for a coach that throws the players under the bus and doesn't accept responsibility.
 
There are two extremes: One side who says everything is the coaches fault, and the other side that says everything is the players fault.

Neither is true. It's a shared responsibility.

People will disagree, but this is my thinking...a bad coach with great players will still end up beating a good coach with bad players on most days.
 
BackHarlowRoad said:
There are two extremes: One side who says everything is the coaches fault, and the other side that says everything is the players fault.

Neither is true. It's a shared responsibility.

People will disagree, but this is my thinking...a bad coach with great players will still end up beating a good coach with bad players on most days.
Click to expand...
Joe Glenn couldn't get it done in conference, but he took very mediocre talent into games against UVA, Ole Miss (twice), UCLA, and Tennessee and came away with victories. The one thing that can be said about Joe Glenn...his players would do anything for him and he could motivate. His teams had good defenses, but the worst offenses Wyoming has ever seen...and still beat some big time programs.
 
I have a theory of what might be happening.

Some schools may be going very high tech. They recruit the best dweebs in the Computer Science Department. They develop software that analyses every play in every game the opponent has played. The more games played, the more data. This software can then be used in a predictive way to determine probabilities of what the opponent will do on each play, given the down, the yard marker, the field personnel, and the defensive alignment, among other things.

Could this be why the Pokes seem to be going down hill as the season progresses? The software predicts what they will do to within a certain accuracy. The solution is to change up everything in every game.
 
Want to see how much a good coach can literally change a program...look at Bob Stitt at the Colorado School of Mines. Mines had about one winning football season in 50 years prior to Stitt joining the program in 2000 and inheriting a team that won one game in the prior season. Since he took over, Mines has only finished 2 seasons under .500 (including his first year) and Mines has made multiple playoff appearances. Stitt has a 90-57 record at Mines, where there are many obstacles to coaching a football team.
 
kansasCowboy...

For some reason you really despise posters that disagree with you, or don't see things like you do. This is a message board, it happens continually, that is what makes it function. Why so uptight and bitter (sounding)? Then again, maybe your post should have been a direct PM to WyoAlum1987.
 
HR_Poke said:
Good post. I noticed the whole team seemed off, including the items you mentioned. But the most glaring is the handoffs to wick. They practice that every day, they have played 6 games previous where it wasn't a problem. Something happened to the players to lose focuse for this game. I don't know if they don't want to play for DC anymore, or they just got cocky and thought it should be a walk in the park. But for some reason they didn't show up, and I don't know why. I'm hoping that the loss solves their attitude issues, but only time will tell.
Click to expand...

Those handoff exchanges were inexcusable. It looked like Brett was pulling the ball out after the read was completed. I saw Wick visibly upset on the field when a ball was pulled late while he was beginning his burst. The Goal line exchange was almost the same, the RB was hitting the hole while Brett was pulling it again and landed on the turf. From my perspective it seemed like Brett was forcing it and trying to hard to make a play. Brett is an emotional player sometimes it is his pitfall ( getting ejected against Nevada for being flagged twice taunting players). I love players that have a attitude like Brett, but he has to control his emotions on the field and keep a cool head. I think we bounce back against SJSU and Brett has a big game. This is a great matchup for the Cowboys and on paper we should win this game. This is a make or break game going into another Bye week.
 
McPeachy said:
kansasCowboy...

For some reason you really despise posters that disagree with you, or don't see things like you do. This is a message board, it happens continually, that is what makes it function. Why so uptight and bitter (sounding)? Then again, maybe your post should have been a direct PM to WyoAlum1987.
Click to expand...

Nope. I'm not bitter at all. I don't despise anyone either. I could've PM'd Wyoalum87 but his post directed at me for all to see, so I'm not going to hide anything. My post is my thoughts on his post on me. I don't even think I showed any malice in my response here.

For some of you others that have posted on here, no, I don't make excuses. I full well take the blame when I know I haven't given my all to prepare my team. But I don't take shortcuts. We set our system in place to better prepare our guys for upcoming games. Hence why we as coaches do about 20 hours of film on the opponent. List off individual assignments during team film and then do a walk through of each players assignments on the field followed by those same assignments at full speed for an hour each practice leading up to the game. The day before the game the players are given a test to make sure they know they're individual assignments. If they fail then the backup starts over them. After 20 hours of film I've got our offensive game plan down. We are similar to DC. We run three formation at six plays per formation. The rest of our time through the week is spent going through each play that we will have for the game.
To answer another question, no, I don't put full blame on my kids. I also have to call a good game. I know my offense backwards and forwards, I know exactly what to call based on the coverage or the defensive front. Very rarely will I try something unusual. And when I do it's normally turned into a turnover. I will take the blame for something like that. But I will hold my players accountable when they are responsible for a turnover or their play digresses. My QB threw a beautiful pass to a wide open WR on 3rd and 1. He was 15 yards behind the nearest defender. He pulled a Herron and bobbled and dropped the ball. He was prepared for that specific play. It was in his individual assignment to block then release and run a wheel route opposite of our play action. We walked through this specific play five times that week. We ran it full speed a dozen times. Our best and most sure handed receiver, he caught the pass every time we ran it. Game time, he gets the ball right in his numbers and, well, you know the rest. Was he not prepared enough? He was as prepared as I could get him. It was the perfect call, the player misses it. Who's responsible? My QB would not go through all of his reads before taking off on foot and getting very minimal gain when he had two guys wide open on the sidelines several different times. My O- line would forget their blocking assignments, even after countless film and walk through a and even full speed, even our review before the game. Then it seemed to go out the window during the game.
So yes, it can be players and it can be coaches, but our coaches can't coach effort. Everything I gave as an example up above with WYO is a perfect example of this.
 
kansasCowboy said:
McPeachy said:
kansasCowboy...

For some reason you really despise posters that disagree with you, or don't see things like you do. This is a message board, it happens continually, that is what makes it function. Why so uptight and bitter (sounding)? Then again, maybe your post should have been a direct PM to WyoAlum1987.
Click to expand...

Nope. I'm not bitter at all. I don't despise anyone either. I could've PM'd Wyoalum87 but his post directed at me for all to see, so I'm not going to hide anything. My post is my thoughts on his post on me. I don't even think I showed any malice in my response here.

For some of you others that have posted on here, no, I don't make excuses. I full well take the blame when I know I haven't given my all to prepare my team. But I don't take shortcuts. We set our system in place to better prepare our guys for upcoming games. Hence why we as coaches do about 20 hours of film on the opponent. List off individual assignments during team film and then do a walk through of each players assignments on the field followed by those same assignments at full speed for an hour each practice leading up to the game. The day before the game the players are given a test to make sure they know they're individual assignments. If they fail then the backup starts over them. After 20 hours of film I've got our offensive game plan down. We are similar to DC. We run three formation at six plays per formation. The rest of our time through the week is spent going through each play that we will have for the game.
To answer another question, no, I don't put full blame on my kids. I also have to call a good game. I know my offense backwards and forwards, I know exactly what to call based on the coverage or the defensive front. Very rarely will I try something unusual. And when I do it's normally turned into a turnover. I will take the blame for something like that. But I will hold my players accountable when they are responsible for a turnover or their play digresses. My QB threw a beautiful pass to a wide open WR on 3rd and 1. He was 15 yards behind the nearest defender. He pulled a Herron and bobbled and dropped the ball. He was prepared for that specific play. It was in his individual assignment to block then release and run a wheel route opposite of our play action. We walked through this specific play five times that week. We ran it full speed a dozen times. Our best and most sure handed receiver, he caught the pass every time we ran it. Game time, he gets the ball right in his numbers and, well, you know the rest. Was he not prepared enough? He was as prepared as I could get him. It was the perfect call, the player misses it. Who's responsible? My QB would not go through all of his reads before taking off on foot and getting very minimal gain when he had two guys wide open on the sidelines several different times. My O- line would forget their blocking assignments, even after countless film and walk through a and even full speed, even our review before the game. Then it seemed to go out the window during the game.
So yes, it can be players and it can be coaches, but our coaches can't coach effort. Everything I gave as an example up above with WYO is a perfect example of this.
Click to expand...

Fair enough. Agree very much with your second to last sentence.
 
I'm with Kansas.
So many posts on here technically aren't cussing or talking shit, but aimed at a few posters instigating shit. Then the person who was provoked says something, then a bunch of people respond with "Whoa why are you yelling!"

Just because we don't share the miserable view on UW sports like a lot of you, doesn't mean you have to tear us down.
Misery loves company, but damn, there is enough already, leave us "sunshine pumpers" alone.
 
BackHarlowRoad said:
There are two extremes: One side who says everything is the coaches fault, and the other side that says everything is the players fault.

Neither is true. It's a shared responsibility.
Click to expand...

Does it really matter? This isn't the NFL. You can't blame the GM. The coaching staff has 100% control over personnel. They decide who gets the 85 scholarships every year. They recruit the players and they coach the players.

During this initial phase of a coaching tenure you can at least make the case that the coaching staff did not in fact recruit the players in the program. That is not the case with our program at this stage.

Why is one team better than the other? Either they have better players or their players are prepared at a higher level by their coaching staff. Regardless, the on-field competitive performance is 100% within the responsibility of the coaching staff (barring unique situations such as NCAA scholarship reductions, etc.)
 
BeaverPoke said:
I'm with Kansas.
So many posts on here technically aren't cussing or talking shit, but aimed at a few posters instigating shit. Then the person who was provoked says something, then a bunch of people respond with "Whoa why are you yelling!"

Just because we don't share the miserable view on UW sports like a lot of you, doesn't mean you have to tear us down.
Misery loves company, but damn, there is enough already, leave us "sunshine pumpers" alone.
Click to expand...
Break out the violin and cry me a river.
 
Cuttslam said:
BeaverPoke said:
I'm with Kansas.
So many posts on here technically aren't cussing or talking shit, but aimed at a few posters instigating shit. Then the person who was provoked says something, then a bunch of people respond with "Whoa why are you yelling!"

Just because we don't share the miserable view on UW sports like a lot of you, doesn't mean you have to tear us down.
Misery loves company, but damn, there is enough already, leave us "sunshine pumpers" alone.
Click to expand...
Break out the violin and cry me a river.
Click to expand...


:lol: :lol:

Yep, and you're the #1. :thumb:
 
Kansas,
For me the issue is not whether we agree or disagree, but whether or not our disagreements are civil.
Arguments that are well supported are also a plus. But even if you support your argument as you did above, it doesn't mean you are right, or that many of us will agree.
In that case, we agree to disagree and move on. No attacks or name calling required.
If I caused offense, by telling you to pull your head out and formulate a rational discussion I regret the metaphor. Offending you or any poster on here that is not from BYU or CSU is never my intent.
We will agree to disagree on this issue, as on many. I do not find your arguments compelling in the least.
A head coach paid millions of dollars and having 5 years to build a program should have the pieces in place. He should have the athletes he wants and the coaches he wants. He has had the same amount of time with his players that all the other coaches he will face. The product on the field is ALL on him. If the players fail to execute-its on him-they should have been better prepared. If they don't give their best effort in front of the largest crowd in the state against our arch rival-its an indictment of his leadership and/or his relationship with (or choice of) his recruits.
He wons the fruits of his labors these past 5 years. He owns his house in another state and ever else he purchased with his millions-he earned it.He also owns his overall losing record and his losing record in MWC play, he owns his reputation in the state, and with his players. He earned that too.
I am confused as to how anyone can look at he has produced and not see mediocrity at best.. I can't see blaming his players and NOT having that blame reflect directly on him.
Again, if I caused offense, I am sorry. But dont tell me or anyone that disagrees with you that you dont want to hear it anymore son. I dont know who you think you are, but you arent taking away my right to expression anytime soon
I think its important for those of us who dont like the mediocrity that UW athletics has become to speak out.
so I am going to do it.
You are welcome to disagree..and I appreciate it when you are as civil and as you have been in this post.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.

Latest posts

Back
Top