Craig Bohl: Simply an illusionist?

[cali2wyo]

I don't get people getting so excited over a few young guys contributing and equating that to being a badass recruiter. Christensen had just as many, if not more, young guys stepping up and contributing year after year. Yet somehow his horrible recruiting is to blame for this mess?

A FEW????

Almost our whole team out there is young recruits!

Pownell-leads the team in tackles in game one!

Epps- teams only int

Wingard- LEADS the team in tackles overall

Hill- leads the team in rushing

TWO STARTING TRUE FRESHMAN OLINE!
ONE STARTING OLINE SOPH who has been starting since 3/4 way through his Frosh year

Granderson- getting significant time on DLine

Kamana- significant defender

Preister- probably our best CB

Makranski- good in open field tackles

Parker, Price, Murphy, Tapscott, Harshman Mayfield have all gotten time and 4 of them have even scored in their careers already.

We're only 4 weeks in and have seen over 21 true frosh or RS frosh playing

The only reason you say they aren't good recruits is because we haven't won yet. But we in the same breath can admit that they are young and undersized.

No...

We have some of our better recruits in a long time.

By the way it wasn't DC's horrid recruiting to blame for this it was his killing off of our Defense five years ago.

ACS
Brett Smith
Alvester Alexander
Luke Ruff
Shamiel Gary
Blair Burns
Nick Carlson
Dominic Rufran
Jake Jones
Ghaali Muhammad
And others...
All those guys competed significantly as true freshman when the roster wasn't as young. My point is the current group of young guys look better than they actually are because of who they are surrounded by. 21 freshmen haven't played thus far because they're talented enough to be D1 players, they've suited up because there simply isn't anyone else. They may be in the spotlight now, but we've had plenty of impact freshmen in previous years that I don't see how it makes Bohl be labelled as an amazing recruiter

 

[ragtimejoe1]

No...

We have some of our better recruits in a long time.

This is not certain. This team is still the least talented team in FBS and the least talented team in much of FCS. I like some of the recruits, but to imply that playing time on this team = talent is a bit disingenuous.

I'm not throwing them under the bus, but at the same time I'm not willing to go so far as proclaiming them the second coming of the mid-90s era Cowboys. We assume they will develop, but they (as a group) have a LOOOOOOOOOONG ways to go to even be middle of the pack of the MWC and that is saying something.

 

[kansasCowboy]

No...

We have some of our better recruits in a long time.

This is not certain. This team is still the least talented team in FBS and the least talented team in much of FCS. I like some of the recruits, but to imply that playing time on this team = talent is a bit disingenuous.

I'm not throwing them under the bus, but at the same time I'm not willing to go so far as proclaiming them the second coming of the mid-90s era Cowboys. We assume they will develop, but they (as a group) have a LOOOOOOOOOONG ways to go to even be middle of the pack of the MWC and that is saying something.

I'm not going by playing time. I'm going by what I, a coach sees on the field.

Young, raw, talent...

 

[ragtimejoe1]

No...

We have some of our better recruits in a long time.

This is not certain. This team is still the least talented team in FBS and the least talented team in much of FCS. I like some of the recruits, but to imply that playing time on this team = talent is a bit disingenuous.

I'm not throwing them under the bus, but at the same time I'm not willing to go so far as proclaiming them the second coming of the mid-90s era Cowboys. We assume they will develop, but they (as a group) have a LOOOOOOOOOONG ways to go to even be middle of the pack of the MWC and that is saying something.

I'm not going by playing time. I'm going by what I, a coach sees on the field.

Young, raw, talent...

It is still your speculation that this group will mature into better players than other Freshman in the MWC. Would 20 BSU freshmen get plastered by a low level FCS team? I honestly don't know but I doubt it.

Again, I'm not throwing our guys under the bus, but every program has freshman. Every program is working on developing them. As it stands, our freshmen are about mid-FCS level talent. Can they develop into upper level MWC talent? Certainly. Can they develop into bottom level MWC talent? Certainly.

Clearly there are a few of the young guys that exhibit qualities of mid to upper MWC level play but it will take one hell of a lot more than a few players.

 

[LanderPoke]

No...

We have some of our better recruits in a long time.

This is not certain. This team is still the least talented team in FBS and the least talented team in much of FCS. I like some of the recruits, but to imply that playing time on this team = talent is a bit disingenuous.

I'm not throwing them under the bus, but at the same time I'm not willing to go so far as proclaiming them the second coming of the mid-90s era Cowboys. We assume they will develop, but they (as a group) have a LOOOOOOOOOONG ways to go to even be middle of the pack of the MWC and that is saying something.

I'm not going by playing time. I'm going by what I, a coach sees on the field.

Young, raw, talent...

It is still your speculation that this group will mature into better players than other Freshman in the MWC. Would 20 BSU freshmen get plastered by a low level FCS team? I honestly don't know but I doubt it.

Again, I'm not throwing our guys under the bus, but every program has freshman. Every program is working on developing them. As it stands, our freshmen are about mid-FCS level talent. Can they develop into upper level MWC talent? Certainly. Can they develop into bottom level MWC talent? Certainly.

Clearly there are a few of the young guys that exhibit qualities of mid to upper MWC level play but it will take one hell of a lot more than a few players.

Uh, yeah, Boise's 20 freshmen might lose to as FCS team. Yes.

 

[Wyolie Coyote]

I don't get people getting so excited over a few young guys contributing and equating that to being a badass recruiter. Christensen had just as many, if not more, young guys stepping up and contributing year after year. Yet somehow his horrible recruiting is to blame for this mess?

A FEW????

Almost our whole team out there is young recruits!

Pownell-leads the team in tackles in game one!

Epps- teams only int

Wingard- LEADS the team in tackles overall

Hill- leads the team in rushing

TWO STARTING TRUE FRESHMAN OLINE!
ONE STARTING OLINE SOPH who has been starting since 3/4 way through his Frosh year

Granderson- getting significant time on DLine

Kamana- significant defender

Preister- probably our best CB

Makranski- good in open field tackles

Parker, Price, Murphy, Tapscott, Harshman Mayfield have all gotten time and 4 of them have even scored in their careers already.

We're only 4 weeks in and have seen over 21 true frosh or RS frosh playing

The only reason you say they aren't good recruits is because we haven't won yet. But we in the same breath can admit that they are young and undersized.

No...

We have some of our better recruits in a long time.

By the way it wasn't DC's horrid recruiting to blame for this it was his killing off of our Defense five years ago.

ACS
Brett Smith
Alvester Alexander
Luke Ruff
Shamiel Gary
Blair Burns
Nick Carlson
Dominic Rufran
Jake Jones
Ghaali Muhammad
And others...
All those guys competed significantly as true freshman when the roster wasn't as young. My point is the current group of young guys look better than they actually are because of who they are surrounded by. 21 freshmen haven't played thus far because they're talented enough to be D1 players, they've suited up because there simply isn't anyone else. They may be in the spotlight now, but we've had plenty of impact freshmen in previous years that I don't see how it makes Bohl be labelled as an amazing recruiter

This

 

[ragtimejoe1]

Uh, yeah, Boise's 20 freshmen might lose to as FCS team. Yes.

If they only played 20 freshmen and not other players, obviously, but you know what I meant.

Wake Forest is also playing a really young team (similar to us). They had no problem with their weak opponents. They even beat Army who plastered EMU who plastered us.

I would speculate that BSU's recruits are likely better than Wake Forest's.

 

[McPeachy]

Uh, yeah, Boise's 20 freshmen might lose to as FCS team. Yes.

If they only played 20 freshmen and not other players, obviously, but you know what I meant.

Wake Forest is also playing a really young team (similar to us). They had no problem with their weak opponents. They even beat Army who plastered EMU who plastered us.

I would speculate that BSU's recruits are likely better than Wake Forest's.

We have been through this. There are 2 younger teams that UW at the FBS level...NC State & Florida State.

Further, Bohl knew it was coming...he knew he was losing 20+ seniors after year one, and did nothing to back-fill the team in either recruiting class (1 or 2).

 

[ragtimejoe1]

Uh, yeah, Boise's 20 freshmen might lose to as FCS team. Yes.

If they only played 20 freshmen and not other players, obviously, but you know what I meant.

Wake Forest is also playing a really young team (similar to us). They had no problem with their weak opponents. They even beat Army who plastered EMU who plastered us.

I would speculate that BSU's recruits are likely better than Wake Forest's.

We have been through this. There are 2 younger teams that UW at the FBS level...NC State & Florida State.

Further, Bohl knew it was coming...he knew he was losing 20+ seniors after year one, and did nothing to back-fill the team in either recruiting class (1 or 2).

Yeah, NC State and Florida State are younger but I thought Wake was a better comparison recruiting-wise for BSU because BSU probably recruits better than Wake. I think Wake has somewhere around 80 Freshmen and Sophomores on the roster. In terms of experience, they are pretty similar to us. Thus, the notion that BSU's youth would get plastered by low level FCS teams is ridiculous, IMO.

 

[LanderPoke]

Uh, yeah, Boise's 20 freshmen might lose to as FCS team. Yes.

If they only played 20 freshmen and not other players, obviously, but you know what I meant.

Wake Forest is also playing a really young team (similar to us). They had no problem with their weak opponents. They even beat Army who plastered EMU who plastered us.

I would speculate that BSU's recruits are likely better than Wake Forest's.

We have been through this. There are 2 younger teams that UW at the FBS level...NC State & Florida State.

Further, Bohl knew it was coming...he knew he was losing 20+ seniors after year one, and did nothing to back-fill the team in either recruiting class (1 or 2).

I agree. I'm not making excuses for Bohl. It was incredibly short-sighted and stupid to not bring in some JC Dlinemen and LBs. He made his bed now he has to sleep in it.

 

[HR_Poke]

I agree. not bringing in a few JC players to even just give your freshmen a chance to redshirt was very silly.

 

[RedRiverPoke4]

I would like to know what the hell the AD or University is doing about this debacle! I'd be willing to throw money out or fundraise to get some better recruits/coaching staff! Looks like we are headed to the sewer bowl this year.

 

[stymeman]

i have a hard time with this, i understand patience etc....but shouldn't we see some kinds of improvement like i did at Wazzu, I was truly impressed with the way we looked overall up there, vs UNM NOT at ALL, again truly disappointed, is it they can't play at the elevation themselves, too afraid of what home fans will think, etc..etc...
I'm still calling this the Joe Glenn 2.0 factor, sorry, until they prove me wrong that's where I'm at. I love Glenn and Bohl as people, I just don't think they truly get the D1 factor and what it takes to be successful at this level, even though we are lower of the pack team of FCS, which is truly disappointing. My thing is 2 coaches that won Nat'l titles at FCS level and it's truly apparent this level is totally different for them. If Bohl and Glenn are truly all that then why did they both come to UW, and so easily, no other suitors. look at this this way, bad under Koenning, decent under Glenn, DC ok, and now this??? it's tough being a Pokes fan for sure, I'm sure trying tho...lol

 

[TSpoke]

First, I do not think Bohl is an illusionist. I still think he can get this done. However, as I said, I've transitioned from I know he is the right guy to I think he is the right guy.

My main criticisms are 1) He and the staff came in with a little too much blowhard, IMO. It is extremely obvious that his "system" will not instill "Cowboy Tough--whatever the hell that is"; it will need to be recruited. Another approach would have been to try to install his system over time but work with the talent he had (rather than blow up the program). Methinks that Brett knew what was about to happen and just got the hell out. I get Bohl's approach of his way or the highway. His system or hit the bricks. Tear it completely apart and have nobody around that doesn't exactly fit his ideas. However, I think BSU does the best job in the country at adapting to the players they have. An example of forcing an ideal vs. adapting to what you have is DC and the 4-3. It wasn't long and he was back to the 3-4.

2) We were terribly under prepared for that opener and for the UNM game. The T2 requires good reads, strict discipline, etc. None of those are qualities of a young defense. Instead of this hard-headed T2 or bust philosophy, why not install an easier version of the 4-3 for the young guys? Maybe a few different looks that lets them play more and worry less about their zone? Regardless, the obvious lack of preparation is concerning to me.

3) The undisciplined play. You can be young and disciplined. Youth does not excuse the abundance of stupid penalties. I was hoping for a well-coached and well disciplined team. They may not beat the guy across from them, but they do the right things all the time.

4) I was hoping for better fundamentals--particularly tackling. I was hoping for more signs of toughness. If you've watched Michigan, you've seen a coach instill toughness in a group that wasn't tough. Before the fanboys fly off the handle, I'm not suggesting Bohl should be at Michigan's level. I'm only saying that is an example of a team that got tougher. I was hoping we would see something along those lines. Youth is not exclusionary to a tough, disciplined, and fundamentally sound team. Inadequate coaching is.

5) If it is true about telling the QBs not to slide, that might be the dumbest thing I've ever heard from a coaching staff. If I knew that was 100% true, then I would really question if this is the right staff.

6) Hiring Stanard.

7) NDSU beating 1 FBS team a year isn't the same as beating 11 a year and isn't an indicator of guaranteed success at Wyoming. NDSU also had the luxury of being on of the top dogs in FCS in terms of facilities and such. An equivalent might be if he took Valparaiso to the heights he took NDSU. To put it on a FBS equivalent, NDSU would be like an AZ State, Texas Tech, or something vs. Wyoming (Valparaiso). What I'm getting at is, it was relatively easy to get the best players in all of FCS to go to NDSU. Xs and Os are a whole lot easier if you simply have better Jims and Joes. IMO, Bohl is out of his element and it is showing somewhat.

Again, I still think Bohl will get this done but I don't think he is some mythical master and guru of football that can get young men to run through an iron wall. I think he is an experienced football coach who works hard, has high standards, and cares about the program. I also believe he will adjust to his new situation but adjust he must even if that means making changes in his staff.

This exactly. I don't see anyone here calling to fire Bohl(except for Beaver and SD who were never on the Bohl bandwagon) but apparently to some on here any criticism or showing any concern over the direction of the program makes you a bad fan and a doomsdayer. The things that concern me about the coaching staff is the team is undiscalined and looks unprepared for the games. That falls on the staff even if we have a young team that is small and slow.

Also if they are gonna preach "Cowboy Tough" they should show it by having some intestinal fortitude when it comes to play calling. Go for it on 4th down when we need to make a comeback punts the last 2 games(esspecially WSU) were horrible calls. But I guess if you go for it and don't make it then the blame can be placed on the coaches shoulders instead of punting it and if the D doesn't hold its on the players.

Now I am looking forward to seeing progress the rest of the year and seeing the young kids grow and get better. It is hard to form an opinion before we see the rest of the year play out but we are a messageboard so we are gonna analyse it every step of the way. I am not off the bandwagon and still think this staff can get it done but just commenting on things that have me concerned through 4 games.

 

[PokeOLoco]

apparently to some on here any criticism or showing any concern over the direction of the program makes you a bad fan and a doomsdayer.

Exactly, I'm just calling it as I see it, and I agree with just about everything ragtime said. When I see something else, I'll call it something else. But right now we are young, undisciplined, small, and slow.

 

[SDPokeFan]

First, I do not think Bohl is an illusionist. I still think he can get this done. However, as I said, I've transitioned from I know he is the right guy to I think he is the right guy.

My main criticisms are 1) He and the staff came in with a little too much blowhard, IMO. It is extremely obvious that his "system" will not instill "Cowboy Tough--whatever the hell that is"; it will need to be recruited. Another approach would have been to try to install his system over time but work with the talent he had (rather than blow up the program). Methinks that Brett knew what was about to happen and just got the hell out. I get Bohl's approach of his way or the highway. His system or hit the bricks. Tear it completely apart and have nobody around that doesn't exactly fit his ideas. However, I think BSU does the best job in the country at adapting to the players they have. An example of forcing an ideal vs. adapting to what you have is DC and the 4-3. It wasn't long and he was back to the 3-4.

2) We were terribly under prepared for that opener and for the UNM game. The T2 requires good reads, strict discipline, etc. None of those are qualities of a young defense. Instead of this hard-headed T2 or bust philosophy, why not install an easier version of the 4-3 for the young guys? Maybe a few different looks that lets them play more and worry less about their zone? Regardless, the obvious lack of preparation is concerning to me.

3) The undisciplined play. You can be young and disciplined. Youth does not excuse the abundance of stupid penalties. I was hoping for a well-coached and well disciplined team. They may not beat the guy across from them, but they do the right things all the time.

4) I was hoping for better fundamentals--particularly tackling. I was hoping for more signs of toughness. If you've watched Michigan, you've seen a coach instill toughness in a group that wasn't tough. Before the fanboys fly off the handle, I'm not suggesting Bohl should be at Michigan's level. I'm only saying that is an example of a team that got tougher. I was hoping we would see something along those lines. Youth is not exclusionary to a tough, disciplined, and fundamentally sound team. Inadequate coaching is.

5) If it is true about telling the QBs not to slide, that might be the dumbest thing I've ever heard from a coaching staff. If I knew that was 100% true, then I would really question if this is the right staff.

6) Hiring Stanard.

7) NDSU beating 1 FBS team a year isn't the same as beating 11 a year and isn't an indicator of guaranteed success at Wyoming. NDSU also had the luxury of being on of the top dogs in FCS in terms of facilities and such. An equivalent might be if he took Valparaiso to the heights he took NDSU. To put it on a FBS equivalent, NDSU would be like an AZ State, Texas Tech, or something vs. Wyoming (Valparaiso). What I'm getting at is, it was relatively easy to get the best players in all of FCS to go to NDSU. Xs and Os are a whole lot easier if you simply have better Jims and Joes. IMO, Bohl is out of his element and it is showing somewhat.

Again, I still think Bohl will get this done but I don't think he is some mythical master and guru of football that can get young men to run through an iron wall. I think he is an experienced football coach who works hard, has high standards, and cares about the program. I also believe he will adjust to his new situation but adjust he must even if that means making changes in his staff.

This exactly. I don't see anyone here calling to fire Bohl(except for Beaver and SD who were never on the Bohl bandwagon) but apparently to some on here any criticism or showing any concern over the direction of the program makes you a bad fan and a doomsdayer. The things that concern me about the coaching staff is the team is undiscalined and looks unprepared for the games. That falls on the staff even if we have a young team that is small and slow.

Also if they are gonna preach "Cowboy Tough" they should show it by having some intestinal fortitude when it comes to play calling. Go for it on 4th down when we need to make a comeback punts the last 2 games(esspecially WSU) were horrible calls. But I guess if you go for it and don't make it then the blame can be placed on the coaches shoulders instead of punting it and if the D doesn't hold its on the players.

Now I am looking forward to seeing progress the rest of the year and seeing the young kids grow and get better. It is hard to form an opinion before we see the rest of the year play out but we are a messageboard so we are gonna analyse it every step of the way. I am not off the bandwagon and still think this staff can get it done but just commenting on things that have me concerned through 4 games.

I don't know if you meant me, but I haven't called for Bohl to be fired, because I don't think it matters who the coach is—Wyoming can't compete at this level.

I agree about the Cowboy Tough thing. Lose it until you play that way. Same with the whole "War Daddy Up" crap. If they are so great in the weight room, why do they get blown off the ball every play. And I'm talking about the older guys, like Olive. I've never seen someone so big and allegedly strong get rag dolled so much.

 

[JimmyDimes]

apparently to some on here any criticism or showing any concern over the direction of the program makes you a bad fan and a doomsdayer.

Exactly, I'm just calling it as I see it, and I agree with just about everything ragtime said. When I see something else. I'll call it something else. But right now we are young, undisciplined, small, and slow.

Yes we are young, and small at some positions, and undisciplined (mainly due to youth and inexperience). I'm not sure we are that slow.....players just need to understand their assignments.

This is the exact reason why Bohl needs time. Only 4 or 5 seniors get PT. Most of the juniors, especially those on defense, are playing out of position. Until Bohl has more than two recruiting classes to build depth, we are going to struggle.

 

[Slow Hand]

First, I do not think Bohl is an illusionist. I still think he can get this done. However, as I said, I've transitioned from I know he is the right guy to I think he is the right guy.

My main criticisms are 1) He and the staff came in with a little too much blowhard, IMO. It is extremely obvious that his "system" will not instill "Cowboy Tough--whatever the hell that is"; it will need to be recruited. Another approach would have been to try to install his system over time but work with the talent he had (rather than blow up the program). Methinks that Brett knew what was about to happen and just got the hell out. I get Bohl's approach of his way or the highway. His system or hit the bricks. Tear it completely apart and have nobody around that doesn't exactly fit his ideas. However, I think BSU does the best job in the country at adapting to the players they have. An example of forcing an ideal vs. adapting to what you have is DC and the 4-3. It wasn't long and he was back to the 3-4.

2) We were terribly under prepared for that opener and for the UNM game. The T2 requires good reads, strict discipline, etc. None of those are qualities of a young defense. Instead of this hard-headed T2 or bust philosophy, why not install an easier version of the 4-3 for the young guys? Maybe a few different looks that lets them play more and worry less about their zone? Regardless, the obvious lack of preparation is concerning to me.

3) The undisciplined play. You can be young and disciplined. Youth does not excuse the abundance of stupid penalties. I was hoping for a well-coached and well disciplined team. They may not beat the guy across from them, but they do the right things all the time.

4) I was hoping for better fundamentals--particularly tackling. I was hoping for more signs of toughness. If you've watched Michigan, you've seen a coach instill toughness in a group that wasn't tough. Before the fanboys fly off the handle, I'm not suggesting Bohl should be at Michigan's level. I'm only saying that is an example of a team that got tougher. I was hoping we would see something along those lines. Youth is not exclusionary to a tough, disciplined, and fundamentally sound team. Inadequate coaching is.

5) If it is true about telling the QBs not to slide, that might be the dumbest thing I've ever heard from a coaching staff. If I knew that was 100% true, then I would really question if this is the right staff.

6) Hiring Stanard.

7) NDSU beating 1 FBS team a year isn't the same as beating 11 a year and isn't an indicator of guaranteed success at Wyoming. NDSU also had the luxury of being on of the top dogs in FCS in terms of facilities and such. An equivalent might be if he took Valparaiso to the heights he took NDSU. To put it on a FBS equivalent, NDSU would be like an AZ State, Texas Tech, or something vs. Wyoming (Valparaiso). What I'm getting at is, it was relatively easy to get the best players in all of FCS to go to NDSU. Xs and Os are a whole lot easier if you simply have better Jims and Joes. IMO, Bohl is out of his element and it is showing somewhat.

Again, I still think Bohl will get this done but I don't think he is some mythical master and guru of football that can get young men to run through an iron wall. I think he is an experienced football coach who works hard, has high standards, and cares about the program. I also believe he will adjust to his new situation but adjust he must even if that means making changes in his staff.

This exactly. I don't see anyone here calling to fire Bohl(except for Beaver and SD who were never on the Bohl bandwagon) but apparently to some on here any criticism or showing any concern over the direction of the program makes you a bad fan and a doomsdayer. The things that concern me about the coaching staff is the team is undiscalined and looks unprepared for the games. That falls on the staff even if we have a young team that is small and slow.

Also if they are gonna preach "Cowboy Tough" they should show it by having some intestinal fortitude when it comes to play calling. Go for it on 4th down when we need to make a comeback punts the last 2 games(esspecially WSU) were horrible calls. But I guess if you go for it and don't make it then the blame can be placed on the coaches shoulders instead of punting it and if the D doesn't hold its on the players.

Now I am looking forward to seeing progress the rest of the year and seeing the young kids grow and get better. It is hard to form an opinion before we see the rest of the year play out but we are a messageboard so we are gonna analyse it every step of the way. I am not off the bandwagon and still think this staff can get it done but just commenting on things that have me concerned through 4 games.

I don't know if you meant me, but I haven't called for Bohl to be fired, because I don't think it matters who the coach is—Wyoming can't compete at this level.

I agree about the Cowboy Tough thing. Lose it until you play that way. Same with the whole "War Daddy Up" crap. If they are so great in the weight room, why do they get blown off the ball every play. And I'm talking about the older guys, like Olive. I've never seen someone so big and allegedly strong get rag dolled so much.

Uso may be strong but he has such short levers that he can't manipulate anyone off the LOS! So essentially his strength is worthless

 

[stymeman]

apparently to some on here any criticism or showing any concern over the direction of the program makes you a bad fan and a doomsdayer.

Exactly, I'm just calling it as I see it, and I agree with just about everything ragtime said. When I see something else. I'll call it something else. But right now we are young, undisciplined, small, and slow.

Yes we are young, and small at some positions, and undisciplined (mainly due to youth and inexperience). I'm not sure we are that slow.....players just need to understand their assignments.

This is the exact reason why Bohl needs time. Only 4 or 5 seniors get PT. Most of the juniors, especially those on defense, are playing out of position. Until Bohl has more than two recruiting classes to build depth, we are going to struggle.

exactly Jimmy, we're 4 games in and for the most part seeing the same things/mistakes, game in and game out, i just wanna see improvement that's all, i did see it at Wazzu and thought they could build off that against UNM, giant step backwards AGAIN, that's what gets old for me

 

[Coeur d' Alene]

theMost talented player on this side of Jay Novacek? Yep, that was Glenn's doing, too.

who ? Gipson?