Sawvel's Contract

[laxwyo]

BTW, if Sawvel's contract used the "base compensation" language only in its termination provision (similar to some other MWC head coaching agreements), Wyoming would owe Sawvel $700,000 for firing him after this year and not $2.5 million. If some folks can't see the difference there and the impact on the financial stability of the football program, then I don't know what to tell them.

Man, I thought it was terrible just based on the price for a unproven 1st year coach with no leverage other than (stability) but you've opened it up even further. This contract was a disgrace before and now it's just an abomination. Burman basically fucked us in every situation other than if Sawvel pulls it out of his ass and wins 9 or 10 games and then Burman would probably give him 7 years totally guaranteed.

 

[PorkerPoke]

Man, I thought it was terrible just based on the price for a unproven 1st year coach with no leverage other than (stability) but you've opened it up even further. This contract was a disgrace before and now it's just an abomination. Burman basically fucked us in every situation other than if Sawvel pulls it out of his ass and wins 9 or 10 games and then Burman would probably give him 7 years totally guaranteed.

Think about how Burman might handle it in any of these ways:

As a fervent Cowboy fans many of us so desire the program to be successful. Should the Pokes get to at least 7 wins this season it will be treated as though a tremendous milestone has been met and exceeded. The Burman argument will be an extension is necessary to keep continuity because the program is building momentum and the year to year players seeking a petty NIL compensation won’t have any desire to stick around if they know the head coach is gone in 2 years anyway.

If the program flounders and turns in another sub .500 season but this time at 5-7 on a couple of last second losses - missed 50 yard FG attempt blamed on the kicker and a fumble at the goal line trying to reach the ball across on a 4th down try blamed on the RB even though a FG wins the game. The Burman approach will be it’s not on Sawful because he put the team in the position to win but unfortunately the players weren’t focused enough to make the plays and it’s an NIL problem the fan base has no comprehension about.

Or simply another lackluster season where a couple of 3 win teams steamroll us into a 4-8 finish while we look unprepared to play in several games. The Burman approach will be crickets because we are committed to 5 years and the cost to make a change will set the program back for decades and until the state of Wyoming elevates NIL $$$ nothing better will happen.

 

[OrediggerPoke]

I’m obviously not a lawyer (nor did I stay at a Holiday Inn Express last night) but could it be argued that running a program into the ground and having a losing record every year is “just cause” and worthy of contract termination?

Unfortunately no haha. The contract basically spells out what is ‘cause’ and it’s basically violation of major NCAA rules or University rules or the commission of a crime.

Sherrone Moore (married with kids) was apparently sleeping with the intern, got her a full time job on staff at Michigan and then went to her house and apparently threatened to kill himself in front of her when word got out. That’s a pretty good example of cause.

 

[cowpokeguy]

Think about how Burman might handle it in any of these ways:

As a fervent Cowboy fans many of us so desire the program to be successful. Should the Pokes get to at least 7 wins this season it will be treated as though a tremendous milestone has been met and exceeded. The Burman argument will be an extension is necessary to keep continuity because the program is building momentum and the year to year players seeking a petty NIL compensation won’t have any desire to stick around if they know the head coach is gone in 2 years anyway.

If the program flounders and turns in another sub .500 season but this time at 5-7 on a couple of last second losses - missed 50 yard FG attempt blamed on the kicker and a fumble at the goal line trying to reach the ball across on a 4th down try blamed on the RB even though a FG wins the game. The Burman approach will be it’s not on Sawful because he put the team in the position to win but unfortunately the players weren’t focused enough to make the plays and it’s an NIL problem the fan base has no comprehension about.

Or simply another lackluster season where a couple of 3 win teams steamroll us into a 4-8 finish while we look unprepared to play in several games. The Burman approach will be crickets because we are committed to 5 years and the cost to make a change will set the program back for decades and until the state of Wyoming elevates NIL $$$ nothing better will happen.

It also drives me insane how Burman is completely gaslighting the fan base on what the expectations were for Sawvel when he was hired. When Bohl left, Burman made it clear that the program was "this close" to a championship and the expectation for Sawvel was to get them there soon. This wasn't some sort of program rebuild. And now, here we are talking about how 6-7 wins three years in and things are going fine for Sawvel.

Here's the quote from Burman when asked about expectations for Sawvel: "Win a championship," he said without hesitation. "Do it with the right kind of people and in the right way, but let's go win a championship."

Source: https://7220sports.com/jay-sawvels-marching-orders-at-wyoming-win-a-championship/

 

[TheRealUW]

It also drives me insane how Burman is completely gaslighting the fan base on what the expectations were for Sawvel when he was hired. When Bohl left, Burman made it clear that the program was "this close" to a championship and the expectation for Sawvel was to get them there soon. This wasn't some sort of program rebuild. And now, here we are talking about how 6-7 wins three years in and things are going fine for Sawvel.

Here's the quote from Burman when asked about expectations for Sawvel: "Win a championship," he said without hesitation. "Do it with the right kind of people and in the right way, but let's go win a championship."

Source: https://7220sports.com/jay-sawvels-marching-orders-at-wyoming-win-a-championship/

Totally agree.

That really was what caused me to lose any faith I had remaining in Burman's ability to lead the revenue sports at UW. His words are completely meaningless. The exact OPPOSITE thing to the stated expectations occurred and there were literally zero repercussions for Sawvel. You can't say one thing to the fanbase and then do the exact opposite. He has lost all credibility in my book.

 

[Bear Claw]

Unfortunately no haha. The contract basically spells out what is ‘cause’ and it’s basically violation of major NCAA rules or University rules or the commission of a crime.

I am not arguing your point because I know you are right but it feels almost criminal based on the amount of money paid and the return on investment. I believe the legal term is “Grand Larceny.”

 

[TheRealUW]

I am not arguing your point because I know you are right but it feels almost criminal based on the amount of money paid and the return on investment. I believe the legal term is “Grand Larceny.”

Sawvel deserves plenty of blame for the results on the field the last two years, but Burman and UW really deserve the blame for the egregious contract they signed Sawvel to.

I have no doubt that Sawvel is doing his best. He deserves every penny due to him in the contract he negotiated with Burman and UW. The guy even voluntarily reduced his salary one year so the football program would have more money to spend on NIL deals (see one of the contract addendums).

Either Burman was lazy and copy and pasted Bohl's contract with just changing the numbers or he willfully signed a five year guaranteed contract with a completely unproven coach. Either way...it's completely unacceptable at this level of sports.

 

[bladerunnr]

Let's take a trip down memory lane. Steve McClain is fired and Heath Schroyer inherits the best backcourt in the MWC. In his first year, we are 8th in the conference and lose the play in game to csewe (who went 0-16 in the conference. Next year, we go 7-9 in the conference and Heath gets an extension. Heath goes 4-21 in the conference the next 2 years and Burman still has a job. At most schools, that kind of incompetence would get you kicked out of town or tarred and feathered. Not at UW. It appears TB can f up as much as a humanly possible and still have a job.

 

[PorkerPoke]

Talking memory lane Heath Schroyer and Burman hires takes me to the return of Shyatt.

What bothered me most was upon Shyatt bailing on the program in 2016 for the NBA was the immediate contract with Edwards where Shyatt jr was the only original staff to be retained on contract. Burman claims he only considered the three assistant coaches under Larry - Scott Duncan, Allen Edwards and the boy wonder Jeremy.

Jeremy is purported to have convinced daddy to bring Edwards in to be an assistant. Did he play a part in telling daddy to make sure that Edwards became the HC while being groomed to be the next HC? What really was the deal with Burman not looking outside the box for the basketball program in 2016 and the football deal in 2023? Is the Bohl to Sawvel with Bohl Jr the DC deal reminiscent of the Shyatt to Edwards with Shyatt jr the top assistant deal?

Was that another Burman kiss ass deal taking whomever it was the former boss said should be put in place? Especially on the guidance of Jeremy? A little indirect nepotism deal?

Whatever the case in that deal the basketball program took a major hit and became once again as pathetic as the Schroyer years.

Burman gets extensions and raises with the major basketball f ups along with the latest football disappointment.

 

[OrediggerPoke]

I am not arguing your point because I know you are right but it feels almost criminal based on the amount of money paid and the return on investment. I believe the legal term is “Grand Larceny.”

You’re speaking to the choir. As a person that drafts and reviews a lot of contracts, I find it almost unconscionable what was offered given the relative positions of the parties. But I see nothing in the for cause provisions of the contract that leads me to believe there is any argument that poor performance could justify a for cause termination as the contract was written.

Given Sawvel’s relative leverage and lack of demand elsewhere, I just don’t understand why anyone thought a fully guaranteed contract made any sense at all (I do see why it might have made sense when Craig Bohl renegotiated his contract). For Sawvel, I would have suggested drafting a structured/tiered termination clause that might have even taken into account winning percentage as a component of determining the buyout percentage. But Sawvel’s contract contains nothing of the sort.

And when someone says ‘oh those were just standard provisions.’ I would respond that the only thing standard about employment contracts is that they are anything but standard.

 

[Douglaspoke]

Sawvel deserves plenty of blame for the results on the field the last two years, but Burman and UW really deserve the blame for the egregious contract they signed Sawvel to.

I have no doubt that Sawvel is doing his best. He deserves every penny due to him in the contract he negotiated with Burman and UW. The guy even voluntarily reduced his salary one year so the football program would have more money to spend on NIL deals (see one of the contract addendums).

Either Burman was lazy and copy and pasted Bohl's contract with just changing the numbers or he willfully signed a five year guaranteed contract with a completely unproven coach. Either way...it's completely unacceptable at this level of sports.

"The guy even voluntarily reduced his salary one year so the football program would have more money to spend on NIL deals (see one of the contract addendums)."

Money that Sawful would never had ever, never eve,r had seen in his life but for the crazy contract that he received.

 

[TheRealUW]

"The guy even voluntarily reduced his salary one year so the football program would have more money to spend on NIL deals (see one of the contract addendums)."

Money that Sawful would never had ever, never eve,r had seen in his life but for the crazy contract that he received.

It's still a respectable action from Sawvel. I sure as hell wouldn't voluntarily offer to let my boss keep money that was legally due to me based on a pre-agreed upon contract that we both signed.

The contract sucks...there is no denying that. It was for too long and should have never included guaranteed compensation as part of the buyout. But that is 100% the fault of Burman and UW. I wouldn't have expected Sawvel to say, "You know, I think you guys are offering me more guaranteed money than I deserve based on me being an unproven first time head coach with no outside interest in my services. Let's reduce the buyout provisions in my contract before I sign".

 

[OrediggerPoke]

It's still a respectable action from Sawvel. I sure as hell wouldn't voluntarily offer to let my boss keep money that was legally due to me based on a pre-agreed upon contract that we both signed.

The contract sucks...there is no denying that. It was for too long and should have never included guaranteed compensation as part of the buyout. But that is 100% the fault of Burman and UW. I wouldn't have expected Sawvel to say, "You know, I think you guys are offering me more guaranteed money than I deserve based on me being an unproven first time head coach with no outside interest in my services. Let's reduce the buyout provisions in my contract before I sign".

Agree 100%. If someone offers me a contract that is undeservedly favorable to me, I sure as hell am not turning it down. It is a nice gesture of him to turn over a small amount of that money over when you really don't have to.

I've said it on here several times before - Sawvel seems like a nice enough guy that one would enjoy having beers with. He also seems to really care about the players and hopes to win games. The problem is (from what we have consistently seen going all the way to his Arizona State debut to the welcome home Josh Allen debacle against lowly Nevada), he doesn't appear to have any of the necessary skills or ability to be successful as a head coach of an FBS team.

Regardless, I don't see any scenario where Sawvel is not Wyoming's head coach next year. I don't see large donors stepping up to fix Burman's mess (apathy has set in). There is no viable option to pay Sawvel and pay the money to bring in a new staff absent such donors. What a mess we are in due to this shockingly poorly thought out negotiated contract that Burman stuck the University with.

 

[307bball]

Agree 100%. If someone offers me a contract that is undeservedly favorable to me, I sure as hell am not turning it down. It is a nice gesture of him to turn over a small amount of that money over when you really don't have to.

I've said it on here several times before - Sawvel seems like a nice enough guy that one would enjoy having beers with. He also seems to really care about the players and hopes to win games. The problem is (from what we have consistently seen going all the way to his Arizona State debut to the welcome home Josh Allen debacle against lowly Nevada), he doesn't appear to have any of the necessary skills or ability to be successful as a head coach of an FBS team.

Regardless, I don't see any scenario where Sawvel is not Wyoming's head coach next year. I don't see large donors stepping up to fix Burman's mess (apathy has set in). There is no viable option to pay Sawvel and pay the money to bring in a new staff absent such donors. What a mess we are in due to this shockingly poorly thought out negotiated contract that Burman stuck the University with.

Would you say flexibility at the head coaching position, from the administrations point of view, seems to be a major flaw in the situation surrounding Wyoming Football right now? Your last paragraph seems to imply that, if the contract were different and everything else was the same, Wyoming could dump him economically and try to get a "good" hire.

If they had hired Sawvel with a different contract...our win/loss would be no different....and I would assume that if we removed any contractual friction, he most likely still gets the second year. This means that this year is where we are seeing the results of the bad contract, if that contract is the only reason he remains as the head coach. I suppose it's possible that Burman truly believes he's good and will turn it around but that seems very unlikely.

 

[OrediggerPoke]

Would you say flexibility at the head coaching position, from the administrations point of view, seems to be a major flaw in the situation surrounding Wyoming Football right now? Your last paragraph seems to imply that, if the contract were different and everything else was the same, Wyoming could dump him economically and try to get a "good" hire.

If they had hired Sawvel with a different contract...our win/loss would be no different....and I would assume that if we removed any contractual friction, he most likely still gets the second year. This means that this year is where we are seeing the results of the bad contract, if that contract is the only reason he remains as the head coach. I suppose it's possible that Burman truly believes he's good and will turn it around but that seems very unlikely.

Sawvel’s contract termination provision is the reason he is the head coach of Wyoming football this year (buyout was 3.6 million at end of last year) and is the reason he will be the coach after this year (buyout is $2.5 million at the end of this year).

Without that provision, Wyoming would have moved on already.

 

[307bball]

Sawvel’s contract termination provision is the reason he is the head coach of Wyoming football this year (buyout was 3.6 million at end of last year) and is the reason he will be the coach after this year (buyout is $2.5 million at the end of this year).

Without that provision, Wyoming would have moved on already.

That seems to be the conventional wisdom. I'm not a contract expert obviously.....I did some ChatGPT'ing and AI views it as "moderately coach-freindly" when viewed in the context of G5 college football. You take a much harsher view of the contract than my limited LLM conversations, and I'm sympathetic to your viewpoint given how bad of a coach he has turned out to be.

Even give all that...i'm still ripped that we hired a bad coach much more than I blame Burman for having a bad contract. If Burman's sin was that he offers bad contracts to good coaches...i don't think many of us are clamoring for his head. Theoretically, as you and others have pointed out, Burman should be heavily advised on what is typically given for head coaches by some sort of market experts....either those experts don't exist, or Burman doesn't listen to them, or this was a rubber stamp sort of process. In any of those cases, If Burman were a good "coach whisperer", Wyoming would be in a much better postion. That quality, more than anything else is what good AD's are able to pull off. We have to have better coaches, and I have no confidence that becoming the worlds best athletic department at negotiating termination clauses actually gets us much. At the margin, we get another shot at a good coach in a year like the current one....but who has confidence we actually get that good coach?

I just don't get that exercised over this stuff...maybe if I understood it better it would stick in my craw more.....but the more I learn about it, the more I just think all these problems are upstream of termination clauses.

 

[LawPoke]

That seems to be the conventional wisdom. I'm not a contract expert obviously.....I did some ChatGPT'ing and AI views it as "moderately coach-freindly" when viewed in the context of G5 college football. You take a much harsher view of the contract than my limited LLM conversations, and I'm sympathetic to your viewpoint given how bad of a coach he has turned out to be.

Even give all that...i'm still ripped that we hired a bad coach much more than I blame Burman for having a bad contract. If Burman's sin was that he offers bad contracts to good coaches...i don't think many of us are clamoring for his head. Theoretically, as you and others have pointed out, Burman should be heavily advised on what is typically given for head coaches by some sort of market experts....either those experts don't exist, or Burman doesn't listen to them, or this was a rubber stamp sort of process. In any of those cases, If Burman were a good "coach whisperer", Wyoming would be in a much better postion. That quality, more than anything else is what good AD's are able to pull off. We have to have better coaches, and I have no confidence that becoming the worlds best athletic department at negotiating termination clauses actually gets us much. At the margin, we get another shot at a good coach in a year like the current one....but who has confidence we actually get that good coach?

I just don't get that exercised over this stuff...maybe if I understood it better it would stick in my craw more.....but the more I learn about it, the more I just think all these problems are upstream of termination clauses.

Sawful needs to go. No doubt. But the reality is that the decades of tolerating mediocrity are the real cancer. We have been so mid for so long that apathy has taken hold - and at the worst possible time. Now is when we need an excited fan base that is ready to open their pocket book to invest in NIL. I hate NIL. I know most here do. But money is the literal coin of the realm to truly compete. And we have none and no momentum to get any. From CJC to the Foundation to the AD, we have gone to the same wells for so long that they are tapped dry - all for half-a$$ed renovations to the AA and pools that leak. There are no "next generation" givers like the McMurrys and Rochelles - mainly because UW has spent no time, energy or attention to culture them. And if we could find them, who in their right mind would invest in a clown show that can't even figure out how to design a pool and associated infrastructure so we can drain it into the city's sewer system? (I know, the City sucks too - yet another reason to punt on an investment). Why invest in buying out Sawful when Burman has shown little to no ability to hire a decent replacement?

In reality, Sawful and Burman are perfect reflections of where we are as a state, university and athletic department. Mired in crap and no interest in reversing our plight and no real plan to do so.

 

[Douglaspoke]

"Sawvel seems like a nice enough guy that one would enjoy having beers with."

Agree 100%

 

[PorkerPoke]

From CJC to the Foundation to the AD, we have gone to the same wells for so long that they are tapped dry

There are no "next generation" givers like the McMurrys and Rochelles - mainly because UW has spent no time, energy or attention to culture them. And if we could find them, who in their right mind would invest in a clown show

From these 2 points I have noticed that I no longer see some names listed as donors on the CJC list that I recall seeing for years prior.

Was there any rift within the last few years between the powers to be in UW athletics and various members of the CJC?

I only ask because if some bigger donors are still around but no longer participating in CJC it could carry over to the deeper pockets.

 

[cowpokeguy]

From these 2 points I have noticed that I no longer see some names listed as donors on the CJC list that I recall seeing for years prior.

Was there any rift within the last few years between the powers to be in UW athletics and various members of the CJC?

I only ask because if some bigger donors are still around but no longer participating in CJC it could carry over to the deeper pockets.

What is CJC's role in the era of NIL? Isn't the game now to get direct funding to pay the players, or is that facilitated through CJC?