Coach Sawvel benches 305

[LanderPoke]

Ha ha nice. Old man strength

https://x.com/7220sports/status/1766141241069117629?s=20

 

[ragtimejoe1]

I was hoping his recruiting class would rank up with the upper end of the MWC, but this is nice, I guess.

 

[307bball]

I was hoping his recruiting class would rank up with the upper end of the MWC, but this is nice, I guess.

What Wyoming recruiting class has ranked the highest in conference at Wyoming ever? (at least in the last 30 or so years)

 

[ragtimejoe1]

I was hoping his recruiting class would rank up with the upper end of the MWC, but this is nice, I guess.

What Wyoming recruiting class has ranked the highest in conference at Wyoming ever? (at least in the last 30 or so years)

You're right...6-8 is kicking ass.

LMFAO.

 

[307bball]

What Wyoming recruiting class has ranked the highest in conference at Wyoming ever? (at least in the last 30 or so years)

You're right...6-8 is kicking ass.

LMFAO.

?? Did I miss something?

I don't follow recruiting as closely as some.... my sense is that Wyoming has never made much noise when it comes to recruiting rankings. I'm asking the HS recruiting heads .... feel free to enlighten me.

 

[ragtimejoe1]

You're right...6-8 is kicking ass.

LMFAO.

?? Did I miss something?

I don't follow recruiting as closely as some.... my sense is that Wyoming has never made much noise when it comes to recruiting rankings. I'm asking the HS recruiting heads .... feel free to enlighten me.

Wyoming has never really competed for the top of the conference so that should not be the hope or expectation.

Wyoming never recruits with the top of the conference so that should not be the hope or expectation.

Big Sky can't come fast enough, lol

 

[307bball]

?? Did I miss something?

I don't follow recruiting as closely as some.... my sense is that Wyoming has never made much noise when it comes to recruiting rankings. I'm asking the HS recruiting heads .... feel free to enlighten me.

Wyoming has never really competed for the top of the conference so that should not be the hope or expectation.

Wyoming never recruits with the top of the conference so that should not be the hope or expectation.

Big Sky can't come fast enough, lol

Unless i'm misreading something...you must be in troll mode this morning. Perhaps somebody else can point me to the information I'm asking about.

 

[ragtimejoe1]

Wyoming has never really competed for the top of the conference so that should not be the hope or expectation.

Wyoming never recruits with the top of the conference so that should not be the hope or expectation.

Big Sky can't come fast enough, lol

Unless i'm misreading something...you must be in troll mode this morning. Perhaps somebody else can point me to the information I'm asking about.

Reread my first post...I was HOPING...

You started trying to define what should be hoped.

 

[307bball]

Unless i'm misreading something...you must be in troll mode this morning. Perhaps somebody else can point me to the information I'm asking about.

Reread my first post...I was HOPING...

You started trying to define what should be hoped.

Just trying to get opinions on the all-time greatest Wyoming recruiting class... What "should" be hoped is not my concern. If you don't know...feel free to say so...I definitely don't know.

Again, my sense is that Wyoming has always been a lower tier recruiting destination, but I really don't follow it closely. That information should be a matter of record .... not some sort of veiled way to make some other point.

BTW...I to HOPE that we have the best recruits in the conference.

 

[OrediggerPoke]

Reread my first post...I was HOPING...

You started trying to define what should be hoped.

Just trying to get opinions on the all-time greatest Wyoming recruiting class... What "should" be hoped is not my concern. If you don't know...feel free to say so...I definitely don't know.

Again, my sense is that Wyoming has always been a lower tier recruiting destination, but I really don't follow it closely. That information should be a matter of record .... not some sort of veiled way to make some other point.

BTW...I to HOPE that we have the best recruits in the conference.

With our NIL payments, we have zero chance of signing the ‘best recruiting class.’ Wyoming will have to rely on the Craig Bohl development model. I’d argue high school recruiting rankings have become relatively meaningless with the portal though. Keeping your good players is probably more important for results.

 

[307bball]

Just trying to get opinions on the all-time greatest Wyoming recruiting class... What "should" be hoped is not my concern. If you don't know...feel free to say so...I definitely don't know.

Again, my sense is that Wyoming has always been a lower tier recruiting destination, but I really don't follow it closely. That information should be a matter of record .... not some sort of veiled way to make some other point.

BTW...I to HOPE that we have the best recruits in the conference.

With our NIL payments, we have zero chance of signing the ‘best recruiting class.’ Wyoming will have to rely on the Craig Bohl development model. I’d argue high school recruiting rankings have become relatively meaningless with the portal though. Keeping your good players is probably more important for results.

That makes sense for the present and near future...what about in the pre-NIL era?...did Wyoming ever have a "blockbuster" class in relation to the conference in football? What years were the best? did they lead to success on the field? maybe this deserves a different thread.

 

[ragtimejoe1]

Just trying to get opinions on the all-time greatest Wyoming recruiting class... What "should" be hoped is not my concern. If you don't know...feel free to say so...I definitely don't know.

Again, my sense is that Wyoming has always been a lower tier recruiting destination, but I really don't follow it closely. That information should be a matter of record .... not some sort of veiled way to make some other point.

BTW...I to HOPE that we have the best recruits in the conference.

With our NIL payments, we have zero chance of signing the ‘best recruiting class.’ Wyoming will have to rely on the Craig Bohl development model. I’d argue high school recruiting rankings have become relatively meaningless with the portal though. Keeping your good players is probably more important for results.

What level of recruiting class do you think is attainable?

 

[307bball]

With our NIL payments, we have zero chance of signing the ‘best recruiting class.’ Wyoming will have to rely on the Craig Bohl development model. I’d argue high school recruiting rankings have become relatively meaningless with the portal though. Keeping your good players is probably more important for results.

What level of recruiting class do you think is attainable?

At this point... Sky is the limit if you have the money.

My earlier question remains unanswered. Where had Wyoming historically ranked in conference recruiting? Is it consistent? I have no idea where to even find this information. If you don't know that is fine.

 

[OrediggerPoke]

With our NIL payments, we have zero chance of signing the ‘best recruiting class.’ Wyoming will have to rely on the Craig Bohl development model. I’d argue high school recruiting rankings have become relatively meaningless with the portal though. Keeping your good players is probably more important for results.

What level of recruiting class do you think is attainable?

Not very good. Better than Air Force, Nevada, SJSU, Hawaii and a few others with low NIL dollars and worse facilities.

But have you ever seen Air Force with a recruiting class
ranked high? I haven’t and they continually put up 9 win seasons. For Wyoming to be successful under current conditions (assuming we don’t get a Phil Knight type), they haven to continue to follow the build and develop through the program model.

 

[OrediggerPoke]

What level of recruiting class do you think is attainable?

At this point... Sky is the limit if you have the money.

My earlier question remains unanswered. Where had Wyoming historically ranked in conference recruiting? Is it consistent? I have no idea where to even find this information. If you don't know that is fine.

Rivals has a database of that information going back about 20 years. I don’t recall Wyoming ever being recognized with a recruiting class that was in the top half of the conference.

 

[ragtimejoe1]

At this point... Sky is the limit if you have the money.

My earlier question remains unanswered. Where had Wyoming historically ranked in conference recruiting? Is it consistent? I have no idea where to even find this information. If you don't know that is fine.

Rivals has a database of that information going back about 20 years. I don’t recall Wyoming ever being recognized with a recruiting class that was in the top half of the conference.

Since we can't elevate, perhaps we'll be fortunate enough on the next round of realignment to be placed with peers in which we can be competitive with the top of the conference. Apparently reduction in competition is the only avenue forward.

 

[307bball]

Rivals has a database of that information going back about 20 years. I don’t recall Wyoming ever being recognized with a recruiting class that was in the top half of the conference.

Since we can't elevate, perhaps we'll be fortunate enough on the next round of realignment to be placed with peers in which we can be competitive with the top of the conference. Apparently reduction in competition is the only avenue forward.

Who knows what will happen in the next 5+ years....but for the non BSU MWC teams...I would say that if you squint real hard, it's been somewhat competitively level. If the theory is that the only thing that matters is program investment...then nobody in the MWC is on Boise's level.

@Oredigger, I looked at Rivals but something is wrong with their site...kept getting errors on anything older than 2 years ago. 247Sports also has those rankings back to 2011 (for the MW). They may not be the same as Rivals but your perception of Wyoming never having a conference top half recruiting class is correct...lots of 7, 8, and 9 rankings with some last places sprinkled in. The top is almost always Boise ... CSU and SDSU are usually pretty high but Wyoming seems to always fit in around UNM, USU, UNLV, AFA, and HAW. Outside of BSU...not sure how much those recruits are helping these programs. I think unless you are recruiting above a certain level (and the vast majority of the MW is not), it comes down more to development and strategy. Maybe you could you sum up the Bohl era with the statement: Great developer of talent...poor to mediocre strategist.

I continue to believe that the gains (in wins, prestige, recruiting, etc) are not linear. I believe programs have to massively up their investment to actually see improvements. It all comes down to what you value I guess. If you desire a slanted playing field where the benefits disproportionately accrue to the powerhouses...then the current system is probably acceptable. I would say that BSU is perfectly fine with their position in the conference cat-bird seat. They are in no hurry to flatten their advantage relative to the rest of the conference. Neither is Alabama or Michigan or any other program that is historically dominant. Wyoming would benefit from clear rules that all of the schools abide by. That has probably historically never happened and it looks like the upper levels of the NCAA are not going to try and create that.

 

[ragtimejoe1]

Since we can't elevate, perhaps we'll be fortunate enough on the next round of realignment to be placed with peers in which we can be competitive with the top of the conference. Apparently reduction in competition is the only avenue forward.

Who knows what will happen in the next 5+ years....but for the non BSU MWC teams...I would say that if you squint real hard, it's been somewhat competitively level. If the theory is that the only thing that matters is program investment...then nobody in the MWC is on Boise's level.

@Oredigger, I looked at Rivals but something is wrong with their site...kept getting errors on anything older than 2 years ago. 247Sports also has those rankings back to 2011 (for the MW). They may not be the same as Rivals but your perception of Wyoming never having a conference top half recruiting class is correct...lots of 7, 8, and 9 rankings with some last places sprinkled in. The top is almost always Boise ... CSU and SDSU are usually pretty high but Wyoming seems to always fit in around UNM, USU, UNLV, AFA, and HAW. Outside of BSU...not sure how much those recruits are helping these programs. I think unless you are recruiting above a certain level (and the vast majority of the MW is not), it comes down more to development and strategy. Maybe you could you sum up the Bohl era with the statement: Great developer of talent...poor to mediocre strategist.

I continue to believe that the gains (in wins, prestige, recruiting, etc) are not linear. I believe programs have to massively up their investment to actually see improvements. It all comes down to what you value I guess. If you desire a slanted playing field where the benefits disproportionately accrue to the powerhouses...then the current system is probably acceptable. I would say that BSU is perfectly fine with their position in the conference cat-bird seat. They are in no hurry to flatten their advantage relative to the rest of the conference. Neither is Alabama or Michigan or any other program that is historically dominant. Wyoming would benefit from clear rules that all of the schools abide by. That has probably historically never happened and it looks like the upper levels of the NCAA are not going to try and create that.

So the ceiling is somewhere around 3rd or 4th place, in your opinion?

 

[307bball]

Who knows what will happen in the next 5+ years....but for the non BSU MWC teams...I would say that if you squint real hard, it's been somewhat competitively level. If the theory is that the only thing that matters is program investment...then nobody in the MWC is on Boise's level.

@Oredigger, I looked at Rivals but something is wrong with their site...kept getting errors on anything older than 2 years ago. 247Sports also has those rankings back to 2011 (for the MW). They may not be the same as Rivals but your perception of Wyoming never having a conference top half recruiting class is correct...lots of 7, 8, and 9 rankings with some last places sprinkled in. The top is almost always Boise ... CSU and SDSU are usually pretty high but Wyoming seems to always fit in around UNM, USU, UNLV, AFA, and HAW. Outside of BSU...not sure how much those recruits are helping these programs. I think unless you are recruiting above a certain level (and the vast majority of the MW is not), it comes down more to development and strategy. Maybe you could you sum up the Bohl era with the statement: Great developer of talent...poor to mediocre strategist.

I continue to believe that the gains (in wins, prestige, recruiting, etc) are not linear. I believe programs have to massively up their investment to actually see improvements. It all comes down to what you value I guess. If you desire a slanted playing field where the benefits disproportionately accrue to the powerhouses...then the current system is probably acceptable. I would say that BSU is perfectly fine with their position in the conference cat-bird seat. They are in no hurry to flatten their advantage relative to the rest of the conference. Neither is Alabama or Michigan or any other program that is historically dominant. Wyoming would benefit from clear rules that all of the schools abide by. That has probably historically never happened and it looks like the upper levels of the NCAA are not going to try and create that.

So the ceiling is somewhere around 3rd or 4th place, in your opinion?

3rd or 4th in recruiting rankings? or overall conference ranking?

In recruiting...I don't know.....I have only recently tried to understand it and how it translates to success. The recruiting rankings out there look to me to be a pretty imperfect indicator of success. In the MWC...BSU seems to always be the best ranked and they get the best results year in and year out. CSU is always in that upper level and they get cruddy results....AFA recruiting is ranked very low consistently but they are one of the more consistent good performing programs. One thing I did note is that the rating people assign a numerical score to each class and the top MW program (generally BSU) is quite ahead of the rest. This means there is a big gap between 1 and 3 or so and then it's pretty flat. I don't know what all that means really. All this to say...I don't know what has held back recruiting in the pre-NIL era.

Looking backward, as far as a competitive ceiling...I think in any given year in the MWC the non-BSU schools have had a somewhat equal shot year in and year out....including Wyoming. Obviously...BSU was the 10,000 lb gorilla in the conference for as long as they have been in it. So I guess I think our single season ceiling is a conference championship. Obviously...that has not happened but it I never really felt like it just was impossible.

What has become to feel impossible at Wyoming is the level of success that BSU sustains over multiple years. Even having a single three year stretch where you win 27 games just has not felt realistic. BSU, SDSU, Fresno, and AFA have done that recently. Why can't we? Probably lots of reasons.

Looking ahead...I have no idea...but it looks dismal. What is the ceiling where, in general, you tend to lose a couple standouts each season? Probably not high. Maybe we can be the best of the non-NIL schools? Is that a thing?