17K

[LanderPoke]

It is hard to estimate what the piss poor offense does to attendance. It sucks the life out of everything. No one thought we were going to be competitive in that game . It it such a drag. If we had an offense at least people would have believed we had a puncher’s chance. 9 years takes a toll

 

[307bball]

This is dumb... Saying fans should be ashamed?... They are entitled? Any blame for attendance problems, outside of weather and low population base to draw from, lies with the people that run the program.... And even given all that... Nothing is going to get a cowboy fan to check out faster than some holier-than-thou take that fans are somehow to blame for the programs woes. Sorry...I don't owe the athletic department a red cent of my $$ or a single second of my time.

I've heard Saban and Lane Kiffen complain about fan support and it's just as dumb as complaining about it in Laramie. And they are actually putting a product on the field that is compelling.

 

[ragtimejoe1]

It is hard to estimate what the piss poor offense does to attendance. It sucks the life out of everything. No one thought we were going to be competitive in that game . It it such a drag. If we had an offense at least people would have believed we had a puncher’s chance. 9 years takes a toll

I honestly don't know. How many times was attendance above 25k in 9 years? Maybe that takes a toll too.

There is a reason multiple coaches fail.

 

[ragtimejoe1]

This is dumb... Saying fans should be ashamed?... They are entitled? Any blame for attendance problems, outside of weather and low population base to draw from, lies with the people that run the program.... And even given all that... Nothing is going to get a cowboy fan to check out faster than some holier-than-thou take that fans are somehow to blame for the programs woes. Sorry...I don't owe the athletic department a red cent of my $$ or a single second of my time.

I've heard Saban and Lane Kiffen complain about fan support and it's just as dumb as complaining about it in Laramie. And they are actually putting a product on the field that is compelling.

You want to be big time, be big time. If I get time I'll go back and look at bsu's attendance prior to their rise. I'll also go look at past conference championship teams and their attendance.

The systemic issues at WYO aren't all insitutional.

 

[PokeTransplant]

Excuses are like assholes....everyone has one.

Until Bohl can recruit a real QB to run the offense he has decreed, this program will NEVER sniff a conference championship. Josh was the closest we ever got, but even he was hamstrung by play calling and recognition of his skill set. We currently do not have a D1 QB on the roster, much less a developmental QB in the wings. I've never seen a group of QBs that cannot touch throw anything within 10 yards much less throw anything accurate down field...including Josh during our "good" years....

We have seen it year after year. Good D that excels during the early part of the season, just to throw in the towel when they get nothing from the other side of the ball...game after game.....

For you "Bohl Game" apologist that are happy with the occasional 7-5 season...I'm happy that you are happy. I'm not.....

 

[Subcanis]

Perhaps people can’t justify the hundreds of dollars on tickets/gas/hotel/concessions, time, travel/weather logistics, etc to watch half an offense that the rest of system may or may not be able to make up for on any Saturday. Also, I feel like the game day experience in Laramie has been largely stagnant, dare I say regressive, for the last decade.

 

[307bball]

This is dumb... Saying fans should be ashamed?... They are entitled? Any blame for attendance problems, outside of weather and low population base to draw from, lies with the people that run the program.... And even given all that... Nothing is going to get a cowboy fan to check out faster than some holier-than-thou take that fans are somehow to blame for the programs woes. Sorry...I don't owe the athletic department a red cent of my $$ or a single second of my time.

I've heard Saban and Lane Kiffen complain about fan support and it's just as dumb as complaining about it in Laramie. And they are actually putting a product on the field that is compelling.

You want to be big time, be big time. If I get time I'll go back and look at bsu's attendance prior to their rise. I'll also go look at past conference championship teams and their attendance.

The systemic issues at WYO aren't all insitutional.

What some conference champion program averaged for attendance, or Boise States attendance is irrelevant. I happen to agree that there is a relationship between success and fan support that is nuanced and difficult to assign what causes what.

I'm taking issue with the assignment of shame to fans that may or may not attend a pivotal game late in the season, and calling Wyoming fans entitled is quite the stretch.

 

[evilpoke]

17k is not an acceptable number for a game that could have clinched the division.

I do wonder how many people bought tickets and didn't go.

 

[WyomingAgJ]

If you want bigger attendance, then you have to increase the enrollment of the school. More enrollment, means more students there, means more alumni that are graduating, which gets bigger attendance. That's the only lasting way to fix it. Discounted tickets, advertising, special events, etc all just help for one game. The only way to consistently get better attendance is to have more fans and the only way to have more fans is to have more students and more alumni. Sure winning would help that would get some amount of casual fans, having a more exciting offense would help that would get some more casual fans, but again both of those are temporary solutions for maybe a few games or a season. The only permanent way is to increase enrollment

Boise state enrollment for fall 2022 was 26k, Wyoming enrollment was 11k. They graduate approximately 2.5x alumni every year. Compound that over 20 years.

 

[evilpoke]

If you want bigger attendance, then you have to increase the enrollment of the school. More enrollment, means more students there, means more alumni that are graduating, which gets bigger attendance. That's the only lasting way to fix it. Discounted tickets, advertising, special events, etc all just help for one game. The only way to consistently get better attendance is to have more fans and the only way to have more fans is to have more students and more alumni. Sure winning would help that would get some amount of casual fans, having a more exciting offense would help that would get some more casual fans, but again both of those are temporary solutions for maybe a few games or a season. The only permanent way is to increase enrollment

Boise state enrollment for fall 2022 was 26k, Wyoming enrollment was 11k. They graduate approximately 2.5x alumni every year. Compound that over 20 years.

Good point. Seems like the enrollment has been stagnant for 20+ years (or more)

 

[OrediggerPoke]

If you want bigger attendance, then you have to increase the enrollment of the school. More enrollment, means more students there, means more alumni that are graduating, which gets bigger attendance. That's the only lasting way to fix it. Discounted tickets, advertising, special events, etc all just help for one game. The only way to consistently get better attendance is to have more fans and the only way to have more fans is to have more students and more alumni. Sure winning would help that would get some amount of casual fans, having a more exciting offense would help that would get some more casual fans, but again both of those are temporary solutions for maybe a few games or a season. The only permanent way is to increase enrollment

Boise state enrollment for fall 2022 was 26k, Wyoming enrollment was 11k. They graduate approximately 2.5x alumni every year. Compound that over 20 years.

Good point. Seems like the enrollment has been stagnant for 20+ years (or more)

It has actually been declining for the past few years. So the University has further lowered its undergraduate standards (not that they were high to begin with) and has instituted 'Saddle Up' which is aimed at retaining undergraduate students.

 

[307bball]

Good point. Seems like the enrollment has been stagnant for 20+ years (or more)

It has actually been declining for the past few years. So the University has further lowered its undergraduate standards (not that they were high to begin with) and has instituted 'Saddle Up' which is aimed at retaining undergraduate students.

Yikes...did not know that. I think it's pretty safe to say that the barrier to consistent high football attendance has multiple causes and fan "entitlement" is not on that list.

 

[OrediggerPoke]

It has actually been declining for the past few years. So the University has further lowered its undergraduate standards (not that they were high to begin with) and has instituted 'Saddle Up' which is aimed at retaining undergraduate students.

Yikes...did not know that. I think it's pretty safe to say that the barrier to consistent high football attendance has multiple causes and fan "entitlement" is not on that list.

Here is the recent Saddle Up article. Keeping students at the University (and not failing out) is a matter of revenue. Hopefully there won't be pressure on faculty to ensure that every student 'passes' classes but I wouldn't be shocked if that is the next move.

https://trib.com/news/state-and-regional/govt-and-politics/education/uw-s-saddle-up-program-to-return-next-year-with-modifications/article_b5562742-6ced-11ed-91b7-57c7ce7942e4.html

 

[ragtimejoe1]

Seems the entitlement phrase is unpopular. Definition: believing oneself to be inherently deserving of privileges or special treatment.

WYO fans scream about championships and mediocrity but don't show up when a conference championship is on the line. Fans can acknowledge why attendance is a challenge as it relates to them yet fail to see that these challenges are some of the same things that make recruiting hard. The state spends more money (than many peer institutions) on UW to keep it a competitive university and also field athletic teams. Maybe entitled isn't exactly correct but it's damn sure borderline.

Regarding the Bohl apologist. Far from it. I hate his crap offense and inaccessibility to the program. I'm wondering what peer institution we'd like to replicate? Maybe usu? 1 chip in Bohl's time and 1 division if I remember correctly. Rest of the seasons are pretty similar albeit somewhat better.

I guess the point being we're a small time program. Is what it is. There are factors, including fan support, that appear to keep us largely non-competative against the top end of the conference. A new coach could do better but odds are better we end up like csu or unm. Fans, coaches, AD, university, factors beyond control, etc. all contribute to mediocrity. Changing 1 rarely fixes the problem unless you get lucky.

 

[307bball]

Seems the entitlement phrase is unpopular. Definition: believing oneself to be inherently deserving of privileges or special treatment.

WYO fans scream about championships and mediocrity but don't show up when a conference championship is on the line. Fans can acknowledge why attendance is a challenge as it relates to them yet fail to see that these challenges are some of the same things that make recruiting hard. The state spends more money (than many peer institutions) on UW to keep it a competitive university and also field athletic teams. Maybe entitled isn't exactly correct but it's damn sure borderline.

Regarding the Bohl apologist. Far from it. I hate his crap offense and inaccessibility to the program. I'm wondering what peer institution we'd like to replicate? Maybe usu? 1 chip in Bohl's time and 1 division if I remember correctly. Rest of the seasons are pretty similar albeit somewhat better.

I guess the point being we're a small time program. Is what it is. There are factors, including fan support, that appear to keep us largely non-competative against the top end of the conference. A new coach could do better but odds are better we end up like csu or unm. Fans, coaches, AD, university, factors beyond control, etc. all contribute to mediocrity. Changing 1 rarely fixes the problem unless you get lucky.

I think that we (the forum-dwellers) scream about championships but I don't think that pressure exists in the fanbase at-large. Others have pointed out that fan-bases everywhere are largely casual and that is true of our fan base as well. I don't know the definition of fan-base but it probably correlates pretty tightly to the general population base of wherever a school is located. BSU has the benefit of a metro area that has just over 3/4 of a million people. That is more people than live in our entire state.

The last time an actual championship was on the line at the war was a late kickoff in bitterly cold conditions and over 24k attended that one....that compares favorably to the next three championship games held in Boise that were attended by 24,515, 23,662, and 23,561 respectively.

 

[LanderPoke]

Good point. Seems like the enrollment has been stagnant for 20+ years (or more)

It has actually been declining for the past few years. So the University has further lowered its undergraduate standards (not that they were high to begin with) and has instituted 'Saddle Up' which is aimed at retaining undergraduate students.

Enrollment is up this year YOY.



Anyway, IIRC we just set an attendance record pre covid. Under Bohl, attendance has never been better, so some facts are needed in this discussion. Someone bring in some actual numbers!!!

 

[OrediggerPoke]

It has actually been declining for the past few years. So the University has further lowered its undergraduate standards (not that they were high to begin with) and has instituted 'Saddle Up' which is aimed at retaining undergraduate students.

Enrollment is up this year YOY.



Anyway, IIRC we just set an attendance record pre covid. Under Bohl, attendance has never been better, so some facts are needed in this discussion. Someone bring in some actual numbers!!!

Yes, you are correct and I was mistaken. Enrollment was down the previous 2 years but was up this year with one of the bigger incoming freshman classes.

 

[evilpoke]

Seems the entitlement phrase is unpopular. Definition: believing oneself to be inherently deserving of privileges or special treatment.

WYO fans scream about championships and mediocrity but don't show up when a conference championship is on the line. Fans can acknowledge why attendance is a challenge as it relates to them yet fail to see that these challenges are some of the same things that make recruiting hard. The state spends more money (than many peer institutions) on UW to keep it a competitive university and also field athletic teams. Maybe entitled isn't exactly correct but it's damn sure borderline.

Regarding the Bohl apologist. Far from it. I hate his crap offense and inaccessibility to the program. I'm wondering what peer institution we'd like to replicate? Maybe usu? 1 chip in Bohl's time and 1 division if I remember correctly. Rest of the seasons are pretty similar albeit somewhat better.

I guess the point being we're a small time program. Is what it is. There are factors, including fan support, that appear to keep us largely non-competative against the top end of the conference. A new coach could do better but odds are better we end up like csu or unm. Fans, coaches, AD, university, factors beyond control, etc. all contribute to mediocrity. Changing 1 rarely fixes the problem unless you get lucky.

I think that we (the forum-dwellers) scream about championships but I don't think that pressure exists in the fanbase at-large. Others have pointed out that fan-bases everywhere are largely casual and that is true of our fan base as well. I don't know the definition of fan-base but it probably correlates pretty tightly to the general population base of wherever a school is located. BSU has the benefit of a metro area that has just over 3/4 of a million people. That is more people than live in our entire state.

The last time an actual championship was on the line at the war was a late kickoff in bitterly cold conditions and over 24k attended that one....that compares favorably to the next three championship games held in Boise that were attended by 24,515, 23,662, and 23,561 respectively.

Wait a minute ... Are those facts? Facts on a sports message board? I'm going to have to alert the board moderator about this ... Lol

 

[Outlaw Arthur Morgan]

If you want bigger attendance, then you have to increase the enrollment of the school. More enrollment, means more students there, means more alumni that are graduating, which gets bigger attendance. That's the only lasting way to fix it. Discounted tickets, advertising, special events, etc all just help for one game. The only way to consistently get better attendance is to have more fans and the only way to have more fans is to have more students and more alumni. Sure winning would help that would get some amount of casual fans, having a more exciting offense would help that would get some more casual fans, but again both of those are temporary solutions for maybe a few games or a season. The only permanent way is to increase enrollment

Boise state enrollment for fall 2022 was 26k, Wyoming enrollment was 11k. They graduate approximately 2.5x alumni every year. Compound that over 20 years.

Good point. Seems like the enrollment has been stagnant for 20+ years (or more)

Don't forget that Laramie itself is facing 2500 single family home shortage by 2025. The council has been working on it, but it looks more like more of a talking point than anything that they are taking action on. There was a decent addition of MDU's about 10 years ago, but that has stagnated as well.

The last 5 years or so, I've felt like the athletics has treated me more as a revenue generating unit than a once passionate fan that is slowly on his way to apathy. The game day experience has turned into a giant bombardment of advertising everywhere. And I'm paying with time and money to see those ads.

Even simple things like "Names on Jersey's" for when the unknown 3rd stringer is in, I can quickly make that association. Instead, I have to print out a roster, purchase one for like $5/6, or waste time fiddling on my phone to figure out who it is.

I've brought this up with the athletics department. It's just going to get worse and now its just not an enjoyable experience. Now the only thing left is to vote with my time and my money.

I'll watch the bowl game, and that will probably be my last game*. I have alot of other things to do besides being pissed off, stumped, frustrated, bored, and the other wide range of emotions that I've now associated with wyo football.

* I could change my mind, but there are only so many times I can poke myself in the eye with a sharp stick and then be happy when the pain goes away.

 

[LanderPoke]

Good point. Seems like the enrollment has been stagnant for 20+ years (or more)

Don't forget that Laramie itself is facing 2500 single family home shortage by 2025. The council has been working on it, but it looks more like more of a talking point than anything that they are taking action on. There was a decent addition of MDU's about 10 years ago, but that has stagnated as well.

The last 5 years or so, I've felt like the athletics has treated me more as a revenue generating unit than a once passionate fan that is slowly on his way to apathy. The game day experience has turned into a giant bombardment of advertising everywhere. And I'm paying with time and money to see those ads.

Even simple things like "Names on Jersey's" for when the unknown 3rd stringer is in, I can quickly make that association. Instead, I have to print out a roster, purchase one for like $5/6, or waste time fiddling on my phone to figure out who it is.

I've brought this up with the athletics department. It's just going to get worse and now its just not an enjoyable experience. Now the only thing left is to vote with my time and my money.

I'll watch the bowl game, and that will probably be my last game*. I have alot of other things to do besides being pissed off, stumped, frustrated, bored, and the other wide range of emotions that I've now associated with wyo football.

* I could change my mind, but there are only so many times I can poke myself in the eye with a sharp stick and then be happy when the pain goes away.

If the Laramie city council were serious about fixing the housing shortage they wouldn't have passed a rental housing act that makes it more expensive for renters. They would cut red tape and make it easier to build . Screw the city council and the county commissioners. A bunch of leftist idiots


And, yes, the ads are out of control. Programs are $6 and they can't even make the internet work at games. Let the damn band play! Enough with the stupid DJ dance party crap. Don't wanna hear Lizzo! Please can we develop and cherish our traditions?? Let's do the damn W-Y-O Cheer in the first half when our team needs a boost.