Big Men

[kdwrightuwyo]

Tater Creek is still pissed he boy Greener was let go and the new FB strength coach is getting it done...so he's grasping for something to whine about.

 

[PotatoCreekPete]

Tater Creek is still pissed he boy Greener was let go and the new FB strength coach is getting it done...so he's grasping for something to whine about.

You must have been down in Colorado sampling that special weed....Your post is so way off base it isn't funny.

I have no "dog in the fight" to use a Southern term with Greener. I have written several things supporting the hiring of Duval so that is how far off you are.

The situation that the men's BB team is in right now with the lack of depth is "grasping for something to whine about". The ONLY one grasping here is you looking for the excuse to make another post.

 

[kansasCowboy]

Bigs recruited by Shyatt:
6'10" C Leykan Ajayi (washed out)
6'8" F Tyrone Marshall (washed out)
6'7" F Larry Nance Jr.
6'9" F Staphon Blair (Signed with UCF)
6'8" F Austin Haldorson
6'10" C Matt Sellers
6'9" F Derek Cooke Jr.
6'8" F Alan Herndon
6'9" C Jonathon Barnes
6'8" C Zach Braxton (Signed with Weber State)

Thanks for the list. But I'm not counting guys we went after that didn't even sign.

On top of that we play a guard heavy style of offense with versitile big men (like Nance). We don't utilize an offense that has a big man banging down low, yet Shyatt still goes for those guys, Cooke, Sellers type. Halderson is like Nance, more versitile. He can move, and has range in his shot. Those type of bigs are harder to find, and others who have the capability to become versitile generally don't want to change how they play and either leave or go elsewhere.
Overall I think our recruiting has been very good. We go for what we need, the players leaving put a chink in the talent level and depth though. And that is what we are seeing. Also Shyatt goes for team oriented players, the ones that leave generally are the ones who want to be a Jay Straight or Gillmore, they want to do it all themselves. If Washington is having a hard time not getting playing time right now, it is probably because he is used to always being "the guy" for his team, and right now he's not. And he is definitely not showing it on the court. Bentz has played far better when on the court, so if he shows better capability than a freshman, like any coach you'll have him play more minutes. The object is to win the game, if we were a team who could a significant lead and maintain it you would probably see Washington get more playing time, not to mention when you talk depth for this team, I would easily prefer Hankerson and Granberry coming in than Washington.
Players need to adjust to big boy basketball, we are a big school in the top of the line basketball in one of the tougher conferences. Adjust, adjust, adjust. This is not HS basketball, where you can be a one man show anymore. Adapt, adapt, adapt to your new role. It is key in growing at this level.

 

[JimmyDimes]

Bigs recruited by Shyatt:
6'10" C Leykan Ajayi (washed out)
6'8" F Tyrone Marshall (washed out)
6'7" F Larry Nance Jr.
6'9" F Staphon Blair (Signed with UCF)
6'8" F Austin Haldorson
6'10" C Matt Sellers
6'8" F Alan Herndon
6'9" C Jonathon Barnes
6'8" C Zach Braxton (Signed with Weber State)

You failed to mentioned Derek Cooke, Jr. in this list. I am not counting Ajayi as he wasn't here long enough to unpack his bags and I am not counting Barnes because he hasn't joined the program as yet. I am also not counting Blair and Braxton as neither signed with Wyoming. But this list of 6 guys, it just points out how futile and unsuccessful the recruiting of big men has been under Shyatt. ONLY 1 and I do mean ONLY one of all of these 6 guys has been a real contributor in the program! That is NOT a good track record.

Shyatt started in a big hole. The season was over, the old staff didn't do any recruiting, and half the starters left the team. Shyatt came to Wyoming with very little to work with. He took a chance on Seller's, trying to put a class together, and that hasn't panned out yet. Besides Seller's, only Halderson hasn't seen significant playing time.....but he is only a sophmore. Herndon is redshirting...as most if not all incoming recruits should do eventually. Barnes just signed his papers. Who is Tyrone Marshall....not ringing a bell.

I think many have a problem with Shyatt's philosophy. Maybe he doesn't load up on big men and likes to play a guard heavy rotation. One thing I now for sure, regardless of who is playing next year....Shyatt will have them playing good ball.

Excuses are for losers and talking about what a hole Shyatt started in is nothing more than an excuse with all due respect. I think the world of Shyatt and his coaching and the X's and O's, and I am not saying anything about that. But the recruiting is the lifeblood of a program and the program is very anemic in the big man category right now and this should not come as any surprise....I mentioned the need for another big man last year! But the coach has to give his program the players to be successful and not require kids to play over their heads constantly to be successful and that is what is going on right now. I feel with Lieberman coming in next year that Wyoming will be fine at the guard position, and they have another 6-5 kid coming in and thank heavens we have Barnes coming in....but there needs to be much more than Barnes for Wyoming to be successful.

What's this?

If you don't think Shyatt started in a bad position, then I don't know what to tell you. And, if you don't like the way Shyatt runs his program, then you probably need to talk to him. I know that in his 3 years he has taken us to a top 25 ranking (before Martinez got arrested and kicked off the team) and put us in position for a potential tourney run (before Nance got hurt...but we still have a chance) and a 3 place finish in the MWC. This just three years removed from being a cellar dweller.

 

[WYCowboy]

You can't blame Shyatt. He has recruited the "big" men. Every recruit is a potential risk of not developing the way the coach thought he would. Halderson was a top recruit out of Colorado. Shyatt has given him opportunities, and I'm not completely unconvinced he won't develop into a solid player his jr and sr year. We went after Ajayi, who was a top rated big man, and we watched his attitude completely screw his career. Sellers was a late recruit to add size, for exactly what he does now, playing in times of need. We have Herndon, who no one recruited well and he defensively stopped a top big man. And then on top of that he also recruited Cooke and Nance. I'd say he's done quite well in bringing in bigs, but all our bigs are still considered young.
This is also an average of recruiting two big men a year for Shyatt.

I'm more concerned of the lack of depth we will have at the guard spots if we lose Washington along with Sobey graduating and Granberry gone. That would be three guards gone to two incoming freshman guards. Plus if we lose Vernon that is a F we will need to replace.

"You can't blame Shyatt."....I am flabbergasted at this statement, who else is responsible for the recruiting besides the head coach? It is Coach Shyatt's responsibility to recruit depth that can go in when needed. Frankly we have NO ONE that is coming in and providing anything close to what Nance was producing. I understand about picking up the slack on the scoring side, but what about someone that could come in and give valuable minutes on the defensive end, getting rebounds, etc.....that person is NOT in the program right now, and it is not like this is a new issue, this has been 3 years in the making!

Haldorson just doesn't have the body or whatever to bang and be a presence underneath and he doesn't have the offensive game to play outside...unfortunately Haldorson has not developed an identity on either end of the floor enough to be a presence....and the kid is a sophomore, so when will that happen. Please don't tell me that an experienced coach couldn't tell pretty fast that Seller's doesn't have the physical tools to make it in the MWC! Seller's and Haldorson have never developed enough in the program, so this is why as a junior and sophomore they are permament residents of the bench. The 6-9 redshirt freshmen is a project, but he is far from having the physicality to be an impact player next year, it will take him a year or two. Cooke, plays well and then disappears on the floor, and putting Cooke at the freethrow line is an effort in futility. If it isn't a slam dunk from Cooke it really isn't happening. This is NOT negatism, it is reality!

Wyoming has a freshman big man coming in next season but on top of this Wyoming desperately needs to have a JC guy come in and take over the middle and say this is mine! If we don't have someone ready to come in next season, it will be another long season next year IMO. Nance will probably not be ready until mid season, and Cooke isn't magically going to develop an offensive game by next year, and I do not see much improvement from Haldorson or Sellers. I have a feeling (nothing to back it up) but I don't think that Seller's will be back next season and frankly, with the scholarship for the freshman that was just suspended I would be searching for a JC big man as hard as I could if I were Shyatt.

I completely agree that Haldorson needs to bulk up some, but so did Nance his first couple of years. From what I have heard (and we saw a glimpse of against CSU), Haldorson is a very good outside shooter. You haven't seen much of him this season because he has been injured - I don't know what kind of injury.

Also, in reality Shyatt has only had 2 1/2 years to recruit.

 

[NowherePoke]

Bigs recruited by Shyatt:
6'10" C Leykan Ajayi (washed out)
6'8" F Tyrone Marshall (washed out)
6'7" F Larry Nance Jr.
6'9" F Staphon Blair (Signed with UCF)
6'8" F Austin Haldorson
6'10" C Matt Sellers
6'8" F Alan Herndon
6'9" C Jonathon Barnes
6'8" C Zach Braxton (Signed with Weber State)

You failed to mentioned Derek Cooke, Jr. in this list. I am not counting Ajayi as he wasn't here long enough to unpack his bags and I am not counting Barnes because he hasn't joined the program as yet. I am also not counting Blair and Braxton as neither signed with Wyoming. But this list of 6 guys, it just points out how futile and unsuccessful the recruiting of big men has been under Shyatt. ONLY 1 and I do mean ONLY one of all of these 6 guys has been a real contributor in the program! That is NOT a good track record.

Shyatt started in a big hole. The season was over, the old staff didn't do any recruiting, and half the starters left the team. Shyatt came to Wyoming with very little to work with. He took a chance on Seller's, trying to put a class together, and that hasn't panned out yet. Besides Seller's, only Halderson hasn't seen significant playing time.....but he is only a sophmore. Herndon is redshirting...as most if not all incoming recruits should do eventually. Barnes just signed his papers. Who is Tyrone Marshall....not ringing a bell.

I think many have a problem with Shyatt's philosophy. Maybe he doesn't load up on big men and likes to play a guard heavy rotation. One thing I now for sure, regardless of who is playing next year....Shyatt will have them playing good ball.

Excuses are for losers and talking about what a hole Shyatt started in is nothing more than an excuse with all due respect. I think the world of Shyatt and his coaching and the X's and O's, and I am not saying anything about that. But the recruiting is the lifeblood of a program and the program is very anemic in the big man category right now and this should not come as any surprise....I mentioned the need for another big man last year! But the coach has to give his program the players to be successful and not require kids to play over their heads constantly to be successful and that is what is going on right now. I feel with Lieberman coming in next year that Wyoming will be fine at the guard position, and they have another 6-5 kid coming in and thank heavens we have Barnes coming in....but there needs to be much more than Barnes for Wyoming to be successful.

What's this?

If you don't think Shyatt started in a bad position, then I don't know what to tell you. And, if you don't like the way Shyatt runs his program, then you probably need to talk to him. I know that in his 3 years he has taken us to a top 25 ranking (before Martinez got arrested and kicked off the team) and put us in position for a potential tourney run (before Nance got hurt...but we still have a chance) and a 3 place finish in the MWC. This just three years removed from being a cellar dweller.

Is CBI all that you think we are capable of? Because that is all we have achieved 3 years in (assuming we get there this year). You don't get trophies for December.

We were not in a position for a potential tourney run this year, we were in a position to possibly secure an NIT bid (which would have been a solid step), but that's not going to happen either. You can't predict injuries, but you can prepare for them by building depth which we don't have. CU lost Dinwiddie to a similar injury but they are most likely going to earn an NCAA at-large bid. UNM lost Kirk for an entire year in 11-12 and won the league. McClain lost his best player to a knee injury early in the season twice (Ugo and Bailey) and finished 8-6 in the MWC both times. Not great, but as good as we were this year with Nance.

I like Shyatt, but I have no more patience left for UW athletics. Failure after failure after failure. Even in Women's BB where the MWC is as weak as it has ever been, the Cowgirls are not going to be able to win the regular season title and instead CSU and their relatively new coach (from Wyoming) will win it (even if the Cowgirls sweep the lady sheep).

It's time to start winning some MWC titles in something and competing for something relevant (NIT or minor bowl) in the revenue sports.

 

[NowherePoke]

You can't blame Shyatt. He has recruited the "big" men. Every recruit is a potential risk of not developing the way the coach thought he would. Halderson was a top recruit out of Colorado. Shyatt has given him opportunities, and I'm not completely unconvinced he won't develop into a solid player his jr and sr year. We went after Ajayi, who was a top rated big man, and we watched his attitude completely screw his career. Sellers was a late recruit to add size, for exactly what he does now, playing in times of need. We have Herndon, who no one recruited well and he defensively stopped a top big man. And then on top of that he also recruited Cooke and Nance. I'd say he's done quite well in bringing in bigs, but all our bigs are still considered young.
This is also an average of recruiting two big men a year for Shyatt.

I'm more concerned of the lack of depth we will have at the guard spots if we lose Washington along with Sobey graduating and Granberry gone. That would be three guards gone to two incoming freshman guards. Plus if we lose Vernon that is a F we will need to replace.

"You can't blame Shyatt."....I am flabbergasted at this statement, who else is responsible for the recruiting besides the head coach? It is Coach Shyatt's responsibility to recruit depth that can go in when needed. Frankly we have NO ONE that is coming in and providing anything close to what Nance was producing. I understand about picking up the slack on the scoring side, but what about someone that could come in and give valuable minutes on the defensive end, getting rebounds, etc.....that person is NOT in the program right now, and it is not like this is a new issue, this has been 3 years in the making!

Haldorson just doesn't have the body or whatever to bang and be a presence underneath and he doesn't have the offensive game to play outside...unfortunately Haldorson has not developed an identity on either end of the floor enough to be a presence....and the kid is a sophomore, so when will that happen. Please don't tell me that an experienced coach couldn't tell pretty fast that Seller's doesn't have the physical tools to make it in the MWC! Seller's and Haldorson have never developed enough in the program, so this is why as a junior and sophomore they are permament residents of the bench. The 6-9 redshirt freshmen is a project, but he is far from having the physicality to be an impact player next year, it will take him a year or two. Cooke, plays well and then disappears on the floor, and putting Cooke at the freethrow line is an effort in futility. If it isn't a slam dunk from Cooke it really isn't happening. This is NOT negatism, it is reality!

Wyoming has a freshman big man coming in next season but on top of this Wyoming desperately needs to have a JC guy come in and take over the middle and say this is mine! If we don't have someone ready to come in next season, it will be another long season next year IMO. Nance will probably not be ready until mid season, and Cooke isn't magically going to develop an offensive game by next year, and I do not see much improvement from Haldorson or Sellers. I have a feeling (nothing to back it up) but I don't think that Seller's will be back next season and frankly, with the scholarship for the freshman that was just suspended I would be searching for a JC big man as hard as I could if I were Shyatt.

I completely agree that Haldorson needs to bulk up some, but so did Nance his first couple of years. From what I have heard (and we saw a glimpse of against CSU), Haldorson is a very good outside shooter. You haven't seen much of him this season because he has been injured - I don't know what kind of injury.

Also, in reality Shyatt has only had 2 1/2 years to recruit.

Haldorson is a good shooter, just doesn't have a position. Not quick enough to play on the perimeter or strong enough to play in the frontcourt. Not sure the answer.

No comparison to Nance. Nance averaged 11/7 his sophomore year and at the end of the year was the best player (IMO) for the Pokes during this sophomore season. Nance was an impact freshman and his athleticism (remember his "Air Jordan" dunk) was apparent from the beginning. Haldorson simply lacks those physical gifts.

 

[VisorHair]

let's blame Heath for all the garbage he had during his years....lol, there's the hole we're all taking about

STILL bitching about this? For heaven's sake.. we would KILL to have his big men on our roster now.

 

[VisorHair]

Whether you want to admit it or not, the MWC is a big-man's league. There's how many elite PG's? 2? The big men are more abundant; Bairstow, Kirk, Nance, Birch, etc. It's the lack of depth not the effort in landing the one guy (Nance). Has Shy taken too big of risks in "project" players? They're all projects! That's what we continually hear. I know I'm preaching to the choir here but player development is great and all but damnit, why can't any of these guys play? Sellers STILL looks like he should be at W. Wyoming. This lack of improvement on these positions is mind-boggling. Hell SDSU doesn't have a dominant guy but they can f***** play and get up and down the court and trap!

 

[PotatoCreekPete]

Bigs recruited by Shyatt:
6'10" C Leykan Ajayi (washed out)
6'8" F Tyrone Marshall (washed out)
6'7" F Larry Nance Jr.
6'9" F Staphon Blair (Signed with UCF)
6'8" F Austin Haldorson
6'10" C Matt Sellers
6'8" F Alan Herndon
6'9" C Jonathon Barnes
6'8" C Zach Braxton (Signed with Weber State)

You failed to mentioned Derek Cooke, Jr. in this list. I am not counting Ajayi as he wasn't here long enough to unpack his bags and I am not counting Barnes because he hasn't joined the program as yet. I am also not counting Blair and Braxton as neither signed with Wyoming. But this list of 6 guys, it just points out how futile and unsuccessful the recruiting of big men has been under Shyatt. ONLY 1 and I do mean ONLY one of all of these 6 guys has been a real contributor in the program! That is NOT a good track record.

Shyatt started in a big hole. The season was over, the old staff didn't do any recruiting, and half the starters left the team. Shyatt came to Wyoming with very little to work with. He took a chance on Seller's, trying to put a class together, and that hasn't panned out yet. Besides Seller's, only Halderson hasn't seen significant playing time.....but he is only a sophmore. Herndon is redshirting...as most if not all incoming recruits should do eventually. Barnes just signed his papers. Who is Tyrone Marshall....not ringing a bell.

I think many have a problem with Shyatt's philosophy. Maybe he doesn't load up on big men and likes to play a guard heavy rotation. One thing I now for sure, regardless of who is playing next year....Shyatt will have them playing good ball.

Excuses are for losers and talking about what a hole Shyatt started in is nothing more than an excuse with all due respect. I think the world of Shyatt and his coaching and the X's and O's, and I am not saying anything about that. But the recruiting is the lifeblood of a program and the program is very anemic in the big man category right now and this should not come as any surprise....I mentioned the need for another big man last year! But the coach has to give his program the players to be successful and not require kids to play over their heads constantly to be successful and that is what is going on right now. I feel with Lieberman coming in next year that Wyoming will be fine at the guard position, and they have another 6-5 kid coming in and thank heavens we have Barnes coming in....but there needs to be much more than Barnes for Wyoming to be successful.

What's this?

If you don't think Shyatt started in a bad position, then I don't know what to tell you. And, if you don't like the way Shyatt runs his program, then you probably need to talk to him. I know that in his 3 years he has taken us to a top 25 ranking (before Martinez got arrested and kicked off the team) and put us in position for a potential tourney run (before Nance got hurt...but we still have a chance) and a 3 place finish in the MWC. This just three years removed from being a cellar dweller.

Is CBI all that you think we are capable of? Because that is all we have achieved 3 years in (assuming we get there this year). You don't get trophies for December.

We were not in a position for a potential tourney run this year, we were in a position to possibly secure an NIT bid (which would have been a solid step), but that's not going to happen either. You can't predict injuries, but you can prepare for them by building depth which we don't have. CU lost Dinwiddie to a similar injury but they are most likely going to earn an NCAA at-large bid. UNM lost Kirk for an entire year in 11-12 and won the league. McClain lost his best player to a knee injury early in the season twice (Ugo and Bailey) and finished 8-6 in the MWC both times. Not great, but as good as we were this year with Nance.

I like Shyatt, but I have no more patience left for UW athletics. Failure after failure after failure. Even in Women's BB where the MWC is as weak as it has ever been, the Cowgirls are not going to be able to win the regular season title and instead CSU and their relatively new coach (from Wyoming) will win it (even if the Cowgirls sweep the lady sheep).

It's time to start winning some MWC titles in something and competing for something relevant (NIT or minor bowl) in the revenue sports.

VERY WELL PUT!

If you set your expectations low like the CBI that is all that you will get. Other coaches prepare for things not always going well, like injuries and when they happen they still win. At Wyoming, when the injuries happen we DO NOT HAVE THE DEPTH and we lose and then all we hear is "woe is us", and "boy what a bad break" and "we will get them next year".....not if Shyatt doesn't recruit and develop more depth!

As long as we have fans that expect nothing more than our guys playing hard and ignore and excuse away losing then we won't ever win. I am tired of losing and watching other programs win, but it doesn't appear that some in our fan base care even that much. It does sound like Bohl is different and I am hoping and praying that we see the first MWC championship with football in years and years!

 

[JimmyDimes]

Whether you want to admit it or not, the MWC is a big-man's league. There's how many elite PG's? 2? The big men are more abundant; Bairstow, Kirk, Nance, Birch, etc. It's the lack of depth not the effort in landing the one guy (Nance). Has Shy taken too big of risks in "project" players? They're all projects! That's what we continually hear. I know I'm preaching to the choir here but player development is great and all but damnit, why can't any of these guys play? Sellers STILL looks like he should be at W. Wyoming. This lack of improvement on these positions is mind-boggling. Hell SDSU doesn't have a dominant guy but they can f***** play and get up and down the court and trap!

I think Seller's was a reach and hasn't developed as planned. Who else? Cooke is playing much better this year. Nance was all conference, Sobey has improved a ton, Grabau...what can I say, Adams too. Haldorson has been hurt, but is only a sophomore. Two players who Shyatt thought could use a redshirt year are getting a redshirt year. Shyatt develops players and will get Haldorson up to speed....besides Seller's, he has shown the least amount of improvement.

We need to remember he is building from the ground up and is not plugging a bunch of transfers in to the mix.

ps. We just beat SDSU a week ago.

 

[JimmyDimes]

Bigs recruited by Shyatt:
6'10" C Leykan Ajayi (washed out)
6'8" F Tyrone Marshall (washed out)
6'7" F Larry Nance Jr.
6'9" F Staphon Blair (Signed with UCF)
6'8" F Austin Haldorson
6'10" C Matt Sellers
6'8" F Alan Herndon
6'9" C Jonathon Barnes
6'8" C Zach Braxton (Signed with Weber State)

You failed to mentioned Derek Cooke, Jr. in this list. I am not counting Ajayi as he wasn't here long enough to unpack his bags and I am not counting Barnes because he hasn't joined the program as yet. I am also not counting Blair and Braxton as neither signed with Wyoming. But this list of 6 guys, it just points out how futile and unsuccessful the recruiting of big men has been under Shyatt. ONLY 1 and I do mean ONLY one of all of these 6 guys has been a real contributor in the program! That is NOT a good track record.

Shyatt started in a big hole. The season was over, the old staff didn't do any recruiting, and half the starters left the team. Shyatt came to Wyoming with very little to work with. He took a chance on Seller's, trying to put a class together, and that hasn't panned out yet. Besides Seller's, only Halderson hasn't seen significant playing time.....but he is only a sophmore. Herndon is redshirting...as most if not all incoming recruits should do eventually. Barnes just signed his papers. Who is Tyrone Marshall....not ringing a bell.

I think many have a problem with Shyatt's philosophy. Maybe he doesn't load up on big men and likes to play a guard heavy rotation. One thing I now for sure, regardless of who is playing next year....Shyatt will have them playing good ball.

Excuses are for losers and talking about what a hole Shyatt started in is nothing more than an excuse with all due respect. I think the world of Shyatt and his coaching and the X's and O's, and I am not saying anything about that. But the recruiting is the lifeblood of a program and the program is very anemic in the big man category right now and this should not come as any surprise....I mentioned the need for another big man last year! But the coach has to give his program the players to be successful and not require kids to play over their heads constantly to be successful and that is what is going on right now. I feel with Lieberman coming in next year that Wyoming will be fine at the guard position, and they have another 6-5 kid coming in and thank heavens we have Barnes coming in....but there needs to be much more than Barnes for Wyoming to be successful.

What's this?

If you don't think Shyatt started in a bad position, then I don't know what to tell you. And, if you don't like the way Shyatt runs his program, then you probably need to talk to him. I know that in his 3 years he has taken us to a top 25 ranking (before Martinez got arrested and kicked off the team) and put us in position for a potential tourney run (before Nance got hurt...but we still have a chance) and a 3 place finish in the MWC. This just three years removed from being a cellar dweller.

Is CBI all that you think we are capable of? Because that is all we have achieved 3 years in (assuming we get there this year). You don't get trophies for December.

We were not in a position for a potential tourney run this year, we were in a position to possibly secure an NIT bid (which would have been a solid step), but that's not going to happen either. You can't predict injuries, but you can prepare for them by building depth which we don't have. CU lost Dinwiddie to a similar injury but they are most likely going to earn an NCAA at-large bid. UNM lost Kirk for an entire year in 11-12 and won the league. McClain lost his best player to a knee injury early in the season twice (Ugo and Bailey) and finished 8-6 in the MWC both times. Not great, but as good as we were this year with Nance.

I like Shyatt, but I have no more patience left for UW athletics. Failure after failure after failure. Even in Women's BB where the MWC is as weak as it has ever been, the Cowgirls are not going to be able to win the regular season title and instead CSU and their relatively new coach (from Wyoming) will win it (even if the Cowgirls sweep the lady sheep).

It's time to start winning some MWC titles in something and competing for something relevant (NIT or minor bowl) in the revenue sports.

VERY WELL PUT!

If you set your expectations low like the CBI that is all that you will get. Other coaches prepare for things not always going well, like injuries and when they happen they still win. At Wyoming, when the injuries happen we DO NOT HAVE THE DEPTH and we lose and then all we hear is "woe is us", and "boy what a bad break" and "we will get them next year".....not if Shyatt doesn't recruit and develop more depth!

As long as we have fans that expect nothing more than our guys playing hard and ignore and excuse away losing then we won't ever win. I am tired of losing and watching other programs win, but it doesn't appear that some in our fan base care even that much. It does sound like Bohl is different and I am hoping and praying that we see the first MWC championship with football in years and years!

Who is making excuses? And who is content with the CBI? Do you not agree that the Pokes had a chance to win the MWC tourney the way they were playing before Nance went down. What about next year? Rome wasn't built overnight and neither is a solid college basketball program. Shyatt isn't building a team to win the freaking CBI, he is building teams to go deep in the dance.

 

[kansasCowboy]

let's blame Heath for all the garbage he had during his years....lol, there's the hole we're all taking about

STILL bitching about this? For heaven's sake.. we would KILL to have his big men on our roster now.

What, Waddell? Who else did we have that amounted to anything? Waddell was coming to WYO regardless of being recruited. He would've walked on if he had to.

The key to the argument is simple, we are young in our depth, and players leaving early are distinct in creating this issue. Jackson, AJ Davis, M'Baye and several bench players leaving when Shyatt came in created this gap of being a young team. We were left with Len. Washington and Waddell as big men. Lucky for us Washington came to play. Kind of the opposite and issue I have with Hankerson.
A player choosing to leave is not on the coach. I'm pretty sure Shyatt doesn't just give a Scholly only a year later to say ," Eh, never mind. We really don't care if your here or not."
If you want to blame a coach for this you are fooling yourself. Besides at least Shyatt goes after kids with talent that other big schools want as well. We never saw that with Schroyer. And he also doesn't go after guys that have attitude issues, and if they gain one while here (Shakir, Ajayi) they are weeded out for players who truly want to be here and play team ball. I will always prefer a Grabau or Adams recruit over a Jackson recruit. Jackson had huge talent in HS but was not being looked at by bigger schools due to his academics and attitude.
Earlier this year I struggled to see Shyatt producing, but now in 2 and 3/4 of seasons I see us on track to start making noise. Going from 20-42 two years prior and being left with practically nothing since all of our go to players decided to transfer, starting at 21-12 and 20-14 ( with another player issue) being at 17-9 (before losing Nance) and making waves in the conference race this year, I'd say we are on track to do some good things in the coming years. This might be Shyatts worst record this year, but had we not lost our best player, who knows where we would've finished. But I will call it three successful seasons in a row coming from the Schroyer and players leaving debacle.
No, I do not hope for CBI tourney appearances only, but I do see where we have come from in an extremely short time frame.

Call it what you will, but I see an upward trend in this program. This years team may be the worst when it comes down to the wins and losses, but it was good enough to be a #5 SDSU and to keep itself in every other loss with the exception of #3 Ohio St. (15 pts) and CSU (15pts, fresh off Nance injury). Shyatt has always had us competitive, regardless of who we play. Something we never saw with Schroyer and supposed better big men and recruits (hence 35 pt losses to SDSU, UNLV, UCLA and the like.) not to mention our head coach was out two games as well, went 1-1 in those. We are at the cusp of being that great team.

 

[NowherePoke]

Whether you want to admit it or not, the MWC is a big-man's league. There's how many elite PG's? 2? The big men are more abundant; Bairstow, Kirk, Nance, Birch, etc. It's the lack of depth not the effort in landing the one guy (Nance). Has Shy taken too big of risks in "project" players? They're all projects! That's what we continually hear. I know I'm preaching to the choir here but player development is great and all but damnit, why can't any of these guys play? Sellers STILL looks like he should be at W. Wyoming. This lack of improvement on these positions is mind-boggling. Hell SDSU doesn't have a dominant guy but they can f***** play and get up and down the court and trap!

I think Seller's was a reach and hasn't developed as planned. Who else? Cooke is playing much better this year. Nance was all conference, Sobey has improved a ton, Grabau...what can I say, Adams too. Haldorson has been hurt, but is only a sophomore. Two players who Shyatt thought could use a redshirt year are getting a redshirt year. Shyatt develops players and will get Haldorson up to speed....besides Seller's, he has shown the least amount of improvement.

We need to remember he is building from the ground up and is not plugging a bunch of transfers in to the mix.

ps. We just beat SDSU a week ago.

4 of our top 6 players now with Nance out are transfers (2 JC, 2 D-1)

 

[NowherePoke]

Bigs recruited by Shyatt:
6'10" C Leykan Ajayi (washed out)
6'8" F Tyrone Marshall (washed out)
6'7" F Larry Nance Jr.
6'9" F Staphon Blair (Signed with UCF)
6'8" F Austin Haldorson
6'10" C Matt Sellers
6'8" F Alan Herndon
6'9" C Jonathon Barnes
6'8" C Zach Braxton (Signed with Weber State)

You failed to mentioned Derek Cooke, Jr. in this list. I am not counting Ajayi as he wasn't here long enough to unpack his bags and I am not counting Barnes because he hasn't joined the program as yet. I am also not counting Blair and Braxton as neither signed with Wyoming. But this list of 6 guys, it just points out how futile and unsuccessful the recruiting of big men has been under Shyatt. ONLY 1 and I do mean ONLY one of all of these 6 guys has been a real contributor in the program! That is NOT a good track record.

Shyatt started in a big hole. The season was over, the old staff didn't do any recruiting, and half the starters left the team. Shyatt came to Wyoming with very little to work with. He took a chance on Seller's, trying to put a class together, and that hasn't panned out yet. Besides Seller's, only Halderson hasn't seen significant playing time.....but he is only a sophmore. Herndon is redshirting...as most if not all incoming recruits should do eventually. Barnes just signed his papers. Who is Tyrone Marshall....not ringing a bell.

I think many have a problem with Shyatt's philosophy. Maybe he doesn't load up on big men and likes to play a guard heavy rotation. One thing I now for sure, regardless of who is playing next year....Shyatt will have them playing good ball.

Excuses are for losers and talking about what a hole Shyatt started in is nothing more than an excuse with all due respect. I think the world of Shyatt and his coaching and the X's and O's, and I am not saying anything about that. But the recruiting is the lifeblood of a program and the program is very anemic in the big man category right now and this should not come as any surprise....I mentioned the need for another big man last year! But the coach has to give his program the players to be successful and not require kids to play over their heads constantly to be successful and that is what is going on right now. I feel with Lieberman coming in next year that Wyoming will be fine at the guard position, and they have another 6-5 kid coming in and thank heavens we have Barnes coming in....but there needs to be much more than Barnes for Wyoming to be successful.

What's this?

If you don't think Shyatt started in a bad position, then I don't know what to tell you. And, if you don't like the way Shyatt runs his program, then you probably need to talk to him. I know that in his 3 years he has taken us to a top 25 ranking (before Martinez got arrested and kicked off the team) and put us in position for a potential tourney run (before Nance got hurt...but we still have a chance) and a 3 place finish in the MWC. This just three years removed from being a cellar dweller.

Is CBI all that you think we are capable of? Because that is all we have achieved 3 years in (assuming we get there this year). You don't get trophies for December.

We were not in a position for a potential tourney run this year, we were in a position to possibly secure an NIT bid (which would have been a solid step), but that's not going to happen either. You can't predict injuries, but you can prepare for them by building depth which we don't have. CU lost Dinwiddie to a similar injury but they are most likely going to earn an NCAA at-large bid. UNM lost Kirk for an entire year in 11-12 and won the league. McClain lost his best player to a knee injury early in the season twice (Ugo and Bailey) and finished 8-6 in the MWC both times. Not great, but as good as we were this year with Nance.

I like Shyatt, but I have no more patience left for UW athletics. Failure after failure after failure. Even in Women's BB where the MWC is as weak as it has ever been, the Cowgirls are not going to be able to win the regular season title and instead CSU and their relatively new coach (from Wyoming) will win it (even if the Cowgirls sweep the lady sheep).

It's time to start winning some MWC titles in something and competing for something relevant (NIT or minor bowl) in the revenue sports.

VERY WELL PUT!

If you set your expectations low like the CBI that is all that you will get. Other coaches prepare for things not always going well, like injuries and when they happen they still win. At Wyoming, when the injuries happen we DO NOT HAVE THE DEPTH and we lose and then all we hear is "woe is us", and "boy what a bad break" and "we will get them next year".....not if Shyatt doesn't recruit and develop more depth!

As long as we have fans that expect nothing more than our guys playing hard and ignore and excuse away losing then we won't ever win. I am tired of losing and watching other programs win, but it doesn't appear that some in our fan base care even that much. It does sound like Bohl is different and I am hoping and praying that we see the first MWC championship with football in years and years!

I would temper expectations for FB for a while. For whatever frustrations we have in hoops, we are a hell of a lot closer to competing in BB than we are in FB right now. The weak schedule last year masked just how bad a product DC was putting out there. It's a long road from here.

 

[NowherePoke]

let's blame Heath for all the garbage he had during his years....lol, there's the hole we're all taking about

STILL bitching about this? For heaven's sake.. we would KILL to have his big men on our roster now.

Not sure about that. Schroyer really struggled to recruit big men as well (he had a lot of struggles including coaching, motivation, and not being a complete asshole, but we all have challenges I suppose....). He recruited some decent 4 men, but not much bulk in the interior. Waddell was a McClain recruit. Thiam and Mbaye would be productive if they could play alongside a more effective interior force (basically Cooke's role just a little more advanced) but in Mbaye's case he shared Schroyer's struggle with not being a complete asshole so not sure having him on the team would be a positive.

Anyone remember Mikhail Linskens?

 

[NowherePoke]

let's blame Heath for all the garbage he had during his years....lol, there's the hole we're all taking about

STILL bitching about this? For heaven's sake.. we would KILL to have his big men on our roster now.

What, Waddell? Who else did we have that amounted to anything? Waddell was coming to WYO regardless of being recruited. He would've walked on if he had to.

The key to the argument is simple, we are young in our depth, and players leaving early are distinct in creating this issue. Jackson, AJ Davis, M'Baye and several bench players leaving when Shyatt came in created this gap of being a young team. We were left with Len. Washington and Waddell as big men. Lucky for us Washington came to play. Kind of the opposite and issue I have with Hankerson.
A player choosing to leave is not on the coach. I'm pretty sure Shyatt doesn't just give a Scholly only a year later to say ," Eh, never mind. We really don't care if your here or not."
If you want to blame a coach for this you are fooling yourself. Besides at least Shyatt goes after kids with talent that other big schools want as well. We never saw that with Schroyer. And he also doesn't go after guys that have attitude issues, and if they gain one while here (Shakir, Ajayi) they are weeded out for players who truly want to be here and play team ball. I will always prefer a Grabau or Adams recruit over a Jackson recruit. Jackson had huge talent in HS but was not being looked at by bigger schools due to his academics and attitude.
Earlier this year I struggled to see Shyatt producing, but now in 2 and 3/4 of seasons I see us on track to start making noise. Going from 20-42 two years prior and being left with practically nothing since all of our go to players decided to transfer, starting at 21-12 and 20-14 ( with another player issue) being at 17-9 (before losing Nance) and making waves in the conference race this year, I'd say we are on track to do some good things in the coming years. This might be Shyatts worst record this year, but had we not lost our best player, who knows where we would've finished. But I will call it three successful seasons in a row coming from the Schroyer and players leaving debacle.
No, I do not hope for CBI tourney appearances only, but I do see where we have come from in an extremely short time frame.

Call it what you will, but I see an upward trend in this program. This years team may be the worst when it comes down to the wins and losses, but it was good enough to be a #5 SDSU and to keep itself in every other loss with the exception of #3 Ohio St. (15 pts) and CSU (15pts, fresh off Nance injury). Shyatt has always had us competitive, regardless of who we play. Something we never saw with Schroyer and supposed better big men and recruits (hence 35 pt losses to SDSU, UNLV, UCLA and the like.) not to mention our head coach was out two games as well, went 1-1 in those. We are at the cusp of being that great team.

Shyatt>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>Schroyer and we all agree on that I think. I am just disapointed that we can't take the next step to challenge for a NCAA bid or some type of relevance. I also fear that the Nance injury robbed us of an excellent opportunity to do so as next year we would have had 4 starters coming back and 6 of our top 8 with 4 projected senior starters from a team that challenged for a Top 4 conference finish and a NIT berth. That's a recipe for success. It's unrealistic to expect us to replace Nance without a beat but if we had even marginal contributors as depth in the frontcourt we could still be a salty team next year. Unfortunately we don't have that and it feels like opportunity wasted.

 

[kansasCowboy]

Any time you have a big blow to your team you will feel like it was an opportunity wasted. Let's see what Halderson, Cooke and even Sellers can do from here on out, they each will be gaining viable experience, to which it may not help this year but will help each of these three progress for next year.

 

[Wyolie Coyote]

let's blame Heath for all the garbage he had during his years....lol, there's the hole we're all taking about

STILL bitching about this? For heaven's sake.. we would KILL to have his big men on our roster now.

Not sure about that. Schroyer really struggled to recruit big men as well (he had a lot of struggles including coaching, motivation, and not being a complete asshole, but we all have challenges I suppose....). He recruited some decent 4 men, but not much bulk in the interior. Waddell was a McClain recruit. Thiam and Mbaye would be productive if they could play alongside a more effective interior force (basically Cooke's role just a little more advanced) but in Mbaye's case he shared Schroyer's struggle with not being a complete asshole so not sure having him on the team would be a positive.

Anyone remember Mikhail Linskens?

Or Boubacar Sylla?!

 

[VisorHair]

let's blame Heath for all the garbage he had during his years....lol, there's the hole we're all taking about

STILL bitching about this? For heaven's sake.. we would KILL to have his big men on our roster now.

Not sure about that. Schroyer really struggled to recruit big men as well (he had a lot of struggles including coaching, motivation, and not being a complete asshole, but we all have challenges I suppose....). He recruited some decent 4 men, but not much bulk in the interior. Waddell was a McClain recruit. Thiam and Mbaye would be productive if they could play alongside a more effective interior force (basically Cooke's role just a little more advanced) but in Mbaye's case he shared Schroyer's struggle with not being a complete asshole so not sure having him on the team would be a positive.

Anyone remember Mikhail Linskens?

Thiam and Amath would thrive in this system! Reference: Amath at OU under Kruger (defense centered). Hell if we could get another Leonard (talent-wise not attitude). The talent was obvious, maybe you all forget bc of the character.