COVID-19

Everything Wyoming Cowboy and Mountain West football!
WyoBrandX
A Real Cowboy
Posts: 1779
Joined: Fri Aug 07, 2009 11:01 pm
Location: Laramie, Wyoming

laxwyo wrote:
Thu Apr 16, 2020 5:23 am
fromolwyoming wrote:
Thu Apr 16, 2020 12:23 am
laxwyo wrote:
Wed Apr 15, 2020 9:19 pm
The only thing scary about the virus is our response. Thousands upon thousands of people die from viruses every year. This one had a little surge. We always be wary about infecting other people and use best practices. Open it up.
They are still finding ways this virus is spreading. Through the air, touch, staying on objects up to days at a time, even through people simply walking through areas.

And that's not even touching on the virus rebounding (seemingly coming back out of nowhere in a number of patients).

South Korea is about the only country that really locked this thing down and contained the outbreak (so far). Everyone else has gotten hammered. Yes, the response time sucked, but the rate this virus travels from person to person, that is the scary thing. Even now, China's "shut down" and "only 4,000 dead" is getting tossed out the window with numbers coming in the 10s of thousands. Italy, well, that's no secret. New York is only just flattening out, but its now popping up in other cities like wildfires.

So until a vaccine is created, and herd immunity to this becomes a thing, simply tossing caution to the wind is a good way to get this stuff to make second, third, and forth rounds.
How do those boots taste? Every day they’re learning the infection rate is much higher and that means the hospitalization and death rates are magnitudes lower. But hey we put 20 million out of work to save a few thousand people. We’ve never made that trade before and never should. There’s barely a difference in any country aside from a couple like South Korea. I praise our governor every day for standing up to the wankers at the papers and never ordered a shelter in place.
Governor Gordan has done a great job - we aren't very populated here. What happens in Denver, NYC, and other places compared to to all of Wyoming is completely different. I, for one, am glad I live here during this pandemic.

We spent a hell of alot more for quite a few less in retaliation for 9/11.

This damn COVID-19 virus is something we need to be careful about. We could and should have been prepared for this. The economy could have been running a heck of alot better with some planning ahead of time. In fact, we had some of this planning ahead of time. The government just ignored it until it was too late.

If they had taken measures back in early january to shutdown air traffic, focus on testing, getting PPE in place, etc, we would be living in a much less socially isolated state right now. The government chose not too. Around this time, I realized we might have something big happening here, and I start taking preparations for it.

This virus is nasty - last I heard there was 9 strains of it. I haven't followed the mutations closely - as its getting tough to find good information about it. But there are two things that can happen to increase out death rate, or hospitilization rates, etc.
1.) It spreads easy - so the more people an infected person comes into contact with - the more will get it.
2.) We step back, and realize that number of deaths reported today vs number of cases are lagging by a few weeks. This virus is contagious and deadly.

Take it serious. I stay at home as much as possible - only going out for groceries. Its been a month, my wife hasn't tried to kill me yet. Hell, we bought a bidet a month ago when toilet paper started to look like currency.

We are social critters. We are used to hanging out with other people. Its tough to not hang out with others and make that adjustment. I've cooked at home for a month now (never eating out - which i probably did every day prior).

Regardless, this really does sit on the damn federal government for not doing things sooner. We have 50 governors handling local affairs. We have one president that is supposed to be watching the international stage. He doesn't remember what he said yesterday from what he said today.

Just think about it. Spend some money on testing and research. Instead we are looking for a damn magic bullet. 20 million people without jobs? Stimulus checks for $1200? Unless you make $1m+ then you get a $1.7m stimulus package?

Its all crap. If anyone is curious of my political affiliation - i have none. I'm a registered independent. This isn't a political thing anymore (not republican, democrat, independent, tea party, green party, whatever the [#]f##k). Its a human thing.

Capitalism has done so much to promote lives above the poverty level. Its a great form of economics. We are heading into some ugly times. We need to let people be free and find solutions. Some will be crazy. Some will be stupid. Some will be wrong. Let the smartest rise, figure it out, and persevere.

/End of rant. Sorry.
WyoBrandX
A Real Cowboy
Posts: 1779
Joined: Fri Aug 07, 2009 11:01 pm
Location: Laramie, Wyoming

laxwyo wrote:
Thu Apr 16, 2020 5:23 am
fromolwyoming wrote:
Thu Apr 16, 2020 12:23 am
laxwyo wrote:
Wed Apr 15, 2020 9:19 pm
The only thing scary about the virus is our response. Thousands upon thousands of people die from viruses every year. This one had a little surge. We always be wary about infecting other people and use best practices. Open it up.
They are still finding ways this virus is spreading. Through the air, touch, staying on objects up to days at a time, even through people simply walking through areas.

And that's not even touching on the virus rebounding (seemingly coming back out of nowhere in a number of patients).

South Korea is about the only country that really locked this thing down and contained the outbreak (so far). Everyone else has gotten hammered. Yes, the response time sucked, but the rate this virus travels from person to person, that is the scary thing. Even now, China's "shut down" and "only 4,000 dead" is getting tossed out the window with numbers coming in the 10s of thousands. Italy, well, that's no secret. New York is only just flattening out, but its now popping up in other cities like wildfires.

So until a vaccine is created, and herd immunity to this becomes a thing, simply tossing caution to the wind is a good way to get this stuff to make second, third, and forth rounds.
How do those boots taste? Every day they’re learning the infection rate is much higher and that means the hospitalization and death rates are magnitudes lower. But hey we put 20 million out of work to save a few thousand people. We’ve never made that trade before and never should. There’s barely a difference in any country aside from a couple like South Korea. I praise our governor every day for standing up to the wankers at the papers and never ordered a shelter in place.
I will also say this. I'd rather find me some half assed cabin on the side of the hill that was built 100 years ago - and try to force my life there living off the land than dealing with the [#]sh#t of this virus. It was going to happen. It happened may times over. Does everyone forget that AIDS happened 30 years ago and is still a pandemic? Interesting stat - something like 1% of the population is immune to HIV.
User avatar
'PokeForLife
Ranch Hand
Posts: 374
Joined: Sat Jan 14, 2017 9:40 pm

WyoBrandX wrote:
Thu Apr 16, 2020 4:39 pm

This virus is nasty - last I heard there was 9 strains of it. I haven't followed the mutations closely - as its getting tough to find good information about it.
"To et al performed whole genome testing on the virus from available blood samples of patients with SARS-CoV-2 infection and did not detect any genome mutations. This genomic stability may suggest a chance for the host to retain immunity to the virus.​"

To KKW, Tsang OTY, Leung WS, et al. (2020). ​Temporal profiles of viral load in posterior oropharyngeal saliva samples and serum antibody responses during infection bySARS-CoV-2: an observational cohort study. ​​Lancet Infectious Disease​. (epub). DOI:10.1016/S1473-3099(20)30235-8
WyoBrandX wrote:
Thu Apr 16, 2020 4:39 pm
We are social critters. We are used to hanging out with other people. Its tough to not hang out with others and make that adjustment. I've cooked at home for a month now (never eating out - which i probably did every day prior).
I don't blame you totally. I'd be more cautious too if I ate out every day prior to all this.
WyoBrandX wrote:
Thu Apr 16, 2020 4:39 pm
Regardless, this really does sit on the damn federal government for not doing things sooner. We have 50 governors handling local affairs. We have one president that is supposed to be watching the international stage. He doesn't remember what he said yesterday from what he said today.
?? He was called racist for instituting the travel ban when he did by both the WHO and lawmakers here. Oh and maybe the WHO should acknowledge Taiwan's right to exist and should have sounded the alarm back when Taiwan told them that something weird was going on back in... December? They were too busy cowtowing to China. THAT would have saved lives.
Trump was more aggressive in protecting people than anybody else in the country.
WyoBrandX wrote:
Thu Apr 16, 2020 4:39 pm
20 million people without jobs? Stimulus checks for $1200? Unless you make $1m+ then you get a $1.7m stimulus package?
That's the one thing here that I really don't have any knowledge about. I thought that if you make over $198,000 as a household you don't get anything. What are you referring to?
User avatar
Asmodeanreborn
Bronco-Buster
Posts: 6650
Joined: Thu Sep 24, 2009 3:16 pm

I brought up South Korea in another thread about their response, and somebody said it was easy because they're a small country... but it's actually the other way around. South Korea has like 1,300 people per square mile (52 Million people on 38,691 mi²) - it's the perfect place for the virus to spread insanely fast. Compare that to the less than 100 per square mile of the U.S., where we actually can stay away from each other rather easily. That is, unless you're in New York City.

I think we're going to have to figure out some kind of new normal where we try to get back into the swing of things, while still doing social distancing to some extent. The vaccine won't be here for another year+, and until then, it's probably just going to keep spreading around unless we all stay inside until then. Obviously that's not an option.

This thing sucks for sure... my co-worker who doesn't know whether he had it or not six weeks ago (because he was not eligible for testing) is still having lung problems and had to take today off. This is a (normally) physically active guy who hasn't turned 30 yet.
User avatar
Asmodeanreborn
Bronco-Buster
Posts: 6650
Joined: Thu Sep 24, 2009 3:16 pm

'PokeForLife wrote:
Thu Apr 16, 2020 5:27 pm
?? He was called racist for instituting the travel ban when he did by both the WHO and lawmakers here. Oh and maybe the WHO should acknowledge Taiwan's right to exist and should have sounded the alarm back when Taiwan told them that something weird was going on back in... December? They were too busy cowtowing to China. THAT would have saved lives.
Trump was more aggressive in protecting people than anybody else in the country.t if you make over $198,000 as a household you don't get anything. What are you referring to?
They could definitely have sounded the alarm earlier, as could the laid off U.S. Pandemic team in China had they not been laid off. :P

As far as Trump being more aggressive in protecting people than anybody else in the country, how about no? If anything, his delayed response is likely why several governors held back way longer than they should have. It was frustrating watching a friend of mine who specifically works with immunology trying to influence Polis to shut down Colorado way before he did. The WHO warned the U.S. on January 5, shared the genome of the virus on January 12. That was the same time as South Korea was warned, as mentioned above. South Korea also had their first confirmed case the very same day as the U.S.: January 20.

As for being aggressive:

Jan 22:
“We have it totally under control. … It’s going to be just fine.”

Jan 24:
"China has been working very hard to contain the Coronavirus. The United States greatly appreciates their efforts and transparency. It will all work out well. In particular, on behalf of the American People, I want to thank President Xi!"

Jan 30:
“We think we have it very well under control. We have very little problem in this country at this moment — five. And those people are all recuperating successfully. But we’re working very closely with China and other countries, and we think it’s going to have a very good ending for it. So that I can assure you.”

Feb 10:
"Now, the virus that we’re talking about having to do — you know, a lot of people think that goes away in April with the heat — as the heat comes in. Typically, that will go away in April. We’re in great shape though."

Feb 24:
"The Coronavirus is very much under control in the USA. We are in contact with everyone and all relevant countries. CDC & World Health have been working hard and very smart. Stock Market starting to look very good to me!"

Feb 25:
"Cryin’ Chuck Schumer is complaining, for publicity purposes only, that I should be asking for more money than $2.5 Billion to prepare for Coronavirus. If I asked for more he would say it is too much. He didn’t like my early travel closings. I was right. He is incompetent!"

Feb 26 (the day Pence was appointed head of the COVID-19 task force):
"And again, when you have 15 people, and the 15 within a couple of days is going to be down to close to zero, that’s a pretty good job we’ve done."

Feb 27:
"It’s going to disappear. One day — it’s like a miracle — it will disappear."

Feb 28:
"Now the Democrats are politicizing the coronavirus…they are politicizing it. We did one of the great jobs, you see…this is their new hoax."

Mar 2:
"We had a great meeting today with a lot of the great companies and they’re going to have vaccines, I think relatively soon."

Mar 6:
"Anybody that needs a test, gets a test. They’re there. They have the tests. And the tests are beautiful."

Mar 7:
No, I’m not concerned at all. No, we’ve done a great job with it.

[Holding rallies] doesn’t bother me at all and it doesn’t bother them at all.

Mar 9:
"So last year 37,000 Americans died from the common Flu. It averages between 27,000 and 70,000 per year. Nothing is shut down, life & the economy go on. At this moment there are 546 confirmed cases of CoronaVirus, with 22 deaths. Think about that!"

Mar 10:
"We’re doing a great job with it. And it will go away. Just stay calm. It will go away."

Mar 17:
"I’ve felt it was a pandemic long before it was called a pandemic."



There are certainly other nations that had worse responses than the U.S., and some will likely suffer from it. I can't remember which nation banned talking about it at all... one of the -stan countries in the former Soviet Union block, I believe.
User avatar
'PokeForLife
Ranch Hand
Posts: 374
Joined: Sat Jan 14, 2017 9:40 pm

Asmodeanreborn wrote:
Thu Apr 16, 2020 6:17 pm
'PokeForLife wrote:
Thu Apr 16, 2020 5:27 pm
?? He was called racist for instituting the travel ban when he did by both the WHO and lawmakers here. Oh and maybe the WHO should acknowledge Taiwan's right to exist and should have sounded the alarm back when Taiwan told them that something weird was going on back in... December? They were too busy cowtowing to China. THAT would have saved lives.
Trump was more aggressive in protecting people than anybody else in the country.t if you make over $198,000 as a household you don't get anything. What are you referring to?
They could definitely have sounded the alarm earlier, as could the laid off U.S. Pandemic team in China had they not been laid off. :P

As far as Trump being more aggressive in protecting people than anybody else in the country, how about no? If anything, his delayed response is likely why several governors held back way longer than they should have. It was frustrating watching a friend of mine who specifically works with immunology trying to influence Polis to shut down Colorado way before he did. The WHO warned the U.S. on January 5, shared the genome of the virus on January 12. That was the same time as South Korea was warned, as mentioned above. South Korea also had their first confirmed case the very same day as the U.S.: January 20.

As for being aggressive:

Jan 22:
“We have it totally under control. … It’s going to be just fine.”

Jan 24:
"China has been working very hard to contain the Coronavirus. The United States greatly appreciates their efforts and transparency. It will all work out well. In particular, on behalf of the American People, I want to thank President Xi!"

Jan 30:
“We think we have it very well under control. We have very little problem in this country at this moment — five. And those people are all recuperating successfully. But we’re working very closely with China and other countries, and we think it’s going to have a very good ending for it. So that I can assure you.”

Feb 10:
"Now, the virus that we’re talking about having to do — you know, a lot of people think that goes away in April with the heat — as the heat comes in. Typically, that will go away in April. We’re in great shape though."

Feb 24:
"The Coronavirus is very much under control in the USA. We are in contact with everyone and all relevant countries. CDC & World Health have been working hard and very smart. Stock Market starting to look very good to me!"

Feb 25:
"Cryin’ Chuck Schumer is complaining, for publicity purposes only, that I should be asking for more money than $2.5 Billion to prepare for Coronavirus. If I asked for more he would say it is too much. He didn’t like my early travel closings. I was right. He is incompetent!"

Feb 26 (the day Pence was appointed head of the COVID-19 task force):
"And again, when you have 15 people, and the 15 within a couple of days is going to be down to close to zero, that’s a pretty good job we’ve done."

Feb 27:
"It’s going to disappear. One day — it’s like a miracle — it will disappear."

Feb 28:
"Now the Democrats are politicizing the coronavirus…they are politicizing it. We did one of the great jobs, you see…this is their new hoax."

Mar 2:
"We had a great meeting today with a lot of the great companies and they’re going to have vaccines, I think relatively soon."

Mar 6:
"Anybody that needs a test, gets a test. They’re there. They have the tests. And the tests are beautiful."

Mar 7:
No, I’m not concerned at all. No, we’ve done a great job with it.

[Holding rallies] doesn’t bother me at all and it doesn’t bother them at all.

Mar 9:
"So last year 37,000 Americans died from the common Flu. It averages between 27,000 and 70,000 per year. Nothing is shut down, life & the economy go on. At this moment there are 546 confirmed cases of CoronaVirus, with 22 deaths. Think about that!"

Mar 10:
"We’re doing a great job with it. And it will go away. Just stay calm. It will go away."

Mar 17:
"I’ve felt it was a pandemic long before it was called a pandemic."



There are certainly other nations that had worse responses than the U.S., and some will likely suffer from it. I can't remember which nation banned talking about it at all... one of the -stan countries in the former Soviet Union block, I believe.
Juxtapose these statements with what other people were saying on the same day. Most of the early days in this timeline are filled with people in congress and doctors on both CNN and Fox News saying that we really had nothing to worry about. And that shutting down travel from China and later Europe was xenophobic. That we should be going to chinatown:

“It’s exciting to be here, especially at this time, to be able to be unified with our community. We want to be vigilant about what is out there in other places. We want to be careful about how we deal with it, but we do want to say to people ‘Come to Chinatown, here we are — we're, again, careful, safe — and come join us.'”
-- Nancy Pelosi Feb 24.

I don't think necessarily that COVID was running amok in chinatown at that point any more than it was anywhere else, but her point was that we shouldn't have shut travel from China down. Trump has been trying to keep peoples' spirits up. I just don't think that any person in his situation (can you imagine being in his situation right now?) could possibly have done everything right. I think that almost anyone in leadership would have done almost the same stuff he did -- but they wouldn't have instituted travel bans. That is a huge plus on his part that I don't think any unbiased person could say was bad on his part.

“I’ve said that many times even on this program, you’ve got to watch out because although the risk is low now, you don’t need to change anything you’re doing. When you start to see community spread, this could change and force you to become much more attentive to doing things that would protect you from spread.”
-- Dr. Fauci Feb 29

NOBODY knew what this was going to end up as. We still don't. Based on the research that we had at the time -- the research that the Chinese Communist Party had allowed to be presented -- it was not going to be a huge deal. Fauci himself said the risk was low and that we needed to play things by ear. And that's what happened once we saw that the research out of China was only a part of what was going on, and we came up with aggressive models that overpredicted what the peak was going to be.
User avatar
Asmodeanreborn
Bronco-Buster
Posts: 6650
Joined: Thu Sep 24, 2009 3:16 pm

'PokeForLife wrote:
Thu Apr 16, 2020 6:53 pm
Juxtapose these statements with what other people were saying on the same day. Most of the early days in this timeline are filled with people in congress and doctors on both CNN and Fox News saying that we really had nothing to worry about. And that shutting down travel from China and later Europe was xenophobic. That we should be going to chinatown:

“It’s exciting to be here, especially at this time, to be able to be unified with our community. We want to be vigilant about what is out there in other places. We want to be careful about how we deal with it, but we do want to say to people ‘Come to Chinatown, here we are — we're, again, careful, safe — and come join us.'”
-- Nancy Pelosi Feb 24.

I don't think necessarily that COVID was running amok in chinatown at that point any more than it was anywhere else, but her point was that we shouldn't have shut travel from China down. Trump has been trying to keep peoples' spirits up. I just don't think that any person in his situation (can you imagine being in his situation right now?) could possibly have done everything right. I think that almost anyone in leadership would have done almost the same stuff he did -- but they wouldn't have instituted travel bans. That is a huge plus on his part that I don't think any unbiased person could say was bad on his part.

“I’ve said that many times even on this program, you’ve got to watch out because although the risk is low now, you don’t need to change anything you’re doing. When you start to see community spread, this could change and force you to become much more attentive to doing things that would protect you from spread.”
-- Dr. Fauci Feb 29

NOBODY knew what this was going to end up as. We still don't. Based on the research that we had at the time -- the research that the Chinese Communist Party had allowed to be presented -- it was not going to be a huge deal. Fauci himself said the risk was low and that we needed to play things by ear. And that's what happened once we saw that the research out of China was only a part of what was going on, and we came up with aggressive models that overpredicted what the peak was going to be.
So, I want to see the statements of xenophobia around the travel bans, because my friend's co-workers were begging for testing of anybody who came from China or Italy before Trump closed access for people coming from China.

I asked a friend on Facebook about it too after he made the same statement (that certain Democrats like Ilhan Omar called Trump racist for the Chinese travel ban), and he gave me this:
https://www.washingtonpost.com/immigrat ... story.html

That talks about the travel bans on Muslim countries and restrictions on Mexico, though, and doesn't mention the virus nor China at all. It just happens to have been a week or so before the Chinese travel ban was instituted. I'm curious where somebody called him xenophobic for making the right move.
User avatar
'PokeForLife
Ranch Hand
Posts: 374
Joined: Sat Jan 14, 2017 9:40 pm

Asmodeanreborn wrote:
Thu Apr 16, 2020 7:21 pm

So, I want to see the statements of xenophobia around the travel bans, because my friend's co-workers were begging for testing of anybody who came from China or Italy before Trump closed access for people coming from China.

I asked a friend on Facebook about it too after he made the same statement (that certain Democrats like Ilhan Omar called Trump racist for the Chinese travel ban), and he gave me this:
https://www.washingtonpost.com/immigrat ... story.html

That talks about the travel bans on Muslim countries and restrictions on Mexico, though, and doesn't mention the virus nor China at all. It just happens to have been a week or so before the Chinese travel ban was instituted. I'm curious where somebody called him xenophobic for making the right move.
Biden tweeted: "We are in the midst of a crisis with the coronavirus. We need to lead the way with science — not Donald Trump's record of hysteria, xenophobia, and fear-mongering. He is the worst possible person to lead our country through a global health emergency."
Feb 1, the day after the travel ban.

I imagine different people read these statements differently, but to me it's clear what he's referring to.
User avatar
WestWYOPoke
WyoNation Addict
Posts: 2903
Joined: Fri Sep 26, 2008 9:35 am

'PokeForLife wrote:
Thu Apr 16, 2020 8:27 pm
Asmodeanreborn wrote:
Thu Apr 16, 2020 7:21 pm

So, I want to see the statements of xenophobia around the travel bans, because my friend's co-workers were begging for testing of anybody who came from China or Italy before Trump closed access for people coming from China.

I asked a friend on Facebook about it too after he made the same statement (that certain Democrats like Ilhan Omar called Trump racist for the Chinese travel ban), and he gave me this:
https://www.washingtonpost.com/immigrat ... story.html

That talks about the travel bans on Muslim countries and restrictions on Mexico, though, and doesn't mention the virus nor China at all. It just happens to have been a week or so before the Chinese travel ban was instituted. I'm curious where somebody called him xenophobic for making the right move.
Biden tweeted: "We are in the midst of a crisis with the coronavirus. We need to lead the way with science — not Donald Trump's record of hysteria, xenophobia, and fear-mongering. He is the worst possible person to lead our country through a global health emergency."
Feb 1, the day after the travel ban.

I imagine different people read these statements differently, but to me it's clear what he's referring to.
I take it as Biden referencing the President's long, well- documented history of being a hysterical, xenophobic, fear monger. Doesn't have to have anything to do with the travel ban, he's got 3 years worth of evidence to make that statement.
Image
User avatar
laxwyo
Bronco-Buster
Posts: 7382
Joined: Sat Jan 23, 2010 10:27 am
Location: Rock Springs, WY

WestWYOPoke wrote:
Fri Apr 17, 2020 2:26 am
'PokeForLife wrote:
Thu Apr 16, 2020 8:27 pm
Asmodeanreborn wrote:
Thu Apr 16, 2020 7:21 pm

So, I want to see the statements of xenophobia around the travel bans, because my friend's co-workers were begging for testing of anybody who came from China or Italy before Trump closed access for people coming from China.

I asked a friend on Facebook about it too after he made the same statement (that certain Democrats like Ilhan Omar called Trump racist for the Chinese travel ban), and he gave me this:
https://www.washingtonpost.com/immigrat ... story.html

That talks about the travel bans on Muslim countries and restrictions on Mexico, though, and doesn't mention the virus nor China at all. It just happens to have been a week or so before the Chinese travel ban was instituted. I'm curious where somebody called him xenophobic for making the right move.
Biden tweeted: "We are in the midst of a crisis with the coronavirus. We need to lead the way with science — not Donald Trump's record of hysteria, xenophobia, and fear-mongering. He is the worst possible person to lead our country through a global health emergency."
Feb 1, the day after the travel ban.

I imagine different people read these statements differently, but to me it's clear what he's referring to.
I take it as Biden referencing the President's long, well- documented history of being a hysterical, xenophobic, fear monger. Doesn't have to have anything to do with the travel ban, he's got 3 years worth of evidence to make that statement.
Lol ok bud.
W-Y, Until I Die!
User avatar
'PokeForLife
Ranch Hand
Posts: 374
Joined: Sat Jan 14, 2017 9:40 pm

laxwyo wrote:
Fri Apr 17, 2020 5:12 am
WestWYOPoke wrote:
Fri Apr 17, 2020 2:26 am
'PokeForLife wrote:
Thu Apr 16, 2020 8:27 pm
Asmodeanreborn wrote:
Thu Apr 16, 2020 7:21 pm

So, I want to see the statements of xenophobia around the travel bans, because my friend's co-workers were begging for testing of anybody who came from China or Italy before Trump closed access for people coming from China.

I asked a friend on Facebook about it too after he made the same statement (that certain Democrats like Ilhan Omar called Trump racist for the Chinese travel ban), and he gave me this:
https://www.washingtonpost.com/immigrat ... story.html

That talks about the travel bans on Muslim countries and restrictions on Mexico, though, and doesn't mention the virus nor China at all. It just happens to have been a week or so before the Chinese travel ban was instituted. I'm curious where somebody called him xenophobic for making the right move.
Biden tweeted: "We are in the midst of a crisis with the coronavirus. We need to lead the way with science — not Donald Trump's record of hysteria, xenophobia, and fear-mongering. He is the worst possible person to lead our country through a global health emergency."
Feb 1, the day after the travel ban.

I imagine different people read these statements differently, but to me it's clear what he's referring to.
I take it as Biden referencing the President's long, well- documented history of being a hysterical, xenophobic, fear monger. Doesn't have to have anything to do with the travel ban, he's got 3 years worth of evidence to make that statement.
Lol ok bud.
Timing, timing.
bladerunnr
A Real Cowboy
Posts: 1466
Joined: Sat Sep 27, 2008 7:45 pm

WestWYOPoke wrote:
Fri Apr 17, 2020 2:26 am
'PokeForLife wrote:
Thu Apr 16, 2020 8:27 pm
Asmodeanreborn wrote:
Thu Apr 16, 2020 7:21 pm

So, I want to see the statements of xenophobia around the travel bans, because my friend's co-workers were begging for testing of anybody who came from China or Italy before Trump closed access for people coming from China.

I asked a friend on Facebook about it too after he made the same statement (that certain Democrats like Ilhan Omar called Trump racist for the Chinese travel ban), and he gave me this:
https://www.washingtonpost.com/immigrat ... story.html

That talks about the travel bans on Muslim countries and restrictions on Mexico, though, and doesn't mention the virus nor China at all. It just happens to have been a week or so before the Chinese travel ban was instituted. I'm curious where somebody called him xenophobic for making the right move.
Biden tweeted: "We are in the midst of a crisis with the coronavirus. We need to lead the way with science — not Donald Trump's record of hysteria, xenophobia, and fear-mongering. He is the worst possible person to lead our country through a global health emergency."
Feb 1, the day after the travel ban.

I imagine different people read these statements differently, but to me it's clear what he's referring to.
I take it as Biden referencing the President's long, well- documented history of being a hysterical, xenophobic, fear monger. Doesn't have to have anything to do with the travel ban, he's got 3 years worth of evidence to make that statement.
I'm so sick of this liberal one way nonsense. Joe Biden in 2008 talking to a black audience "they're going to put you back in chains" (referring to Mitt Romney). So don't give me this Sh#t about Trump. Democrats have been calling republicans nazis and racists and war criminals long before Trump came along. And yes, Biden was against the travel ban. He specifically stated it.
User avatar
Asmodeanreborn
Bronco-Buster
Posts: 6650
Joined: Thu Sep 24, 2009 3:16 pm

To be fair, it's not like the Republican party doesn't have a significant number of openly racist supporters, and even a few elected officials in Congress. Steve King (Iowa) comes to mind.

On the other hand, I don't think Trump personally is racist- I don't think he cares enough about race as an issue at all. Him refusing to condemn people like Spencer has more to do with pragmatism and not alienating a small but very passionate portion of his supporters.


Biden... Biden being the Democratic candidate disappoints me almost as much as Trump getting there on the Republican ticket when there were several well qualified candidates who couldn't gather enough support because they were boring. Now, Biden is about as boring as they come, but he's not exactly an amazing candidate. But apparently you either have to have impossible ideas while not even considering compromise like Bernie, or be a boring center-right establishment candidate like Biden to have a chance.

Another argument for the two party system being a dumb idea, I guess? Then again, the real problem would be that it's easy to sway people one way or the other if you just talk big. Rational thought and facts need not apply.
User avatar
LanderPoke
Bronco-Buster
Posts: 7207
Joined: Sat Sep 13, 2014 8:47 pm
Location: Laramie

laxwyo wrote:
Wed Apr 15, 2020 9:19 pm
The only thing scary about the virus is our response. Thousands upon thousands of people die from viruses every year. This one had a little surge. We always be wary about infecting other people and use best practices. Open it up.
+1
User avatar
LanderPoke
Bronco-Buster
Posts: 7207
Joined: Sat Sep 13, 2014 8:47 pm
Location: Laramie

Saw this on Mark Levin's twitter

https://www.medrxiv.org/content/10.1101 ... 20062463v1

https://www.medrxiv.org/content/10.1101 ... 1.full.pdf


"We can use our prevalence estimates to approximate the infection fatality rate from COVID-19 in Santa Clara County. As of April 10, 2020, 50 people have died of COVID-19 in the County, with an average increase of 6% daily in the number of deaths. If our estimates of48,000-81,000 infections represent the cumulative total on April 1, and we project deaths to April 22 (a 3 week lag from time of infection to death22), we estimate about 100 deaths in the county. A hundred deaths out of 48,000-81,000 infections corresponds to an infection fatality rate of 0.12-0.2%."

This is not all that high
User avatar
Asmodeanreborn
Bronco-Buster
Posts: 6650
Joined: Thu Sep 24, 2009 3:16 pm

LanderPoke wrote:
Fri Apr 17, 2020 4:11 pm
Saw this on Mark Levin's twitter

https://www.medrxiv.org/content/10.1101 ... 20062463v1

https://www.medrxiv.org/content/10.1101 ... 1.full.pdf


"We can use our prevalence estimates to approximate the infection fatality rate from COVID-19 in Santa Clara County. As of April 10, 2020, 50 people have died of COVID-19 in the County, with an average increase of 6% daily in the number of deaths. If our estimates of48,000-81,000 infections represent the cumulative total on April 1, and we project deaths to April 22 (a 3 week lag from time of infection to death22), we estimate about 100 deaths in the county. A hundred deaths out of 48,000-81,000 infections corresponds to an infection fatality rate of 0.12-0.2%."

This is not all that high
Aside from the methodology, the study hasn't even seen peer review yet. If you look at the numbers for NYC, they've hit almost 9,000 deaths with 128,000 cases. Now, obviously the ACTUAL number of cases is way higher than that. However, NYC has 8,000,000 people. There's already 9,000 dead. That's 0.1125% if you assume every single New Yorker has been infected.

Obviously that will keep going up every day as we see more deaths.

In other words, 0.12-0.2% is going to get blown out of the water.
User avatar
kdwrightuwyo
A Real Cowboy
Posts: 1577
Joined: Mon Aug 30, 2010 10:33 pm

I've read that the CDC guidance to the medical community is going to artificially inflate our death counts. The guidance is to put COVID-19 on the death certificate if the recently deceased MAY have had the virus...regardless if it was the COD. Basically, if someone got into a car accident and died, but had a cough and runny nose, COVID is being put on the death certificate...not necessarily as the primary COD, but on the cert. And the death poll numbers are being pulled from the processed death certificates...thus inflating the numbers. I don't know by HOW MUCH...but even attributing a couple of non-related deaths adds up.
User avatar
LanderPoke
Bronco-Buster
Posts: 7207
Joined: Sat Sep 13, 2014 8:47 pm
Location: Laramie

Asmodeanreborn wrote:
Fri Apr 17, 2020 9:41 pm
LanderPoke wrote:
Fri Apr 17, 2020 4:11 pm
Saw this on Mark Levin's twitter

https://www.medrxiv.org/content/10.1101 ... 20062463v1

https://www.medrxiv.org/content/10.1101 ... 1.full.pdf


"We can use our prevalence estimates to approximate the infection fatality rate from COVID-19 in Santa Clara County. As of April 10, 2020, 50 people have died of COVID-19 in the County, with an average increase of 6% daily in the number of deaths. If our estimates of48,000-81,000 infections represent the cumulative total on April 1, and we project deaths to April 22 (a 3 week lag from time of infection to death22), we estimate about 100 deaths in the county. A hundred deaths out of 48,000-81,000 infections corresponds to an infection fatality rate of 0.12-0.2%."

This is not all that high
Aside from the methodology, the study hasn't even seen peer review yet. If you look at the numbers for NYC, they've hit almost 9,000 deaths with 128,000 cases. Now, obviously the ACTUAL number of cases is way higher than that. However, NYC has 8,000,000 people. There's already 9,000 dead. That's 0.1125% if you assume every single New Yorker has been infected.

Obviously that will keep going up every day as we see more deaths.

In other words, 0.12-0.2% is going to get blown out of the water.
Not for the entire nation outside of NY
User avatar
Asmodeanreborn
Bronco-Buster
Posts: 6650
Joined: Thu Sep 24, 2009 3:16 pm

LanderPoke wrote:
Fri Apr 17, 2020 10:19 pm
Not for the entire nation outside of NY
What makes the rest of us physically different from New Yorkers? The study tried estimating a fatality rate - if we see a higher rate than that for a known population (that's also an order of magnitude larger than their sample size), wouldn't that suggest the study's poorly done?
bladerunnr
A Real Cowboy
Posts: 1466
Joined: Sat Sep 27, 2008 7:45 pm

Asmodeanreborn wrote:
Fri Apr 17, 2020 10:44 pm
LanderPoke wrote:
Fri Apr 17, 2020 10:19 pm
Not for the entire nation outside of NY
What makes the rest of us physically different from New Yorkers? The study tried estimating a fatality rate - if we see a higher rate than that for a known population (that's also an order of magnitude larger than their sample size), wouldn't that suggest the study's poorly done?
New York has high minority population. The rates of obesity, hypertension, and diabetes are far greater in the minority community. The vast majority of fatalities are elderly and or have other major health issues. The New York subway system is now believed to be the reason for the high incidence of positive tests..
Post Reply