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Poke in New England wrote: ↑Fri Apr 07, 2023 9:07 am What qualifies as "interest" these days?

Itsux2beaewe wrote: ↑Mon Apr 10, 2023 6:05 pm

Poke in New England wrote: ↑Fri Apr 07, 2023 9:07 am What qualifies as "interest" these days?

Great question. I have a reliable source tied to a head coach in college basketball who reached out to Ike once he entered the portal. He said his price was $500k. Don’t know what he’ll get, and this is a SEC school, but their interest was short lived.

Wyovanian wrote: ↑Mon Apr 10, 2023 7:04 pm

Itsux2beaewe wrote: ↑Mon Apr 10, 2023 6:05 pm

Great question. I have a reliable source tied to a head coach in college basketball who reached out to Ike once he entered the portal. He said his price was $500k. Don’t know what he’ll get, and this is a SEC school, but their interest was short lived.

My two cents- most of these guys are overestimating their value based on early, and somewhat sensational stories about NIL deals. From an investment standpoint, NIL offers are very poor offering little upside to "big money" sponsors. Collectives are another thing altogether, but that leads to an eggs-in-a-basket scenario. As this goes forward, more likely than not, rather than a financial arms race, this thing is going to cool off as the flow gets ratcheted back based on poor returns and highly unpredictable results. It's a short to medium-term problem for smaller schools. The water will eventually seek its own level...

flyfishwyo wrote: ↑Mon Apr 10, 2023 9:47 pm

Wyovanian wrote: ↑Mon Apr 10, 2023 7:04 pm
My two cents- most of these guys are overestimating their value based on early, and somewhat sensational stories about NIL deals. From an investment standpoint, NIL offers are very poor offering little upside to "big money" sponsors. Collectives are another thing altogether, but that leads to an eggs-in-a-basket scenario. As this goes forward, more likely than not, rather than a financial arms race, this thing is going to cool off as the flow gets ratcheted back based on poor returns and highly unpredictable results. It's a short to medium-term problem for smaller schools. The water will eventually seek its own level...

I think you nailed. Big donors aren't going to want to continue to invest in a pay-for-play system. They already donate a bunch to the school.

Wyovanian wrote: ↑Mon Apr 10, 2023 10:19 pm

flyfishwyo wrote: ↑Mon Apr 10, 2023 9:47 pm

I think you nailed. Big donors aren't going to want to continue to invest in a pay-for-play system. They already donate a bunch to the school.

Unless they start making them sign contracts where they can claw back or withhold payments until performance is proven, the cash will evaporate pretty quickly. Once the athletes realize they're actually sharing the risk, they'll be a lot more deliberative and thoughtful about the whole thing...

LawPoke wrote: ↑Tue Apr 11, 2023 8:54 am

Wyovanian wrote: ↑Mon Apr 10, 2023 10:19 pm
Unless they start making them sign contracts where they can claw back or withhold payments until performance is proven, the cash will evaporate pretty quickly. Once the athletes realize they're actually sharing the risk, they'll be a lot more deliberative and thoughtful about the whole thing...

I hadn't thought of the NIL world through this lens. I think that you are spot on. Once the risk profile shifts, players won't be as enamored with big deals - and the risk will shift. The money is too big. It will certainly provide positive incentives - markets always do. But it will also come with performance demands. For anyone that has been put through a quarterly performance briefing with a board of directors or CEO, when things are going well, the presentation is sunshine, posies and fun and the rewards are great. When they are not, the experience can be akin to a root canal or colonoscopy without the benefit of anesthesia. These young people should look at their coaches and what they go through...it will be similar to the scrutiny and second guessing that they will soon experience. For those on this board and in the Twitterverse that don't like those of us online and elsewhere that "call out individual kids" - buckle up. Things are only now heating up in that space. When you enter the adulting world of investment, returns, and performance - it is a cold, nasty, brutish place. You want to go about adulting...go ahead, buttercup. But don't come crying when things go sideways and the mob comes looking for you.

307bball wrote: ↑Tue Apr 11, 2023 12:26 pm

LawPoke wrote: ↑Tue Apr 11, 2023 8:54 am

I hadn't thought of the NIL world through this lens. I think that you are spot on. Once the risk profile shifts, players won't be as enamored with big deals - and the risk will shift. The money is too big. It will certainly provide positive incentives - markets always do. But it will also come with performance demands. For anyone that has been put through a quarterly performance briefing with a board of directors or CEO, when things are going well, the presentation is sunshine, posies and fun and the rewards are great. When they are not, the experience can be akin to a root canal or colonoscopy without the benefit of anesthesia. These young people should look at their coaches and what they go through...it will be similar to the scrutiny and second guessing that they will soon experience. For those on this board and in the Twitterverse that don't like those of us online and elsewhere that "call out individual kids" - buckle up. Things are only now heating up in that space. When you enter the adulting world of investment, returns, and performance - it is a cold, nasty, brutish place. You want to go about adulting...go ahead, buttercup. But don't come crying when things go sideways and the mob comes looking for you.

This take is interesting but it's not the correct way to look at NIL money and it's affects. NIL will largely not displace money from big donors or program boosters... It takes the place of "suitcase" money. That money never had an ROI. In the past, if you wanted to help get a good recruit to your school there was no legal way to directly enrich the player. Yet that type of enrichment definitely went on. There really is no market force acting on NIL expenditures that would tamp the stuff you are seeing down.

LawPoke wrote: ↑Tue Apr 11, 2023 1:14 pm

307bball wrote: ↑Tue Apr 11, 2023 12:26 pm

This take is interesting but it's not the correct way to look at NIL money and it's affects. NIL will largely not displace money from big donors or program boosters... It takes the place of "suitcase" money. That money never had an ROI. In the past, if you wanted to help get a good recruit to your school there was no legal way to directly enrich the player. Yet that type of enrichment definitely went on. There really is no market force acting on NIL expenditures that would tamp the stuff you are seeing down.

I dunno. At some point, those that are paying these huge NIL contracts are going to expect something in return - and a dinner with the team or ticket to a bowl won't do it. Perhaps the Athletic Departments will feel it first - the coach or whomever said "get me this much money so I can bring in Timmy". Maybe that guy gets questioned about why they wanted Timmy to get cash. But eventually, Timmy himself will start to get pressure. If Timmy is making several mil to start at Florida and is stinking up the joint, Timmy will be under immense pressure to perform or lose his deal.

307bball wrote: ↑Tue Apr 11, 2023 6:24 pm

LawPoke wrote: ↑Tue Apr 11, 2023 1:14 pm

I dunno. At some point, those that are paying these huge NIL contracts are going to expect something in return - and a dinner with the team or ticket to a bowl won't do it. Perhaps the Athletic Departments will feel it first - the coach or whomever said "get me this much money so I can bring in Timmy". Maybe that guy gets questioned about why they wanted Timmy to get cash. But eventually, Timmy himself will start to get pressure. If Timmy is making several mil to start at Florida and is stinking up the joint, Timmy will be under immense pressure to perform or lose his deal.

Well...to the extent the money is coming from the "suitcase" cash crowd I don't think any return will be expected. Those types that are enriching SEC NIL's and Texas NIL's are just happy to be able to funnel money above board.

To the extent that It's an actual entity looking for a spokesperson or something....then yes...Some sort of ROI will be expected. But that ROI is very hard to pin down. Whatever you pay somebody like Lebron James or Steph Curry can almost never be too much...but the vast majority of that money .... not sure how effective it is.

OrediggerPoke wrote: ↑Tue Apr 11, 2023 9:45 pm

307bball wrote: ↑Tue Apr 11, 2023 6:24 pm

Well...to the extent the money is coming from the "suitcase" cash crowd I don't think any return will be expected. Those types that are enriching SEC NIL's and Texas NIL's are just happy to be able to funnel money above board.

To the extent that It's an actual entity looking for a spokesperson or something....then yes...Some sort of ROI will be expected. But that ROI is very hard to pin down. Whatever you pay somebody like Lebron James or Steph Curry can almost never be too much...but the vast majority of that money .... not sure how effective it is.

I don’t buy this. Anyone spending significant money will expect some sort of return. Finish last in the conference in a season of high expectations and well paid players and you will see right away how fast that money spigot gets shut off…

WYO1016 wrote: ↑Wed Apr 12, 2023 8:12 am Tweet from last night:

OrediggerPoke wrote: ↑Wed Apr 12, 2023 8:20 am

WYO1016 wrote: ↑Wed Apr 12, 2023 8:12 am Tweet from last night:

That’s concerning. I hope we don’t just fill the team with bodies and tie up all the schollies. This is a multi-year rebuild.

WYO1016 wrote: ↑Wed Apr 12, 2023 8:26 am

OrediggerPoke wrote: ↑Wed Apr 12, 2023 8:20 am

That’s concerning. I hope we don’t just fill the team with bodies and tie up all the schollies. This is a multi-year rebuild.

I mean, he's trying to fill essentially the entire roster. I tend to believe he's hosting recruits to do just that.

doreno5 wrote: ↑Wed Apr 12, 2023 9:19 am

WYO1016 wrote: ↑Wed Apr 12, 2023 8:26 am

I mean, he's trying to fill essentially the entire roster. I tend to believe he's hosting recruits to do just that.

No use having a press conference until you have all of the slots filled. Players are still shopping themselves to other teams looking for the best offer/ opportunity they can garner. I will curious to see how many players, if any , come from Power 5 conferences v. smaller schools.

LawPoke wrote: ↑Wed Apr 12, 2023 10:14 am

doreno5 wrote: ↑Wed Apr 12, 2023 9:19 am
No use having a press conference until you have all of the slots filled. Players are still shopping themselves to other teams looking for the best offer/ opportunity they can garner. I will curious to see how many players, if any , come from Power 5 conferences v. smaller schools.

Agreed. I hope Linder has adapted to the new realities of being a HC in the transfer and NIL era. He really has no choice.

PokeTransplant wrote: ↑Wed Apr 12, 2023 12:40 pm

LawPoke wrote: ↑Wed Apr 12, 2023 10:14 am

Agreed. I hope Linder has adapted to the new realities of being a HC in the transfer and NIL era. He really has no choice.

Still, it would be refreshing for coach to take this opportunity to "open the kimono" so to speak and take control of the narrative as to what really happened, and his plan going forward. Is he really looking to just grab warm bodies as a stopgap, or is he going to play the long game with regards to re-building the program? I have very low expectations for next year, but would like to at least hear the plan for getting the fans excited for Cowboy basketball again.