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csu campaigning for b12 inclusion

WestWYOPoke said:
poke_addict said:
McPeachy said:
poke_addict said:
Lol we are blowing them away in bball there is nothing better about sheep basketball compared to the pokes.

National titles Wyo 2 Csu ha

Conference titles Wyo 24 Csu 3...in there history also have been playing ball 4 years longer.

tourney Wyo 15 Csu 10

MWC titles reg/tourney Wyo 3 Csu 1

Border War 133-92 WYO
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None of this ^^ matters...it isn't what you did 10, 20, 30, 50, 100 years ago. It is "what have you done the last 5, and where are you going."

CSewe positioned themselves. They had (or have) vision. Volleyball, Women's Hoops, Men's Hoops, and Football...all have varied levels of solid success the last 5 years, or better.

Don't get me wrong, I could give a shit about Volleyball and Women's Hoops...but if I was looking at the big picture / future / vision, I would say CSewe is positioned to compete in a P5 conference, better than we are right now. That is all.

And it makes me ill.
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The only program that is consistently better then ours is volleyball I will give them that. But I just don't see what you are seeing with CSU. Why doesn't CSU bring as big of a fanbase to vegas every year (its not even close) I can tell you why no one cares about CSU sports! I know for a fact there are more COLORADO residents going to tourney with a steamboat logo on their shirt then sheep heads. Why the hell do the Colorado Rockies have University of WYOMING night every year Because they know there is a huge following of pokes fans in the area. They have one 10 win season in football and they're B12 caliber. No way...They had to build a new stadium because most high school stadiums were nicer then that shit hole in Ft. Collins. What have they done? hire some campaign manager? Where the hell are they going? I haven't seen them raise any banners in football or basketball lately either.

I read somewhere its not about how many people actually watch the tv broadcast its the market who buys the tv packages that include the particular channel. You don't think if Wyoming were to get a B12 invite we couldn't work deals with Denver broadcasting stations. We at least had a game on altitude last year in bball and It was against New Mexico state. Csu can't say the same thing.

I will agree that at least they are trying to get an invite more than we can say. I also agree that this CSU talk makes my blood boil peachy. Maybe we the fans should start our own campaign.
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They also do this for CU, CSU, AFA and Nebraska...
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Exactly my point why the hell would they add the lowly Wyoming school with the LOCAL colleges and I was not aware they did it for Nebraska, But still they have more fans then CU and CSU combined. We had an amazing showing for that night as well. I tried finding specific stats about those nights but came up short
 
joshvanklomp said:
poke_addict said:
I read somewhere its not about how many people actually watch the tv broadcast its the market who buys the tv packages that include the particular channel. You don't think if Wyoming were to get a B12 invite we couldn't work deals with Denver broadcasting stations. We at least had a game on altitude last year in bball and It was against New Mexico state. Csu can't say the same thing.
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It's not about working a deal with Denver broadcasting stations, it's if Denver cable companies would pick up whatever package the Big XII offers. That would be a lock if CSU joined. While it's possible they'd pick it up if Wyoming joined, it's far from a guarantee...and that's what the Big XII is probably looking for.

I actually wonder if our presence in Oklahoma recruiting would make it less likely for any Big XII move. If we're already picking up some of their better recruits as a G5, just think what might happen if we were in the same conference. OU and OSU might not like that.

I'd put money on the AAC schools joining the Big XII before they start raiding the Mountain West.
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I just don't understand how it's not based on ratings. I need to do some more research on these tv packages because the whole thing just doesn't add up to me. Aren't most B12 games carried by networks that are broadcasted nationally?
 
poke_addict said:
joshvanklomp said:
poke_addict said:
I read somewhere its not about how many people actually watch the tv broadcast its the market who buys the tv packages that include the particular channel. You don't think if Wyoming were to get a B12 invite we couldn't work deals with Denver broadcasting stations. We at least had a game on altitude last year in bball and It was against New Mexico state. Csu can't say the same thing.
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It's not about working a deal with Denver broadcasting stations, it's if Denver cable companies would pick up whatever package the Big XII offers. That would be a lock if CSU joined. While it's possible they'd pick it up if Wyoming joined, it's far from a guarantee...and that's what the Big XII is probably looking for.

I actually wonder if our presence in Oklahoma recruiting would make it less likely for any Big XII move. If we're already picking up some of their better recruits as a G5, just think what might happen if we were in the same conference. OU and OSU might not like that.

I'd put money on the AAC schools joining the Big XII before they start raiding the Mountain West.
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I just don't understand how it's not based on ratings. I need to do some more research on these tv packages because the whole thing just doesn't add up to me. Aren't most B12 games carried by networks that are broadcasted nationally?
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I think it's something to do with how many people are cutting cable and streaming games instead. And yes B12 currently has a deal with ESPN and Fox, but I believe that deal expires in the next few years and know that some of the schools (about everyone outside of Austin) wants to look at a Big 12 Network, like what the SEC, B10 and PAC have
 
I hate to throw a wet blanket on the thinking that CSU, and Wyoming, are going to be an addition to the Big XII.

Here's a little statistic that should put all of those hopes and fears to bed.

Average home attendance for both schools in the past 6 years (it was too depressing to go back any further):

2015 CSU - 24,917 WYO - 18,060
2014 CSU - 26,575 WYO - 19,599
2013 CSU - 18,600 WYO - 19,476
2012 CSU - 19,250 WYO - 22,162
2011 CSU - 21,867 WYO - 22,182
2010 CSU - 22,400 WYO - 20,791

Now, I am as big a homer as you can find, but with pitiful home attendance numbers like these, I don't see why the big boys would come courting good old WYO or CSU. WYO has no television market, no mass hysteria around our undefeated seasons and no sell out crowds for home games, so what good would it do to add us? The same goes for CSU. You can build a new stadium, but if you can only put 20,000 asses in the seats, it is still like putting lipstick on a pig...it's still a pig, er, a sheep. While I think it is important to put money into the athletic department, I think we need to compete in the MWC before we start thumping our chests and saying we need to be in the Big XII.

By the way, the "build it and they will come" can sometimes be a risky proposition. CSU maybe should take a look at this and then see if they really want to spend that money on a team that historically can't draw big crowds.

http://www.npr.org/sections/parallels/2015/05/11/405955547/brazils-world-cup-legacy-includes-550m-stadium-turned-parking-lot

:twocents:
 
poke_addict said:
I just don't understand how it's not based on ratings. I need to do some more research on these tv packages because the whole thing just doesn't add up to me. Aren't most B12 games carried by networks that are broadcasted nationally?
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Look at the most recent changes to the Big Ten...Rutgers and Maryland aren't big ratings boosts and weren't the best fits on the field, but the important thing for them was getting into the DC and NYC markets. If the Big XII wants to get back in the Denver market, they'll give CSU a call.
 
joshvanklomp said:
poke_addict said:
I just don't understand how it's not based on ratings. I need to do some more research on these tv packages because the whole thing just doesn't add up to me. Aren't most B12 games carried by networks that are broadcasted nationally?
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Look at the most recent changes to the Big Ten...Rutgers and Maryland aren't big ratings boosts and weren't the best fits on the field, but the important thing for them was getting into the DC and NYC markets. If the Big XII wants to get back in the Denver market, they'll give CSU a call.
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I'll agree with Josh's example here. I follow a lot of Big Ten and everyone in the conference hates having Rutgers added,but they did it because of the New York TV market. And ratings aren't really factored in because no one in NYC gives a crap about Rutgers; they suck in football and basketball and draw shit crowds, the ONLY reason they were added was their market.
 
Prior to Burman, UW's athletic budget was greater than CSU's. That has changed. In the most recent history, they have also performed better as an athletic department than UW. IMO, without looking at all the records, I think that CSU has demonstrated clear and measurable progress in the last 5 years with regards to actual wins and losses.

WYO has been more fiscally conservative which I think probably matches the vision of the University, the State, and the fans. WYO is trying to emulate a usu by overachieving with respect to budget. CSU is trying to spend money to make money. They are definitely trying to get off the sinking MWC boat; we approach it with the reality that the MWC or whatever life-boat emerges from the wreckage is our vessel for the duration.

The thought or notion of WYO to the Big12 is nothing short of ridiculous. CSU's chances rank right up there with getting struck by lightning. They are working to improve their odds.

The Denver DMA will never be counted in WYO's corner. DMAs are what TV execs sell to advertisers. If the ratings slip (ala 1st round of playoff), then TV execs do various comps to make that up to advertisers. There is not some mythical large WYO fanbase waiting to be tapped in to. With an undergrad enrollment of approximately 10K and a state population of approximately 500K, we are just too limited. If you took every undergrad for the past 100 years + every person in the state of WYO and put them in front of a TV to watch a game, you'd have about 1 to 1.5 M pairs of eyeballs. That would rank right up there with advertising during reruns of poker.
 
If Wyoming were to enclose our stadium and dome it and then get a winning tradition going (like winning MWC championships and filling our stadium on a regular basis), our chances would increase 10 fold.
 
WYCowboy said:
If Wyoming were to enclose our stadium and dome it and then get a winning tradition going (like winning MWC championships and filling our stadium on a regular basis), our chances would increase 10 fold.
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They would increase.....but we still don't have a large TV market. I don' t think a P5 conference will just take anybody. They will only take who brings something to the table. There are about 3 or 4 programs who do...none are in the MWC.
 
No, we have 0 chance of ever being considered for the Big 12. For non-private institutions, the smallest enrollment is K-State at about 24K. Of the reporting institutions, Iowa State has the smallest budget of 75 million. We are currently around 30 million. Even with a Big 12 payout of about 24 million, we'd be well over $20 million behind anyone else in the conference.

OK, maybe not ever. We would need an enrollment of 20K +. We would need to consistently average 40K+ at football with solid bball attendance. We would need to consistently win MWC and perform well in NY6 bowls + NCAA tourney. Cheyenne-Laramie would need about 1 million people. Our athletic budget would need to rise to about $55K.

So, I guess there is a chance.
 
poke_addict said:
The only program that is consistently better then ours is volleyball I will give them that.
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Just even looking at the last 2 years (the "what have you done for me lately - ala CJC donation philosophy"), their four programs I mentioned, have out-performed ours.

Volleyball
2015-6 CSewe 26-4, 18-0 Conference, NCAA appearance (one and done)
WYO 23-7, 13-5 Conference
2014-5 CSewe 31-3, 17-1 Conference, NCAA appearance (with 2 wins to advance)
WYO 23-8, 12-6 Conference

Women's Hoops
2015-6 CSewe 31-2, 18-0 Conference, NCAA appearance (one and done)
WYO 13-16, 6-12 Conference
2014-5 CSewe 23-8, 15-3 Conference, NIT appearance (one and done)
WYO 16-14, 10-8 Conference

Men's Hoops
2015-6 CSewe 18-16, 8-10 Conference, MWC tourney 2 wins & lost in the semi (corrected)
WYO 14-18, 7-11 Conference
2014-5 CSewe 27-7, 13-5 Conference, NIT appearance (one and done)
WYO 25-10, 11-7 Conference, MWC tourney champs, NCAA (one and done)

Football
2015-6 CSewe 7-6, 5-3 Conference, Bowl Game (loss)
WYO 2-10, 2-6 Conference
2014-5 CSewe 10-3, 6-2 Conference, Bowl Game - Las Vegas (loss)
WYO 4-8, 2-6 Conference

Pair the above performance trends, with their new football stadium / vision / construction, the addition of several D1 sports to compete in since 2013, the obvious population difference of FC vs. Laramie (and most importantly , that their enrollment is roughly 20,000 students higher than Wyoming)...and I wanna barf.

So, when we compare WYO athletics with the closest competitor...it is obvious what we have been doing the last few years, versus what they have been doing the last few years, has a grand canyon sized gap between them, you can see where my frustration comes from.

Our athletic administration has been wonderful reacting to our competition - I kid, I kid. The administration was thrilled when Utah, TCU, and bWHYu left so we could compete better in conference (what a joke). The mantra of doing more with less is nothing to be proud of, and shouldn't continually be spewed out to anyone that will listen. And then, when you look deep at the who's who at the UW athletic department, you will clearly see an uninspiring director, managing a (very) unqualified and uninspiring group. Ugh.
 
McPeachy said:
poke_addict said:
The only program that is consistently better then ours is volleyball I will give them that.
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Just even looking at the last 2 years (the "what have you done for me lately - ala CJC donation philosophy"), their four programs I mentioned, have out-performed ours.

Volleyball
2015-6 CSewe 26-4, 18-0 Conference, NCAA appearance (one and done)
WYO 23-7, 13-5 Conference
2014-5 CSewe 31-3, 17-1 Conference, NCAA appearance (with 2 wins to advance)
WYO 23-8, 12-6 Conference

Women's Hoops
2015-6 CSewe 31-2, 18-0 Conference, NCAA appearance (one and done)
WYO 13-16, 6-12 Conference
2014-5 CSewe 23-8, 15-3 Conference, NIT appearance (one and done)
WYO 16-14, 10-8 Conference

Men's Hoops
2015-6 CSewe 18-16, 8-10 Conference, MWC tourney championship game - loss
WYO 14-18, 7-11 Conference
2014-5 CSewe 27-7, 13-5 Conference, NIT appearance (one and done)
WYO 25-10, 11-7 Conference, MWC tourney champs, NCAA (one and done)

Football
2015-6 CSewe 7-6, 5-3 Conference, Bowl Game (loss)
WYO 2-10, 2-6 Conference
2014-5 CSewe 10-3, 6-2 Conference, Bowl Game - Las Vegas (loss)
WYO 4-8, 2-6 Conference

Pair the above performance trends, with their new football stadium / vision / construction, the addition of several D1 sports to compete in since 2013, the obvious population difference of FC vs. Laramie (and most importantly , that their enrollment is roughly 20,000 students higher than Wyoming)...and I wanna barf.

So, when we compare WYO athletics with the closest competitor...it is obvious what we have been doing the last few years, versus what they have been doing the last few years, has a grand canyon sized gap between them, you can see where my frustration comes from.

Our athletic administration has been wonderful reacting to our competition - I kid, I kid. The administration was thrilled when Utah, TCU, and bWHYu left so we could compete better in conference (what a joke). The mantra of doing more with less is nothing to be proud of, and shouldn't continually be spewed out to anyone that will listen. And then, when you look deep at the who's who at the UW athletic department, you will clearly see an uninspiring director, managing a (very) unqualified and uninspiring group. Ugh.
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Men's hoops doesn't belong on that list they did not make to he MWC championship game that was SDSU and Fresno this year. We destroyed them twice with the fourth youngest team in the Country. Even in there best regular season in program history they didn't belong on the floor with us. Do I need to post the highlights of the past 5 games?

Remember CSU football was in the dumps pretty recently but ended up making an awesome hire with coach Mac but will Bobo keep that going? The jury is still out on Bohl. He has at least shown he can find elite players in the rough. If Bohl works out we could be back ahead on the gridiron here very soon as well.

I know the B12 could care less about that 31-2 record in women's bball but it is impressive I will give you that.
They have a powerhouse volleyball program as well I will give them that too.

We can't compare what is probably the best program at UW as we speak. Wait don't they already compete in the B12? Coach Branch and company would love to brand some sheep if they had the chance.

Facilities. New stadium yes I get it they had to build it just to keep the fan base they do have, but they will be playing catch up again once the AA and HAPC is done.

There is nothing we can do about town sizes. We do need to figure out a way to grow enrollment but I am definitely not in expert in that field. Yes we need better vision and leadership but we the fans are going to have to form a militia and force it ourselves to get it done. That's what makes me ill as well peachy. But actual results performance wise I don't see a grand canyon sized gap.
 
laxwyo said:
To me, the only way this happens is with extreme timing. We put together a few great seasons at the perfect time and it's possible albeit slight. I'm talking about 9 and 10 wins. Even then it's only a sliver of a chance. The only plausible way is if we someone manage to be top of the G5 and playing in the New Year's Day bowls. That attention would be big. Big dreaming there


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
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That didn't even work for Boise State.
 
Not going to happen, but now people are yelling about the death penalty for Baylor:

http://espn.go.com/espn/otl/story/_/id/15562625/waco-police-records-reveal-additional-violence-allegations-baylor-football-players

It'd open up another spot in B12. :P

Should mention that "people" include Baylor alumni that want to see the program burn so it can get a truly fresh start, whatever that means.
 
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