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OC.....

LanderPoke said:
Official statistics don’t say wages in WY are that far off
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Anecdotal evidence will be on both sides...For my situation, there is no difference in compensation between Colorado and Wyoming positions.

One thing that is coming out now that some time has passed since the remote work "boom"....remote workers are less likely to be advanced than workers who are in-situ. So maybe if you are in a terminal position in your industry, come to Wyoming and coast it out but if you are looking to advance, Wyoming might not be a great choice...
 
Vapoke said:
The pay in Wyoming is a joke. I was looking at coming back and there was an IT Project Manager for UW located in Cheyenne but the pay scale was something like 75-90k, which means getting 90k would have been impossible to get.

Having just retired from the military that would have been a significant pay cut to what I was making and I was only a dirty enlisted man. I moved my vehicles over to Virginia and my truck, which cost $150 in Wyoming to register, only cost me $35 in Virginia.
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"Dirty enlisted man?" I served 26 years in the Air Force as a Master Sergeant and never considered myself dirty. I was stationed twice in Virginia and that was probably my worst assignment. Added: Curious to know how did you make that kind of bucks as an enlisted man?
 
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OrediggerPoke said:
Wonder how old the undergraduate student was. Dude is 45. Maybe a spot on Belichick's staff for him?

No allegations that he then drove to the undergraduate student's house and threatened to kill himself in front of her though.
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My daughter will be going to college next year. If she became involved with someone almost as old as me, I'd be upset. That being said, what's the rationale for firing a coach who's involved with an undergraduate? This isn't high school. LSU kicked the gymnast off the team who was involved with the coach.
 
laxwyo said:
My daughter will be going to college next year. If she became involved with someone almost as old as me, I'd be upset. That being said, what's the rationale for firing a coach who's involved with an undergraduate? This isn't high school. LSU kicked the gymnast off the team who was involved with the coach.
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The university probably did not want to pay his buyout so they tried the alcohol scheme as for cause and tried to keep this quiet. But Message Boards and Reddit broke the story open just like the Michigan State board mentioning the drama in Michigan MONTHS AGO.

Most schools have policies in place where the staff cannot dip the pen in company ink; not sure if Ohio does or not
 
laxwyo said:
My daughter will be going to college next year. If she became involved with someone almost as old as me, I'd be upset. That being said, what's the rationale for firing a coach who's involved with an undergraduate? This isn't high school. LSU kicked the gymnast off the team who was involved with the coach.
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Yeah id not want an old dude dating my hypothetical 18 year old daughter
 
307bball said:
I just wanted to address this directly. I'm not looking for even 10 people.... I'm looking for 6 to 8 people. These are professional positions that will have large piles of applicants in urban areas. Our compensation schedule is very competitive with areas that are much higher cost of living. I have seen people, very happy with the position, leave and the reason is always they don't like it here for whatever reason. The successes I have had were when I have found somebody who was from here and wanted to come back.... Unfortunately it's a small pool. I am positive that my experience is very applicable to hiring at all but the highest levels at the university.
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What I'm getting at is that college football is divided into power 4, g6, fcs, then lower. Power 4 jobs almost always trump g6 jobs and g6 jobs almost always trump fcs jobs, etc.

There are about 60 g6 schools and far more candidates or players than positions. A player or coach will almost always choose WYO over fcs and always over d2. It's not really that comparable to private industry
 
ragtimejoe1 said:
What I'm getting at is that college football is divided into power 4, g6, fcs, then lower. Power 4 jobs almost always trump g6 jobs and g6 jobs almost always trump fcs jobs, etc.

There are about 60 g6 schools and far more candidates or players than positions. A player or coach will almost always choose WYO over fcs and always over d2. It's not really that comparable to private industry
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So would you say that the employment issues firms have when trying to hire and retain Wyoming talent have no relevance? If so than I'm not seeing it. It might even be worse in the case of athletics. If my anecdotal experience is true more broadly, then the effect in hiring coaching talent would be that, within whatever category we are, we would consistently be the last choice.... Unless we overpay....

Obviously this is an "all things being equal" analysis.
 
307bball said:
So would you say that the employment issues firms have when trying to hire and retain Wyoming talent have no relevance? If so than I'm not seeing it. It might even be worse in the case of athletics. If my anecdotal experience is true more broadly, then the effect in hiring coaching talent would be that, within whatever category we are, we would consistently be the last choice.... Unless we overpay....

Obviously this is an "all things being equal" analysis.
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If you think we're the last place in g6 that a coach would want to go unless we pay substantially more, then we'll agree to disagree and move on. That's our metric. How enticing is the WYO job vs roughly 60 other g6 programs. If you think WYO is #60 on that list, well, again, we'll have to agree to disagree
 
ragtimejoe1 said:
If you think we're the last place in g6 that a coach would want to go unless we pay substantially more, then we'll agree to disagree and move on. That's our metric. How enticing is the WYO job vs roughly 60 other g6 programs. If you think WYO is #60 on that list, well, again, we'll have to agree to disagree
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I assume that whatever list of schools we are competing for talent with will have some that have a reputation for being good jobs or bad jobs.... Is that what you are talking about?

I didn't think either of us would put Wyoming in first or last on that list.
 
307bball said:
I assume that whatever list of schools we are competing for talent with will have some that have a reputation for being good jobs or bad jobs.... Is that what you are talking about?

I didn't think either of us would put Wyoming in first or last on that list.
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Agreed. We're not first and it's evolving. Nil pool matters and I honestly don't know where we rank in the g6. Wherever we rank in nil is probably pretty close to where we rank in desirability. However, back to the point above, not all g6 will have an opening.

An open position at UW is more desirable than no vacancy at bsu. That's why cfb isn't comparable to industry. It also means that how desirable UW is depends on what else is available.
 
I am not pessimistic about this hire, (I am just sad that evidently Bill "BK" Fosserback's nomination got turned down by the BOT). TIC

In all sincerity, he has seen offenses at all levels including the NFL, and I am sure Josh probably had a word or two to say about him. He will have his work cut out for him in Laramie.

Good Luck Christian!
 
ragtimejoe1 said:
Agreed. We're not first and it's evolving. Nil pool matters and I honestly don't know where we rank in the g6. Wherever we rank in nil is probably pretty close to where we rank in desirability. However, back to the point above, not all g6 will have an opening.

An open position at UW is more desirable than no vacancy at bsu. That's why cfb isn't comparable to industry. It also means that how desirable UW is depends on what else is available.
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"An open position at UW is more desirable than no vacancy at bsu. That's why cfb isn't comparable to industry." Umm..what? If you are looking for a job, including a position as a coordinator or position coach with UW football or as an accountant, an open position is more desireable than no position.....how in the world does that set athletecs aside from other businesses?

Make the pool of programs we are competing with as small as you want to make, I really don't care. The point about labor headwinds rearing thier head for people trying to build something within the borders of Wyoming still stands. Maybe you think i'm trying to excuse past poor performance...i'm really not. I want a level of success in Wyoming athletics that is starting to look like wishful thinking. I'm mostly perplexed at your effort to set aside the task of getting talent at UW and treating it like it's not subject to forces that are well understood. Again...it does not excuse poor performance.

Imagine a hypothetical where the only thing we are measuring is athletic competetive results. The legislature or BOT buys into this idea fully and increases compensation for athletics positions at UW by 80% across the board. What is the effect? We would immediately be considered a destination for a different class of talent. We would get better overnight. Now...that is where I would like UW to be. As long as the "comparable to our peers" crap keeps slipping out of our mouths, we end up right here arguing about marginal labor choices.....and as far as I know, none of us are experts in that.
 
307bball said:
"An open position at UW is more desirable than no vacancy at bsu. That's why cfb isn't comparable to industry." Umm..what? If you are looking for a job, including a position as a coordinator or position coach with UW football or as an accountant, an open position is more desireable than no position.....how in the world does that set athletecs aside from other businesses?

Make the pool of programs we are competing with as small as you want to make, I really don't care. The point about labor headwinds rearing thier head for people trying to build something within the borders of Wyoming still stands. Maybe you think i'm trying to excuse past poor performance...i'm really not. I want a level of success in Wyoming athletics that is starting to look like wishful thinking. I'm mostly perplexed at your effort to set aside the task of getting talent at UW and treating it like it's not subject to forces that are well understood. Again...it does not excuse poor performance.

Imagine a hypothetical where the only thing we are measuring is athletic competetive results. The legislature or BOT buys into this idea fully and increases compensation for athletics positions at UW by 80% across the board. What is the effect? We would immediately be considered a destination for a different class of talent. We would get better overnight. Now...that is where I would like UW to be. As long as the "comparable to our peers" crap keeps slipping out of our mouths, we end up right here arguing about marginal labor choices.....and as far as I know, none of us are experts in that.
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Relative to g6 only, UW headwinds aren't bad or insurmountable. Maybe PBJ hit this one out the park. I honestly don't know. If you think we're greatly disadvantaged relative to 60ish g6 teams, we just disagree.

The p4 comparisons are over. That ship sailed and will never dock again.
 
ragtimejoe1 said:
Relative to g6 only, UW headwinds aren't bad or insurmountable. Maybe PBJ hit this one out the park. I honestly don't know. If you think we're greatly disadvantaged relative to 60ish g6 teams, we just disagree.

The p4 comparisons are over. That ship sailed and will never dock again.
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I think you would be hard pressed to find me making a claim about the magnitude of the "headwind". From my point of view.....I have made the claim that it exists and that I have had personal experience with dealing with it in a professional setting where it mattered. It is obviously surmountable. The EZ button is just to increase compensation. That pretty much defeats it. The other one that is reliable is to grow your own talent. To the extent I find a Wyoming native that is looking to come back, that is much easier to swing...now that is much harder in athletics because Wyoming is not putting out a ton of great coaching or athletic talent...but it's not unheard of.

I think I read between the lines of your comment that you agree that the effect exists...I'm not making much claim about what it takes to defeat it....just that it has to be factored in. If a candidate that UW targets takes a position with a Florida or Texas G6 school that has a similar rep as Wyoming at the same compensation that we had offered..is it crazy to think that if we had upped the money they would come here? What if we were able to really up the money? I would love to be the top dog in coaching/admin pay in athletics in the conference...unfortunately, I think we are stuck with comparing ourselves with what everybody else does.
 
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