Football vs. Basketball Dialogue

[fromolwyoming]

No way of knowing what will happen for sure, but with this whole concussion thing in football, youth participation numbers are starting to decrease....fairly rapidly. Could the sport's popularity start fading?

If we emphasized basketball now and beat the football apocalypse, we'd be ahead of the game!

I wonder about this as well - but the technology sector will solve the concussion problem. Hell, just recently, some grad student puke from bWHYu developed an impact sensor for helmets. That is step one. Read it here:

http://www.deseretnews.com/article/...ootball-players-from-brain-damage.html?pg=all

The concussion problem can't be solved directly by technology. It's the impact of the brain against the skull, not the impact of the skull against other things that causes the injury. A person can be concussed without even hitting their head. It's a deceleration MOI.

Rugby also doesn't 300lbs+ linemen coming after you.
Exactly, technology can help in the fields of diagnosing and recovery evaluation from concussion, but they can only do so much in the area of prevention. Best example is that 10 years ago, everyone thought that mouthpiece use would drastically reduce the incidence of concussion. Now, most evidence suggests that the use of a mouthpiece is fairly irrelevant to the incidence rates of concussions. Sure some technological advances in helmet technology could help reduce a certain percentage of concussions, but it can only go so far. IMO, the best way to reduce concussions is to completely remove helmets and pads from the game, rugby has fewer concussions than football because players know they can't go head-to-head with each other.

Anyway, I agree with Back Harlow, with everything going on with concussions, football will be a less popular game in 20 years.

 

[WestWYOPoke]

Rugby also doesn't 300lbs+ linemen coming after you.
Exactly, technology can help in the fields of diagnosing and recovery evaluation from concussion, but they can only do so much in the area of prevention. Best example is that 10 years ago, everyone thought that mouthpiece use would drastically reduce the incidence of concussion. Now, most evidence suggests that the use of a mouthpiece is fairly irrelevant to the incidence rates of concussions. Sure some technological advances in helmet technology could help reduce a certain percentage of concussions, but it can only go so far. IMO, the best way to reduce concussions is to completely remove helmets and pads from the game, rugby has fewer concussions than football because players know they can't go head-to-head with each other.

Anyway, I agree with Back Harlow, with everything going on with concussions, football will be a less popular game in 20 years.

Except in football the vast majority of concussions don't involve O and D lineman, they happen between RB-LB and WR-DB or on special teams.

 

[fromolwyoming]

How many rugby players are 6'3 250lbs+ (size of a OLB)?

 

[ELKMT]

How many rugby players are 6'3 250lbs+ (size of a OLB)?

I don't think that is the average size of a college OLB, but u make a point on rugby player size. I also don't think rugby has comparable collisions or speed.

The average 5 year(2008-2013) NFL combine size for an outside linebacker is 6'1 238, and inside/ middle are 6'1.25 and 241.

 

[WestWYOPoke]

How many rugby players are 6'3 250lbs+ (size of a OLB)?

I don't think that is the average size of a college OLB, but u make a point on rugby player size. I also don't think rugby has comparable collisions or speed.

The average 5 year(2008-2013) NFL combine size for an outside linebacker is 6'1 238, and inside/ middle are 6'1.25 and 241.

Actually in pro rugby, usually 4-6 guys on each side (out of 15 on field per team) are 6'2"+, 240+, not as many in college, probably 1-3. Anyway, they are 2 different games obviously, but my point is you don't see as many concussions because players don't lead with their heads because if they do, they will die (or get f@$&ed up). The helmets in football do add safety but they also add an inflated sense of security which leads to more concussions.

P.S. I was/am a 6'3", 250lb+ rugby player.

 

[BackHarlowRoad]

Yeah size can be a factor, but speed/acceleration/deceleration is the bigger factor. Smaller guys who build up speed before the collision suffer way higher numbers of concussion than big old OL/DL. And more actually suffer concussions tackling rather than being tackled.

And WestWYO is in fact a 6'3, 250+ rugby player, but he's a big softy

 

[McPeachy]

The concussion problem can't be solved directly by technology. It's the impact of the brain against the skull, not the impact of the skull against other things that causes the injury. A person can be concussed without even hitting their head. It's a deceleration MOI.

I don't know about that - nor what the future holds in that respect, enough to say that technology won't solve the concussion problem. Take away the impact / shock - or reduce it, and you have solved the bulk of it. Stupid analogy - but 30 years ago if you mentioned internet, smart phone, ipod / ipad / iphone, you would have been straight-jacketed and tossed away in your new hometown.

:rofl:

 

[stymeman]

I'm not saying abandon football, just put more emphasis on hoops.

this philosophy is awesome let's make us a BBall school and go full bore to create something awesome on the High Plains in Laramie!!!! Start it after the rennovation of the AA!!

 

[Wyovanian]

The concussion problem can't be solved directly by technology. It's the impact of the brain against the skull, not the impact of the skull against other things that causes the injury. A person can be concussed without even hitting their head. It's a deceleration MOI.

I don't know about that - nor what the future holds in that respect, enough to say that technology won't solve the concussion problem. Take away the impact / shock - or reduce it, and you have solved the bulk of it. Stupid analogy - but 30 years ago if you mentioned internet, smart phone, ipod / ipad / iphone, you would have been straight-jacketed and tossed away in your new hometown.

:rofl:

True about the processor technology, but with concussions, you're faced with a glass window-steel hammer situation. Some fundamentals of nature can't be changed. Decelerate a human body in short order and gravity still affects the things in it. Most coaches and doctors are saying the pads and helmets are the problem inasmuch as they contribute to full speed contact. It's the velocity that's the problem. G forces can kill without direct impact. We've kind of reached a critical mass situation with the speed and size of today's players and the much slower mutability of the human body. Probably the most interesting proposal I've heard put forward, by a few (quite knowledgeable) people is that the players would slow down if they didn't have a face mask.

I'm pretty sure jaw injuries would shoot up, but over a longer period of time, I'd guess that eventually they'd plateau and fall along with concussions and head injuries in general...

Only approach that I can think of technology-wise that might reduce the impacts is some sort of new faceted uniform that deflects energy away from the body...