Seems he has at least one more year...but things don't seem to be improving. I appreciate that the performance in the classroom has gotten better...but frankly improvement there was not difficult given Alfalfa's "dedication" to education. At some point, the loss of revenue will drive a decision, even if he is Burman's guy.
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Is Schroyer's seat heating up?
- Thread starter LawPoke
- Start date
bladerunnr
Well-known member
He did win a game in the mwc tournament last year. So that probably buys him 1 more year after this one. But if we do poorly this year and attendance is bad, he has to be on the hot seat. With perenial doormats like air force, csewe, and tcu, there is no justification for finishing worse than 6th in this league. I'm really looking forward to next wednesday when the sheep come to town. We'll find out where this program is.
calpoke25
Well-known member
I think he obviously gets one more year after this. I want it to work out, but as I was at that game the other night, I couldn't help but notice the lack of enthusiasm from the sparse crowd (granted it was a game over winter break) and I wondered how long we could go like this.
If we really tank in conference the pressure will be really on for 2010-2011.
If we really tank in conference the pressure will be really on for 2010-2011.
The Road said:
This team should at least be as good as last years team, if not better. Schroyer neglected to recruit a single shooter while he spent all of his time bringing in athletes. Well, without at least one shooter, all that athleticism doesn't mean jack shit. We are all seeing that right now. This year is going to be brutal to watch and next year won't be one bit better unless Schroyer is able to sign a couple of solid shooters. That is the only way Schroyer saves himself from the chopping block in my opinion.
These guys may be "young" according to their eligibilty, but most of these guys have plenty of experience and emotional/physical maturity to make this more than just a rebuilding year. A lot of the players on this team have played at a prep school which is essentially like playing at a junior college without losing any eligibility. In fact, I've seen prep schools beat junior colleges on more than one occasion. I'm not buying the argument that this should have been a rebuilding year.
JimmyDimes
Well-known member
It's too bad we can have wiser fans like yourself. We lost a lot of fire power and are trying to build an identity with a lot of inexperienced players. Do you know in each game we lost, we were short a starter. If Afem doesn't go down against DU, we don't lose to Hampton and Monmouth. And, we probably don't lose to DU either. But, what happened happened, so no need to speculate.The Road said:
We are short a couple shooters, but we do have guys that can shoot on the team. Give them time to learn and this team could be good. I predict no worse than a 6th place finish. And, with all the guys we have coming back the next two years, we should only get better.
Now, since these are all Heath's guys, he should be given at least this year and next to show he is taking this program in a positive direction.
Bring on the sheep.
Poke Around
Well-known member
This is the third year. This is basketball. By the third year a coach should be making an impact in basketball. Hell, a year ago the problem was supposedly Ewing wasn't buying into the system and once he left things would be great because we had a whole roster full of players who weren't eligible to play but were working out with the team and would be into the system. Now all of a sudden our team, which is the oldest in Division I in terms of age, is young and inexperienced. The excuses are running thin. We haven't played so poorly since the days of Joby.
Given the mix of thoughts, I would guess he has at least one more year...that could change depending on how we perform in conference play. My frustration is that the product is akin to a game at the YMCA, or worse. If we can't get teams into our style of play, we are in trouble. It will be very interesting to see how we play CSU, which is a team with a little more structure. Either way, I share the sentiment that we need at least two shooters to make this think work. Luster can play a true point and distribute the ball, but he has to have options to distribute the rock to. Otherwise, we'll see a pretty constant helping of zone defenses and a fair bit of frustrating outcomes.
For my part, I'll support Heath, but he'd better get the ship turning away from the iceberg fairly soon - instead of merely rearranging the deckchairs. 4,000 ain't bad for Adams State - but it won't cut it (nor will 6,000) for conference foes. Between the style of play and general program apathy...they have a hell of a hill to climb.
For my part, I'll support Heath, but he'd better get the ship turning away from the iceberg fairly soon - instead of merely rearranging the deckchairs. 4,000 ain't bad for Adams State - but it won't cut it (nor will 6,000) for conference foes. Between the style of play and general program apathy...they have a hell of a hill to climb.
Poke Around
Well-known member
There was closer to 2,500 in the arena on Saturday. the 4,000 is tickets sold, and you will see that virtually all the games have had that attendance, which is lower than I can ever remember at the AA.
I am still trying to figure out why Luster gets so much playing time. He is below average in every aspect of the game.
I am still trying to figure out why Luster gets so much playing time. He is below average in every aspect of the game.
bladerunnr
Well-known member
Poke around,
I agree with every aspect of your last 2 posts. This is the worst bb I've seen since Joby. The apathy towards this program is undeniable. No one expects anything at this point. I read an earlier post that said we lost at home to monmouth and hampton because we were missing a starter! We should beat those teams with our second teams.
Unfortunately, McClain got the ball rolling with all the juco kids. Some pan out, some don't. They aren't here very long and they really don't know or care about Wyo.. I'm sure Schroyer was counting on Manzano to take some of the scoring load. Well, he's gone and we still have Luster. I don't get it. He's small, slow, and can't shoot. He can't shoot well enough to bring the defense out and he's not quick enough to do any damage penetrating. We've heard for a year how good this kid is in practice and what a great passer and team player he is. I question whether he's even a d1 player. We had Linskens in here for 2 years taking up space and contributing nothing. I don't get it. Can we only recruit foreign nationals and transfers? Jackson looks very promising. Let him start. In fact, start Davis, Jackson, Muojeke, Thiam, and Waddell. Let those guys play and see what happens. That's a pretty talented group, imo. Everyone else is there just to give those guys a blow.
I
I agree with every aspect of your last 2 posts. This is the worst bb I've seen since Joby. The apathy towards this program is undeniable. No one expects anything at this point. I read an earlier post that said we lost at home to monmouth and hampton because we were missing a starter! We should beat those teams with our second teams.
Unfortunately, McClain got the ball rolling with all the juco kids. Some pan out, some don't. They aren't here very long and they really don't know or care about Wyo.. I'm sure Schroyer was counting on Manzano to take some of the scoring load. Well, he's gone and we still have Luster. I don't get it. He's small, slow, and can't shoot. He can't shoot well enough to bring the defense out and he's not quick enough to do any damage penetrating. We've heard for a year how good this kid is in practice and what a great passer and team player he is. I question whether he's even a d1 player. We had Linskens in here for 2 years taking up space and contributing nothing. I don't get it. Can we only recruit foreign nationals and transfers? Jackson looks very promising. Let him start. In fact, start Davis, Jackson, Muojeke, Thiam, and Waddell. Let those guys play and see what happens. That's a pretty talented group, imo. Everyone else is there just to give those guys a blow.
I
NowherePoke
Well-known member
bladerunnr said:
Des has been starting the last two games, along with Davis, Muojeke, and Thiam. Technically Sylla has been starting at the 5, but Adam plays more minutes.
I think Luster is suitable as a backup PG for about 10 minutes per game. He hits his free throws, is a solid passer and can get the team into an offense (if we had one to go into that is). He isn't much of a scoring threat, but should be solid for 10 or so minutes per game to give Jackson a break.
I think the roster is close to being competitive in the MWC. I don't believe the coaching is in place to help it reach its potential. JMO.
wyopokesfan23
Well-known member
Luster had ZERO points and fouled out agaisnts Adams. Not exceptable
Dread_Pirate_Cowboy
Well-known member
It was painfully obvious in Shroyers first season he wasn't going to work out. McClain's last team had a winning record. Shroyer had 3 of those starters back plus all the major bench players. Factoring in the bench players time, he had 80% of his court time back from the previous year including the two best guards in the conference. Shroyer's first team tanked bad and he went on and on about being young and losing too many key players, etc.....he had almost the entire team back.
So it was obvious that first season that UW would have to suffer through 3 crappy seasons until Shroyer's contract was small enough to can him and get a winner in. Unfortunately, Shroyer was almost able to put together as good of a team last season as the team that got McClain fired so he got an extension. Burman does not seem to care if we have a decent backetball team because now we have this season and at least two more crappy seasons to come before the contract is small enough to buy out again.
There is no excuse in a third season in basketball to be this horrible. Shroyers first class should be Juniors and in BBall, teams get much greater contributions from Freshmen and Sophmores than Football. If the team is young and inexperienced, that's Shroyer's fault.
I agree that McClain needed to go, but Shroyer is worse....but unfortunately NOT on the hot seat.
So it was obvious that first season that UW would have to suffer through 3 crappy seasons until Shroyer's contract was small enough to can him and get a winner in. Unfortunately, Shroyer was almost able to put together as good of a team last season as the team that got McClain fired so he got an extension. Burman does not seem to care if we have a decent backetball team because now we have this season and at least two more crappy seasons to come before the contract is small enough to buy out again.
There is no excuse in a third season in basketball to be this horrible. Shroyers first class should be Juniors and in BBall, teams get much greater contributions from Freshmen and Sophmores than Football. If the team is young and inexperienced, that's Shroyer's fault.
I agree that McClain needed to go, but Shroyer is worse....but unfortunately NOT on the hot seat.
JimmyDimes
Well-known member
bladerunnr said:
You're blind if you think this is the worst team since Joby. But, that is your opinion. Just like it is my opinion that when your leading scorer goes out and you have only 3 guys left who played last year, things happen. And, I think the team relied so much on Afam, especially early in the season, that they were due for a let down against much lesser competition. Good teams lose to crappy teams....it happens every year. In fact, Loyala Marymount best USC the game before we beat them (I'm pointing out an instance).
This team has players, now it is up the Heath to get them playing as a team. He has at least this year and next IMO to get HIS players to play HIS style of play and to become competitive in conference play. If he doesn't get us there, then he should be gone. Until then, I am on board.
Oh, who cares who and where the players come from. The key is how they play and the jury is still out. Too much hate against Wyoming's coaches sometimes. I do agree about Luster.....Desmar is the guy who can make us a better team.
Dread_Pirate_Cowboy
Well-known member
Shroyer is responsible for every player on the court. Nothing has happened out of the ordinary. Either Shroyer can't coach, can't scout talent, can't manage a team, or can't recruit. If he only has 3 guys back from last year and wants to add that to his long list of excuses, BFD because it is his responsibility to make sure that doesn't happen. Shroyer has yet to put a team on the court as good as McClains worst.
NowherePoke
Well-known member
JimmyDimes said:
This team is much worse than any of Joby's. Even the year he got fired, Joby Wrong went 8-8 in the WAC. It would appear highly unlikely that Heath will reach .500 in the MWC at any point during his career at UW.
I agree that most teams have a loss or two to teams they should beat. But when it is 5 or 6 games, you have to face the fact that isn't an outlier, rather a reflection of where the program really is.
Injuries hurt, but many teams go through injuries. When the Pokes lost Marcus Bailey in his senior season, they still beat all of the OOC cupcakes left on the schedule and went on to finish 3rd in the league. A good team can overcome injuries, even to the best player. This team wasn't able to compete with Hampton and Monmouth with Afam out. That's a very bad sign.
One thing you and I agree on is that it doesn't matter where the players come from. Nothing is more annoying than small minded people that want to see more Wyoming kids. We need to recruit student-athletes that are capable of helping us win and representing the University of Wyoming in a positive manner regardless of where they are from. McClain had a couple of mistakes there (no need to get back into that issue), but Heath hasn't really missed out on any Wyoming talent and I really like the players we do have. I think we have a poor mix on the basketball court (too many players with similar skills, capabilities), but I think they are a great group and I wish they would have the opportunity to be put in a position to succeed by the coaching staff and to experience the support of a raucous AA (which is nothing but a memory now).
It's a dog eat dog world out there and I think Heath is in over his head. There is one other conference team with the same small number of upperclassmen (tied for 3rd fewest in the nation) that is lead by a coach in only his 3rd season at the school....that team is ranked in the Top 20 and looking for their second consecutive MWC regular season title (Steve Alford). Who here really believes that Heath is going to consistently out coach Kruger, Rose, Alford, Fisher, Boylen, and Christian?
McPeachy
Well-known member
Dread_Pirate_Cowboy said:
I agree with everything you said...except THAT ^^^^^^^^^^^^^.
McClain had some gawd awful teams after 2002-3. To the point we lost our fanbase. Not to mention the 100th anniversary game vs. Utah, where Buckymac & his boys failed to score a single point in the first 9+ minutes of the effing game. Oh, and also, the fact that he brought in every ex-cowboy player he could get his hands on, to motivate his team! Huh!?
Remember these records?
2003-4 11-16 4-10
2004-5 15-12 7-7
2005-6 14-18 5-11
2006-7 17-15 7-9
NowherePoke
Well-known member
McPeachy said:
Good point McPeachy. It seems that Schroyer has basically just been a continuation of McClain's final years. If you continue the list of record, it is a very obvious pattern:
07-08 12-17 5-11
08-09 18-12 7-9
09-10 ???? - Likely to be in the 12-19 5-11 kind of range
That is 7 years now of one incredibly crappy year, followed by one mediocre year, and then a return to a crappy year.
I was fully supportive of McClain being fired, but if we weren't going to step up and make a quality hire, then we should have just saved the money so that we could have made a better hire when the time came.
We either went cheap or allowed cronyism to infect our hiring process. Either is disturbing.
We used to have a great home court advantage and it is totally gone now. The destruction of Wyoming BB is even sadder to me than what Moon/Dimel/Koenning did to Football.