That place still sucks, sitting up in the rafters, fans are still asses, then that 2nd half collapse..ugh. For the 5th straight game the lack of 2nd half offense comes back to bite us again, getting really old!!! 1st half looked fairly ok, but lack of inside game in 2nd half against a small CSU team, just don't understand!!!! Sorry very frustrating as this isn't the Pokes team I saw earlier in season. It's nice to be able to talk about some kind of a post season, but really?? 2nd half collapses really no excuse, i know our starters have played tons of minutes, but YOU CAN'T WIN IF YOU CAN'T SCORE THE BASKETBALL. doesn't get any easier from here...I'll go the final 2 but sure hope to see some improvement and MWC tourney anything can and may happen!!! Cmon Pokes lets get this ship righted!!!
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bladerunnr
Well-known member
Washington had another poor game. I thought he was trying to break the backboard from 3 feet. Dumb fouls and he set really poor screens. Waddell is back to his old ways. He catches the ball in post, stands there and thinks about it, and then the double team comes and he has no idea what to do.
We have to work so hard for everything. You can just see it coming. We don't try and fastbreak off a missed shot, and we work the shot clock down to nothing on every possession. Other teams just come down and take open shots, regardless of where the shot clock is. We are an incredibly boring team to watch. That's 3 straight games with less than 20 points in the second half. That's junior high stuff.
I have no right to expect very much from this team. I knew it would take some time, and it will. I'm just puzzled by Washington. He looked so good earlier in the season. He had some shot opportunites and just threw the ball back outside. I can't believe that's what the coaches wanted. His rebounding was not up to his usual - no offensive boards. We can't win with him playing subpar.
We have to work so hard for everything. You can just see it coming. We don't try and fastbreak off a missed shot, and we work the shot clock down to nothing on every possession. Other teams just come down and take open shots, regardless of where the shot clock is. We are an incredibly boring team to watch. That's 3 straight games with less than 20 points in the second half. That's junior high stuff.
I have no right to expect very much from this team. I knew it would take some time, and it will. I'm just puzzled by Washington. He looked so good earlier in the season. He had some shot opportunites and just threw the ball back outside. I can't believe that's what the coaches wanted. His rebounding was not up to his usual - no offensive boards. We can't win with him playing subpar.
laxwyo
Well-known member
I don't think that CSU did much to get back in the game. Got some FT's. UW wasn't scoring either and we were up by 7. CSU couldn't buy a bucket either but knocked down like 4 straight free throws. In that same stretch, Washington missed both of his. Then they hit two big shots. the 3 from the big man and the one dude who Luster didn't let score the whole game again.
bladerunnr
Well-known member
laxwyo said:
That's right. After a Martinez 3, we had the ball and a 7 pt. lead. I thought we had a chance to almost put the game out of reach if we could have got up by 9 or 10. Their big guy, Smith, outplayed Washington. Luster did a good job on Eikmer again. I think Eikmeir scored 30 against Boise St.
In general, I agree Lax. They didn't do anything special. We just stunk it up for about 8 minutes of the second half.
kansasCowboy
Well-known member
That's not completely true. He is good if his shot are uncontested, or he is WAY wide open. Put it simple, he actually shoots like a frosh. I really don't think that he coming in at the end would be a gain at this points.Adv8RU12 said:
Now, maybe let him and Gilmore play for at least 10 or 12 minutes early in the second half and allow Cruz, Luster and Martinez to alternate rests, and then put all three starters back in at the last five minutes. That would be more logical. I really think we need to try more post play before we start going for mid range jumpers though.
laxwyo
Well-known member
Ok. so we probably aren't NCAA bound at this point. Maybe you need to get some guys some real game time experience. Time to throw in Marshall, Shakir and company. Our guys need some rest. It's a win win. Maybe we don't win the games, but hell we are losing the ones we should be winning right now. How is next year going to be any different? They just lost a year of eligibility for nothing. Hell maybe one of them is like Allen Iverson "you're talking about practice" and shows up and steps up during a game. my :twocents:
kansasCowboy
Well-known member
laxwyo said:
The only one we were supposed to win was AF. The other two were supposed to be losses.
kansasCowboy
Well-known member
So we lose to UNM at home in the first half of the conf season, beat AF and beat CSU in Laramie.laxwyo said:
And we're 4th in the league at the time. And you're telling me, that the team we have, we're supposed to win in the PIT and win in MOBY against two quality opponents. The only bad loss was AF, and honestly, i think their intern coachreally has them turning around, and it showed against SDS as well.
bladerunnr
Well-known member
kansasCowboy said:
I guess it depends on where you think this team should be. I knew that we would be far more competitve with Shyatt. We couldn't be any worse, having lost the play in game more than once under Schroyer. I don't agree about csewe. They have lost every conference road game, and most of them by a lot. I'm not saying it's a bad loss, but it was very winnable game. I feel good about the direction we are heading but let's not kid ourselves: our ooc schedule was a joke. The CU win was the only win against a top 100 team. In fact, without checking, it might be our only win against a top 200 team. Shyatt inherited a far worse situation this time than back in 1997. Joby Wright had really hurt the program but Schroyer destroyed it. It will be interesting to see how recruiting goes.
laxwyo
Well-known member
none of them are suppose to be loses. we can beat anyone in this league. they days of sucking cellar shit are over. Anyone you beat at home, you should be able to beat on the road. it's a ball and there is a hoop. put it in there.
I'm happy that I'm not chalking up losses kansascowboy, but if it helps you sleep at night.....I'm just excited that the hoops team has progressed enough that we are actually talking about "shoulda/coulda won".
My main point right now about getting guys playing time is that we need our starters to be fresh and our new guys some real damn experience. We are not going to be a #1 or #2 seed. If we were a bit deeper I wouldn't care but our starters are beat and we need them fresher for the tourney. Win 3 in a row and we are in the dance.
I'm happy that I'm not chalking up losses kansascowboy, but if it helps you sleep at night.....I'm just excited that the hoops team has progressed enough that we are actually talking about "shoulda/coulda won".
My main point right now about getting guys playing time is that we need our starters to be fresh and our new guys some real damn experience. We are not going to be a #1 or #2 seed. If we were a bit deeper I wouldn't care but our starters are beat and we need them fresher for the tourney. Win 3 in a row and we are in the dance.
bladerunnr
Well-known member
We only have 4 games left before the tournament. Shyatt sees the players every day in practice. If any of them could play, don't you think he would have them in there? We saw Grabau briefly. He's not ready. Hell, Boeudo has contributed basically nothing. If the guys on the end of the bench can't beat out Grabau and Watsabaugh, I really have to wonder what they have to offer. Sad to say, we will only go as far as our starters will take us.
kansasCowboy
Well-known member
bladerunnr said:
Exactly. blade! I agree. That is what I'm trying to say LAX. Wyoming is overachieving right now. No one expected Wyo to win 18 games this year. Especially when we lost our star players from back to back 10-21 seasons. So, common logic here, If we lose our two stars from a terrible team and halve no bench other that mostly frosh and some nobody seniors, what do you expect for this season? Did anybody really expect 18 wins this season? Did any of you? I know I didn't. I thought maybe for sure14 wins. If our cards fell right maybe 19-11, and it looks like we might actually hit that with four games left. But, honestly, I was hoping for no more than 14. Shyatt Happens indeed! And we are sitting at 18-8 right now.
The sad thing, Shyatt came into this and it got worse. He had talent when he was hired, and then they transferred. So, now we have who we have. Some good to great starters and NO bench. And it is exactly what blade has just said. We have the talent to win, but when it doesn't have backup, it fails.
Our starters are good enough to make us a top three team in the league, but when they tire out, we are where we are today.
Now, with that being said, I have to ask this. Can anyone see a situation similar to DC and football with this basketball team? Overachieve the first year and have success and then the schedule and lack of depth and senior play gives us a bad second season, and then Shyatt's recruits come together to give us a good third season?
bladerunnr
Well-known member
Kansas Cowboy,
I hope you're wrong. I think BB can be turned around much faster than football. Remember, Shyatt recruited Josh Davis. He made an immediate impact as a freshman. Then McClain brought in Donte Richardson from Sheridan CC, I think. It can happen very quickly. We have our 2 best players coming back next year, Washington and Martinez. Let's see what can be brought in around them. Also, will Nance develop? If so, that's one more piece to the puzzle. It will be fun to watch.
I hope you're wrong. I think BB can be turned around much faster than football. Remember, Shyatt recruited Josh Davis. He made an immediate impact as a freshman. Then McClain brought in Donte Richardson from Sheridan CC, I think. It can happen very quickly. We have our 2 best players coming back next year, Washington and Martinez. Let's see what can be brought in around them. Also, will Nance develop? If so, that's one more piece to the puzzle. It will be fun to watch.
Folks, the approach that Coach Shyatt is taking with this team leaves a very small margin for errors. I also know that, during his prior tenure on campus, Coach Shyatt expressed his strong conviction that basketball needs to be played both mentally and physically. He really does not like foolish mistakes. We talk about games that are played possession by possession but, in reality, the games are played pass by pass. The suspense is in whether a possession, by either team, is even going to result in a quality shot on goal.
As the number of possessions increase, it becomes easier to make up for a bad possession here and there. We are also talking about freshmen. In every sport, freshmen are more inclined to make foolish mistakes and are more susceptible to getting overpowered by older, more mature players. On this team, in this league, this year, it seems especially unlikely that freshmen who arrived with the expectation that they would produce later are going to be called upon as a plan be with the starters are struggling. The need to mature both physically and mentally.
I have the utmost respect for Coach Shyatt and his approach to the game. I trust that he is doing exactly what he said he would do and that is that he is doing everything that he can to make this a magical and memorable season for the large senior class that was on campus when he arrived. Part of that is that he has asked this team to play a game that is based on playing smart ball based on maturity and experience. I fully expect the players who are riding the pine this year to be quality reserves coming off the bench that do not frequently make foolish mistakes in a year or two. Right now, I expect that he is using the players who make the fewest unforced errors in practice. Knowing how he teaches students who are going to go out and coach at Wyoming's high schools and junior highs, I would expect him to do nothing else.
Even in the future as the pace of play picks up, I do not expect this staff to tolerate players playing so fast that they make unforced errors. They will play intense defense and will transition into an offense only at the speed that they can handle mentally.
I am just thankful that we now have a program that we can be proud of, that we have a coach that we can confident will get the most out of the players that they can produce, and a team that we watch play each game with a reasonable hope that Wyoming will win. We are relevant again. I know Coach Shyatt will keep us relevant for as long as he is in Laramie because he is that kind of coach. He has proven it with two different teams during two stops in town. Even Coach Brandenburg did not take us dancing every year he was in Laramie. I just hope we can all enjoy it instead of continually looking for greener grass across some fence in some other pasture.
Go Pokes. Send the Aztecs back to the Big West knowing that we still have their number after all these years.
As the number of possessions increase, it becomes easier to make up for a bad possession here and there. We are also talking about freshmen. In every sport, freshmen are more inclined to make foolish mistakes and are more susceptible to getting overpowered by older, more mature players. On this team, in this league, this year, it seems especially unlikely that freshmen who arrived with the expectation that they would produce later are going to be called upon as a plan be with the starters are struggling. The need to mature both physically and mentally.
I have the utmost respect for Coach Shyatt and his approach to the game. I trust that he is doing exactly what he said he would do and that is that he is doing everything that he can to make this a magical and memorable season for the large senior class that was on campus when he arrived. Part of that is that he has asked this team to play a game that is based on playing smart ball based on maturity and experience. I fully expect the players who are riding the pine this year to be quality reserves coming off the bench that do not frequently make foolish mistakes in a year or two. Right now, I expect that he is using the players who make the fewest unforced errors in practice. Knowing how he teaches students who are going to go out and coach at Wyoming's high schools and junior highs, I would expect him to do nothing else.
Even in the future as the pace of play picks up, I do not expect this staff to tolerate players playing so fast that they make unforced errors. They will play intense defense and will transition into an offense only at the speed that they can handle mentally.
I am just thankful that we now have a program that we can be proud of, that we have a coach that we can confident will get the most out of the players that they can produce, and a team that we watch play each game with a reasonable hope that Wyoming will win. We are relevant again. I know Coach Shyatt will keep us relevant for as long as he is in Laramie because he is that kind of coach. He has proven it with two different teams during two stops in town. Even Coach Brandenburg did not take us dancing every year he was in Laramie. I just hope we can all enjoy it instead of continually looking for greener grass across some fence in some other pasture.
Go Pokes. Send the Aztecs back to the Big West knowing that we still have their number after all these years.
kansasCowboy said:
Yes, we will go just exactly as our starters can take us. Plus, we are getting more quality minutes out of Nance. At the end of the day, we just need to not lose games while the starters are getting a rest for their legs and lungs--especially during the tournament.
Please do not suggest that Coach Shyatt ran off the players that left. Based on the news reports during the time it seemed that they refused to even talk to him. For crying out loud, he Jochim Noah was in his corner but that did not even get the attention of the guys that left.
Sadly, I do think that next year will be tough. We lose six players, three of whom start and two of whom play ahead of all but one freshman off the bench. I do not see any replacement in the pipeline to replace Waddell's size with experience. On the other hand, I do expect that Coach Shyatt and his staff will figure out a way to keep whatever players are in the program next year competitive in each game. I also expect everyone we have to be better next year than they are now. That is what real coaching is about. There are certainly pieces coming back to work with. I just like knowing that everyone on the team next year will be better in February 2013 than they are right now. That has not always been the case in Laramie.
kansasCowboy
Well-known member
don't get me wrong Wyoexpat, I used a wrong choice of words, I wasn't trying to say that Shyatt ran the players off, but rather that no matter who was coming in as coach we were having our top players leaving. It got worse once he arrived. Our depth dwindled. Our talent dwindled. That is what I was saying. I agree, I think Shyatt has us on the right track. I just think we are going to lose more talent by next year, and I don't know that what we have coming back can even equal what we have now. I know Shyatt will coach them all up, but we are going to be really young next year.
kansasCowboy said:
Yup--all the way around. Thankfully we have a shot the rest of the way if a few more shots fall. It would help if we concentrated more on getting the ball into the low block where the glass can be our friend when the opponent gets within a possession.
Our big problem is that we go cold (due to exhausted legs) and opponents can sag back into the paint on defense while they are catching up. Then at make-or-break time, we rely on threes to end runs.
Has anyone noticed that SDSU is having trouble with tired lungs and legs down the stretch too?
