P12 - MWC

[evilpoke]

The being left behind like the only kid in gym class not chosen to play kickball with the teachers even snickering about it is the hardest part to take.

We were even relegated to 2nd tier status as a recipient of any poaching/exit penalties collected. By giving up millions to UNLV and AFA to keep a conference together we still can claim we are at least ahead of the MAC and CUSA with the Sun Belt hot on our heals.

Next up is the settlement from the mediation. I have my concerns that the pee12 will be proclaiming a victory and the $$ collected will be on the disappointing side. The how far we have fallen would be that the penalty $$ paid is closer to the minimum $61 million than greater than the target of $100 million.

The clock is ticking on the stay and we should find out within 2 weeks.

I don't understand the pessimism over mediation.

The MW has the PAC over the coals with signed agreements with stated fees and penalties.

It's not damages - it's stated fees signed by all parties.

I keep seeing the argument that it is 2 penalties for one action.

No. It's one deal with the PAC2 and a very separate deal the the nPac5. It just so happens that one action triggered both deals. (If AFA left for AAC, they would be paying the same exit fees as the nPac5 - where you go to doesn't matter - just that you left ).

Now - I'm not a lawyer - so if someone wants to correct me on that, please do!

I'm sticking with $100M.

 

[cowpoke pride]

The being left behind like the only kid in gym class not chosen to play kickball with the teachers even snickering about it is the hardest part to take.

We were even relegated to 2nd tier status as a recipient of any poaching/exit penalties collected. By giving up millions to UNLV and AFA to keep a conference together we still can claim we are at least ahead of the MAC and CUSA with the Sun Belt hot on our heals.

Next up is the settlement from the mediation. I have my concerns that the pee12 will be proclaiming a victory and the $$ collected will be on the disappointing side. The how far we have fallen would be that the penalty $$ paid is closer to the minimum $61 million than greater than the target of $100 million.

The clock is ticking on the stay and we should find out within 2 weeks.

I'm not sure about the Sun Belt being on our heels. We are going to need to prove it in '26 and '27.

 

[Midwest Cowboy]

I don't understand the pessimism over mediation.

The MW has the PAC over the coals with signed agreements with stated fees and penalties.

It's not damages - it's stated fees signed by all parties.

I keep seeing the argument that it is 2 penalties for one action.

No. It's one deal with the PAC2 and a very separate deal the the nPac5. It just so happens that one action triggered both deals. (If AFA left for AAC, they would be paying the same exit fees as the nPac5 - where you go to doesn't matter - just that you left ).

Now - I'm not a lawyer - so if someone wants to correct me on that, please do!

I'm sticking with $100M.

A lot of us are pessimistic because many things have "broken" in favor of the PAC. It is kind of hard to think we might have a victory. I suspect we will hear Gloria Nevarez making an announcement that an agreement was reached that was "the fairest possible outcome...FOR BOTH SIDES." Forget about that, I want an absolute, scorched earth victory for the MWC and I want the members to suffer.

As for the gym class kid chosen last. I hear ya'. But there is another analogy here regarding Texas State. You really weren't wanted, you will never be well received, you only became necessary to form a conference. You prostituted yourself but aren't you proud. Memphis, Tulane, Air Force, UNLV, etc. were all ahead of you and they will never let you forget it.

 

[evilpoke]

A lot of us are pessimistic because many things have "broken" in favor of the PAC. It is kind of hard to think we might have a victory. I suspect we will hear Gloria Nevarez making an announcement that an agreement was reached that was "the fairest possible outcome...FOR BOTH SIDES." Forget about that, I want an absolute, scorched earth victory for the MWC and I want the members to suffer.

As for the gym class kid chosen last. I hear ya'. But there is another analogy here regarding Texas State. You really weren't wanted, you will never be well received, you only became necessary to form a conference. You prostituted yourself but aren't you proud. Memphis, Tulane, Air Force, UNLV, etc. were all ahead of you and they will never let you forget it.

What has broken for the PAC?

Short of getting Boise, CSU, SDSU and Fresno, everything has failed.

No AAC schools

No UNLV

No huge media deal (people were/are throwing out $15M per year)

They didn't merge despite EVERYONE saying they should have.

They sued the MW, which I totally understand and was the right move, but looks terrible

They got Gonzaga. Good job. But at a full media share and teams get to keep 50% of their NCAA Tournament shares? People complain about the Boise deal? That's a sweeeeeet deal.

They settled on Texas State.

***

The only thing that hasn't worked out for the MW yet is not getting Texas State.

Now, this could change really quick depending on how the media deal and mediation goes.

I think Wyoming ends up with around $5M in media, and would be pissed with anything less than $100M. I think Glo will deliver.

I am not happy with a lot of things, but I am glad Glo is our commissioner through this process.

 

[rocket city poke]

A lot of us are pessimistic because many things have "broken" in favor of the PAC. It is kind of hard to think we might have a victory. I suspect we will hear Gloria Nevarez making an announcement that an agreement was reached that was "the fairest possible outcome...FOR BOTH SIDES." Forget about that, I want an absolute, scorched earth victory for the MWC and I want the members to suffer.

As for the gym class kid chosen last. I hear ya'. But there is another analogy here regarding Texas State. You really weren't wanted, you will never be well received, you only became necessary to form a conference. You prostituted yourself but aren't you proud. Memphis, Tulane, Air Force, UNLV, etc. were all ahead of you and they will never let you forget it.

While i agree with some of your commentary on Texas State, i kind of see it the other way. They could really benefit by being in the right place at the right time. Their large enrollment and Texas location just drove them up like two conference levels. If UNLV or AFA would have had just a $5 million exit penalty and were not going to receive the larger portion of the penalty fees they would have bolted as well. Texas State's position with regard to these exit fees, location and enrollment just created a huge opportunity that no other program had. Whether they can take advantage of that once they start playing in the new Pac12 remains to be seen . . .

 

[PorkerPoke]

exit fees, location and enrollment

All of the above was a detriment to Wyoming being invited to join with the traitors or applying.

 

[ragtimejoe1]

MWC is going to need the buyout money to pay the lawsuit they're about to lose in the Joser transgender suit. Hiring the same lawfirm to investigate the alleged misconduct by the player AND defend the title ix situation. Unbelievable, Gloria.

 

[OrediggerPoke]

FWIW...

Spending $100 million-ish on a new pool and upgraded West stands, likely was a poor decision, in this day and age of NIL and the transfer portal. Invest in winning (players) - men's hoops and football, and the donations will come for the fixes. Just my dime on things, for those that see it the way I do.

I’d rather have a pool than a fund to pay 18-22 year old kids to drive really nice trucks. Both are a waste.

 

[307bball]

I’d rather have a pool than a fund to pay 18-22 year old kids to drive really nice trucks. Both are a waste.

When you get right down to it...it's hard to defend the money that goes into sports...couple questions for you:

How about paying 18-22 year old kids to win championships? Do you have the same problem with funding coaches real estate choices and retirements far beyond what any normal person can attain? Do you have a problem with them having a lot of dough?

This objection that centers on what they do with the money doesn't seem rational. If we want to win...we have to pay. If we pay...the coaches and now the players will have a lot of $$ in their pockets. It seems like this particular line of thinking is better as a defense of amateurism.

Also, what they buy/do with the money is sort of their business.

 

[OrediggerPoke]

When you get right down to it...it's hard to defend the money that goes into sports...couple questions for you:

How about paying 18-22 year old kids to win championships? Do you have the same problem with funding coaches real estate choices and retirements far beyond what any normal person can attain? Do you have a problem with them having a lot of dough?

This objection that centers on what they do with the money doesn't seem rational. If we want to win...we have to pay. If we pay...the coaches and now the players will have a lot of $$ in their pockets. It seems like this particular line of thinking is better as a defense of amateurism.

Also, what they buy/do with the money is sort of their business.

It’s pretty simple - Wyoming cannot turn a profit if it includes paying players. Accordingly, paying players cannot realistically happen at Wyoming without public funds or student fees being used to pay them. Under no circumstance do I believe it remotely appropriate for public funds or student fees to be used to pay athletes. Therefore, I am in favor Wyoming following a semi-amateur model of athletes receiving scholarships with reasonable food/living stipends but nothing else. Having a better football or basketball record is irrelevant to the question in my opinion because it is just plain wrong and government spending abuse to use public funds and student fees in such a way to pay players.

Think of it this way and if you are in college how would it make you feel knowing that you are partially paying the salary of the student next to you in class. Would you be happy that you are paying fees to pay the student next to you? It’s bullshit and I’d be pissed as a student.

Do I also believe coaching salaries are a bit inflated? Yes. But the coaching salary can be covered by revenues and typically is at Wyoming and there is clearly a defined market on coaching salaries. If we really want to dig into waste, look at what the University President is doing and his salary. Look at the salary of the AD and ask what is the market for a replaceable AD that could deliver like results.

 

[307bball]

It’s pretty simple - Wyoming cannot turn a profit if it includes paying players. Accordingly, paying players cannot realistically happen at Wyoming without public funds or student fees being used to pay them. Under no circumstance do I believe it remotely appropriate for public funds or student fees to be used to pay athletes. Therefore, I am in favor Wyoming following a semi-amateur model of athletes receiving scholarships with reasonable food/living stipends but nothing else. Having a better football or basketball record is irrelevant to the question in my opinion because it is just plain wrong and government spending abuse to use public funds and student fees in such a way to pay players.

Think of it this way and if you are in college how would it make you feel knowing that you are partially paying the salary of the student next to you in class. Would you be happy that you are paying fees to pay the student next to you? It’s bullshit and I’d be pissed as a student.

Do I also believe coaching salaries are a bit inflated? Yes. But the coaching salary can be covered by revenues and typically is at Wyoming and there is clearly a defined market on coaching salaries. If we really want to dig into waste, look at what the University President is doing and his salary. Look at the salary of the AD and ask what is the market for a replaceable AD that could deliver like results.

I largely agree with your point about using public money in this fashion. I think I would stop short of calling it "wrong" though. If taxpayers want to spend money on something...that is their prerogative. also...the market for players is new but it will be just as defined as the coaching salary market pretty quickly.

This whole saga has ripped the curtain back on just how impossible it is/has been to succeed at UW. We are seeing the level that, absent some really good results, UW will settle to...it's not a level that any of us old-heads are excited to be at. It's rough.